Star Trek Continues, Episode 4 - "The White Iris"
- Thread starter BoredShipCapt'n
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It took me a little bit to recognize it, but once I did, the changing wigs made sense in the context of the story. I thought it worked rather well.
Maybe I don't see enough of these fan films (and in my view that's not a bad thing), but I'm not seeing other productions put under the same microscope as STC.
That just tells me that Vic and Co. are doing a bang-up job. As if I didn't already know that.
Oh, we at Phase II get plenty of that kind of scrutiny and are put under the same magnifying glass--and we have been for almost twice as long as STC.
Here's our most recently-released effort:
I know this thread is about White Iris, which has quickly become one of my favorite Trek films ever. But while Greg Schnitzer is here... Read "Mind Sifter" back in 1976 when original Trek fiction was much more scarce and loved it. The chance to see it made almost 40 years later and so well was an incredible treat. I'm a huge STC fan, but this episode was right on the money. Had to ask though, why was Chekov replaced by Walking Bear, and why is there another Vulcan on the bridge? Thanks!
Consider how far resources have come in fifty years. Today a group of dedicated fans can film an episode that can stand (production wise) with what could be done only by a professional studio back in the day.
I don't think STC could be criticized anymore than TOS in terms of production. The key difference is the number of people on hand for STC and that they're working for free. So they have only a limited amount of time to devote to each production. On the flip side they can finesse to their hearts' content because they aren't on the same kind of deadlines as a professional television studio having to crank out twenty-two episodes in a season.
All that considered then STC isn't making any more gaffes than TOS and in some respects they can surpass TOS particularly in terms of f/x. A competent person or few persons with a good computer or two and good software can crank out nice f/x with greater ease than what TOS could manage. Yeah, there can be a trade-off in some areas, but overall STC has a better chance for consistency than TOS had which needed more than one f/x house to get the work done.
When we get into the creative side then it's another trade-off. STC (and other fan productions) aren't able to utilize A-list actors and writing talent. These folks may work in the industry and have a professional background (and no disrespect intended), but they're not long established pros such as TOS employed. When no one is getting paid there's going to be a limit to who you can get. So when we consider this aspect then the STC folks should be cut some slack.
Now constructive criticism can push people to aim higher and better themselves and consequently their resilts.
If STC seems to be getting an unfair or more than usual amount of critique in certain areas then it could well be because they've done so well so far.
Speaking for myself I wish to reiterate that any criticism on my part is meant in terms what I thought worked or didn't work as well as I perceive it. "The White Iris" is a good production and my criticisms are based mainly on chouce of story and how that story was told.
Put that in context with criticisms I could make (and have made) regarding episodes of TOS which I'd rather they hadn't done or had done differently.
I don't think STC could be criticized anymore than TOS in terms of production. The key difference is the number of people on hand for STC and that they're working for free. So they have only a limited amount of time to devote to each production. On the flip side they can finesse to their hearts' content because they aren't on the same kind of deadlines as a professional television studio having to crank out twenty-two episodes in a season.
All that considered then STC isn't making any more gaffes than TOS and in some respects they can surpass TOS particularly in terms of f/x. A competent person or few persons with a good computer or two and good software can crank out nice f/x with greater ease than what TOS could manage. Yeah, there can be a trade-off in some areas, but overall STC has a better chance for consistency than TOS had which needed more than one f/x house to get the work done.
When we get into the creative side then it's another trade-off. STC (and other fan productions) aren't able to utilize A-list actors and writing talent. These folks may work in the industry and have a professional background (and no disrespect intended), but they're not long established pros such as TOS employed. When no one is getting paid there's going to be a limit to who you can get. So when we consider this aspect then the STC folks should be cut some slack.
Now constructive criticism can push people to aim higher and better themselves and consequently their resilts.
If STC seems to be getting an unfair or more than usual amount of critique in certain areas then it could well be because they've done so well so far.
Speaking for myself I wish to reiterate that any criticism on my part is meant in terms what I thought worked or didn't work as well as I perceive it. "The White Iris" is a good production and my criticisms are based mainly on chouce of story and how that story was told.
Put that in context with criticisms I could make (and have made) regarding episodes of TOS which I'd rather they hadn't done or had done differently.
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I think the interesting thing for me is that neither PII/NV nor STC really provide what I consider a "pure" TOS experience, as both draw heavily on sources that did not exist when the original series aired. What I like the most is that they each draw from different sources.
I think it would be impossible to get a pure TOS experience with a modern production simply because not only has so much changed in terms of resources and the fact the production staff and cast are completely different from fifty years ago, but also because perspectives as a whole have changed. It would be very difficult to get out of our contemporary mindsets and this includes how we presently use language in writing as well as speech.
Even so you can still get a respectable TOS vibe with a modern production. STC is showing us that and I found the same thing with certain TNG episodes particularly from the earlier seasons.
Even so you can still get a respectable TOS vibe with a modern production. STC is showing us that and I found the same thing with certain TNG episodes particularly from the earlier seasons.
Very true..
Any observations/criticisms I gave were in good nature, I look forward to Episode 5 and hope that I will see something better and improved.
Myself I prefer STNV/PII, mainly because I saw that from the start and I prefer the style. Not knocking STC, but it doesn't grab me in the same way.
Any observations/criticisms I gave were in good nature, I look forward to Episode 5 and hope that I will see something better and improved.
Myself I prefer STNV/PII, mainly because I saw that from the start and I prefer the style. Not knocking STC, but it doesn't grab me in the same way.
I enjoyed it. It had the same flavor as 3rd season melodramas like "The Paradise Syndrome", "Requiem For Methuselah" or "Is There In Truth No Beauty?". Yeah, those episodes usually aren't ranked as the best of Trek but dang it, I like them. And I liked this. Great performances from everyone involved.
Criticism is a good thing, but needs to be delivered in a tactful way. Some things boil down to personal taste, it either will appeal to you or not, and if that's your main problem just leave it at that. Not "it sucked", but rather "didn't appeal to me". With fan-films I do try to overlook things like acting, since I know that it's not always possible to get professionals for the role, hopefully they at least can read the lines reasonably and not detract with pure badness.
This one worked for me, but I can completely see where it wouldn't for many people. Story is atypical of TOS in the way it looks at Kirk. It's not "wrong" by our standards but a bit odd if this is supposed to be something from a hypothetical season 4. If you are looking for a pure "TOS Experience" then yes, it's not quite that. If you don't agree with the premise, then the details don't really matter.
I do have some other quibbles with it. I mentioned before the "hitting on the head" thing seemed off, a strange weapon would be better. McCoy also seemed uncharacteristically resigned to the situation, too passive. In the "why-didn't-they-use-the-shuttlecraft- -in-The-Enemy-Within" vein, I wondered why Spock didn't try a meld sooner than his quick "Ghost Meld" to see what was wrong with Kirk. We flashback to Requiem which reinforces that Spock by now is not so reserved to melding. It might have been interesting to see some of Kirk's close male friends that he had some association with their demise, like Gary Mitchell, Capt. Garrovick or even his brother Sam. Just seeing his women reinforces the stereotype that Kirk is a ladies man.
Some of the effects did look a bit rough here and there, but overall looked fine. As usual the attention to detail, sound, lighting, costumes, etc looked great to me.
I think I would rate this one behind Lolani. My order of STC, Lolani, White Iris, Pilgrim, Fairest. It might be surprising that I rate the latter rather poorly, this is mostly story, I just never felt Spock was in real danger (necessary as he's our hero) and the story was a stalemate for too long.
Yes, maybe Star Trek really is the hardest show to write for.
This one worked for me, but I can completely see where it wouldn't for many people. Story is atypical of TOS in the way it looks at Kirk. It's not "wrong" by our standards but a bit odd if this is supposed to be something from a hypothetical season 4. If you are looking for a pure "TOS Experience" then yes, it's not quite that. If you don't agree with the premise, then the details don't really matter.
I do have some other quibbles with it. I mentioned before the "hitting on the head" thing seemed off, a strange weapon would be better. McCoy also seemed uncharacteristically resigned to the situation, too passive. In the "why-didn't-they-use-the-shuttlecraft- -in-The-Enemy-Within" vein, I wondered why Spock didn't try a meld sooner than his quick "Ghost Meld" to see what was wrong with Kirk. We flashback to Requiem which reinforces that Spock by now is not so reserved to melding. It might have been interesting to see some of Kirk's close male friends that he had some association with their demise, like Gary Mitchell, Capt. Garrovick or even his brother Sam. Just seeing his women reinforces the stereotype that Kirk is a ladies man.
Some of the effects did look a bit rough here and there, but overall looked fine. As usual the attention to detail, sound, lighting, costumes, etc looked great to me.
I think I would rate this one behind Lolani. My order of STC, Lolani, White Iris, Pilgrim, Fairest. It might be surprising that I rate the latter rather poorly, this is mostly story, I just never felt Spock was in real danger (necessary as he's our hero) and the story was a stalemate for too long.
Yes, maybe Star Trek really is the hardest show to write for.
I don't think Star Trek is so hard to write for, no more than any good drama. The format is pretty straightforward, and so long as you write a solid, believable story with personal stakes that has the characters behaving true to themselves, there's no big trick to it. Fanfilms (naming no names) frequently ignore or are ignorant of basic dramatic structure and throw in too many elements that harm rather than help the story.
Star Trek does carry a fifty year history and lore, so it's possible to run into a bit of paralysis by analysis if a writer gets hung up on worrying about whether or not a story is truly "new." Hence why the link in the sig only went up today rather than back in November or December.
I liked seeing a Pike era gooseneck viewer in the Farragut's sickbay - nice touch...
Star Trek does carry a fifty year history and lore, so it's possible to run into a bit of paralysis by analysis if a writer gets hung up on worrying about whether or not a story is truly "new." Hence why the link in the sig only went up today rather than back in November or December.
I agree wholeheartedly with Maurice on this. Once you get the format, you can easily plug into it.
However, Ratboy, you bring up something that does plague fan films. It's not that they worry about being truly "new" but rather are too beholden to that 50 years of history and lore. That's where the paralysis by analysis comes into play.
Went over to Youtube to watch. Couldn't find it. How is it listed?
Sir Rhosis
Sir Rhosis
^^^Thanks.
I caught that, too! Very clever little thing to add in there.
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