"And sometimes, dispassionately, they had to weed."
Babylon 5
- Thread starter Kail
- Start date
Had he known about the method of divided differences, Su Song might have been the man to build the Chinese version of the difference engine. Whether he would have had a go at an analytic engine for general-purpose computation would require an additional conceptual step in the absence of a precursor for providing data and programming control such as the punched cards of the Jacquard loom. (Although were someone to tell me that the Chinese had created programmable mechanical looms for silk weaving, I wouldn't be surprised. I just haven't heard about it.) The lack of ability to create machined parts with suitable tolerances would likely have been an insurmountable hurdle.
The episode Severed Dreams had some interesting casting.
One that Trek could emulate is the casting of Kim Miyori as captain of the Earth Force vessel Churchill.
Because of a scheduling conflict, Robert Foxworth was unavailable to reprise the character of General Hague, instead playing Admiral Leyton (DS9).
An alternative character was written in, Major Ed Ryan. JMS asked that that "McGill" guy be cast, referring to actor Everette McGill. A miscommunication, another actor showed up instead, Bruce McGill. Which worked out very well.
One that Trek could emulate is the casting of Kim Miyori as captain of the Earth Force vessel Churchill.
Because of a scheduling conflict, Robert Foxworth was unavailable to reprise the character of General Hague, instead playing Admiral Leyton (DS9).
An alternative character was written in, Major Ed Ryan. JMS asked that that "McGill" guy be cast, referring to actor Everette McGill. A miscommunication, another actor showed up instead, Bruce McGill. Which worked out very well.
Everett McGill
I'd say that Trek was always pretty good when it came to race & gender diversity in casting supporting & guest roles. Indeed, going all the way back to the original pilot with the 'Number One' character that GR had to loose in order to keep Spock for the second pilot.
Still, for it's time having an African woman, an Asian man and a person with a Russian accent in positions of authority (and none were particularly stereotypical) was all extremely progressive.
In TNG onwards it seemed like at least half of the Starfleet Admirals that appeared were either female or non-Caucasian. Also quite impressive for it's time and B5 mostly did the same, though more with the EA captains. IIRC most (but by no means *all*) of the Generals were older white guys.
What B5 seemed to do differently in this regard was a bit more subtle and generally not the sort of thing you'd notice unless you paid *really* close attention. That was to add a certain randomness to what surname some of the background characters were assigned, often leading to some very unexpected combinations (e.g. an asian person with a jewish surname, an african person with a native american name etc.)
The idea being IIRC that in a couple centuries, the old cultural barriers aren't going to mean as much, particularly if a given individual is descended from colonists, which may start with a small-ish population wither very diverse ancestry. After a couple generation of intermarrying, the above combinations may be downright common in say, Marsborn citizens.
Still, for it's time having an African woman, an Asian man and a person with a Russian accent in positions of authority (and none were particularly stereotypical) was all extremely progressive.
In TNG onwards it seemed like at least half of the Starfleet Admirals that appeared were either female or non-Caucasian. Also quite impressive for it's time and B5 mostly did the same, though more with the EA captains. IIRC most (but by no means *all*) of the Generals were older white guys.
What B5 seemed to do differently in this regard was a bit more subtle and generally not the sort of thing you'd notice unless you paid *really* close attention. That was to add a certain randomness to what surname some of the background characters were assigned, often leading to some very unexpected combinations (e.g. an asian person with a jewish surname, an african person with a native american name etc.)
The idea being IIRC that in a couple centuries, the old cultural barriers aren't going to mean as much, particularly if a given individual is descended from colonists, which may start with a small-ish population wither very diverse ancestry. After a couple generation of intermarrying, the above combinations may be downright common in say, Marsborn citizens.
Last edited:
I think that the Narns were basically making Khyber Pass Copies of Centauri technology.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khyber_Pass_Copy
Is there any realistic possibility of making Khyber Pass copies of tech that you don't understand?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khyber_Pass_Copy
Is there any realistic possibility of making Khyber Pass copies of tech that you don't understand?
Most politicians don't understand any technology they use from coffee machines up.
G'Kar pretty much said as much when he sold weapons to Earth. One assumes that they had enough of a grasp of the basics to be able to reverse-engineer and reproduce the more complicated stuff. Thought the Centauri claim that the Narns were a "barbaric people" barely out of the stone age when they showed up, there's reason to suspect that this may not have been the case.
For one, the Centauri are well known for blatantly bullshitting when it suits their needs (indeed, the way Londo writes reports, it's practically policy.) Secondly, the very first episode of B5 deals with a dispute over a colony which the Narn claim was their's *prior* to the Centauri occupation. They could hardly have been "primitives" if they already had established a colony in another star system. At the very least they would have had to have been able to break orbit, discover and activate their local jumpgate then navigate to the nearest beacon. At the very least they were probably more or less on-par with the technology we have now, maybe even a little ahead.
Also consider that it's unlikely that the Centauri used the Narns exclusively as agricultural and domestic slaves. Which would mean they also probably used them as industrial slaves, doing the very dangerous and skilled work in munitions factories and orbital construction yards. So when the Centauri pulled out, there was a pre-existing workforce with experience and at least a vague grasp of what they were doing.
I doubt the Narn were a bunch of bumpkins. They knew what they were doing. The Narn's whole point was 1) to make money from selling weapons to Earth, and 2) to deflect blame - if there was any Minbari retribution, it'd be against the Centauri and not them. So any copied Centauri tech made by the Narn would likely be as authentic as the Narn could make it.
Earth's situation was a perfect opportunity for the Narn to stick it to the Centauri even more. If the Minbari found out those weapons were fake, they'd come after the Narn. So the Narn wouldn't be cheap about it.
Earth's situation was a perfect opportunity for the Narn to stick it to the Centauri even more. If the Minbari found out those weapons were fake, they'd come after the Narn. So the Narn wouldn't be cheap about it.
One could certainly make that argument, but the way the Centauri tell it, they seem to mean it quite literally.
But as I said, they're pretty well known for out-and-out fabrication if it suits them. Half the time they may even choose to believe it themselves. Remember that bit about them trying to convince Earth that they're a lost Centauri colony? The result of a clerical error you say? Yeah, sure Londo. Whatevs.
Or Londo's rewrites of Vir's reports, that was creative reassessment.One could certainly make that argument, but the way the Centauri tell it, they seem to mean it quite literally.
But as I said, they're pretty well known for out-and-out fabrication if it suits them. Half the time they may even choose to believe it themselves. Remember that bit about them trying to convince Earth that they're a lost Centauri colony? The result of a clerical error you say? Yeah, sure Londo. Whatevs.
You know I used to think the same thing, but considering I,Spy had an African American lead a year before Star Trek made it to the air, I've downgraded Trek to just "progressive". "Extremely progressive" would've been an African American, Asian or female in one of the lead roles. Still, not too shabby, but they weren't the trailblazer that I,Spy was.
H. Beam Piper was doing this in the 60's in his Terro-Human Future History stories, where you'd have names like Carlos von Shlichten and Hideyoshi O'Leary. The language being described as English-Spanish-Afrikaans-Portuguese in one era.
One of the finest shows. Love B5, and it had some iconic episodes. I loved the little side episodes like the one about the two workers on the station and what they did in a day, no main characters stealing the screen time, but you saw things from the POV of these two workers who were just mundane nobodies. I can't for the life of me remember the episode title, but it was good.
Zathras was one of my favourite characters.
Zathras was one of my favourite characters.
"A View from the Gallery"
The thing about fandom is that there are usually differing opinions depending on one's race, gender, sequel orientation, or demographic.
It's interesting because one of the things that turned me off TNG was the lack of diversity that changed after it's first season. Not too mention the way they handled LaForge.
Yeah, sure, the Admirals that showed up every now and then were usually non-white...and old. Still, they were unmemorable guests...not leads.
For example, what if Picard was a dark-skinned individual who was still an Franco-Brit who had a relationship with the attractive Beverly Crusher, still portrayed by Gates McFadden?
While admirable in giving us our first female lead, VOY still had a questionable female captain with an Asian ensign who was usually whiny.
ENT had background of extras that was mainly white, with a token black helmsman and an attractive Asian female communications officer that was usually paired or grouped with the white leads, particularly the white male leads.
While there were certain issues with TOS, looking at the show from a 21st century lens, it had some progressive stuff with having Sulu (sans any stereotypical accent) on the bridge as well as a black woman (who was looked at as eye candy and also seen as tech savvy)...as well as a Russian...Scot...all together exploring space.
Of course, TOS tried to have a female lead initially but the politics behind that decision didn't allow that for very long.
Was she the commander that went down with her ship in the same episode she was introduced?
In another universe, Yaphet Kotto would've been Captain Julian (later Jean-Luc) Picard. He was after all on the short list for the role.
That's the one I loved it.
Similar threads
