Some of Captain Kirk's acts of stupidity

[Gary7]

I really enjoy the character of the original Captain James T. Kirk. He was my favorite captain in Star Trek for a very long time, even after others appeared on the scene. Then as I came to know Picard, I began to prefer him... until later on I found that I appreciated them both, each for their own unique qualities.

William Shatner did a terrific job portraying Captain Kirk. Yes, he overacted at times... but in the scope and context of the original series, I think he was the best choice at the time. Leonard Nimoy was absolutely perfect as Spock, no doubt, but it was the combination of him and Shatner that really made TOS as great as it is, even to this day.

But the role of Captain Kirk had its limitations. Sometimes the scripts took that character in directions that one might consider wrong, or even out of character. What episodes/scenes would you say capture that?

I'll get the ball rolling. "Requiem for Methuselah." There have been plenty of threads about Kirk's propensity for chasing women. And in the middle of this episode, we see him getting caught up in Rayna... to the point of compromising the mission. OK, we know he has a real weak spot for attractive and highly intelligent women. More so than one would really tolerate for a starship captain (Picard certainly exercised prudent restraint in this regard).

But for me, his disastrous mistake was in the very end (not to mention his poor decision not to order McCoy back up to the ship with the Ryetalyn immediately upon its discovery of being fully processed). Rayna is becoming "aware" of her emotions. He and Flint end up in an all out physical brawl (rather silly, actually). And Rayna is so distraught that she'd be the cause of it. So Kirk knows she's an android, artificial life form (not unlike Data). But there he is... "Come with me!" WTF? He's human, she's not -- she's immortal. Flint is the immortal one. It's so obvious that once it's revealed what Rayna is, Kirk is a terrible match for her. No doubt it would be a great let down for him. But to beckon her to join him over Flint despite that?

No. I think the "in character" Kirk would sober up at this point. He'd have pulled down on his tunic, given a nod to Flint and be done with it. And in doing so, heeding Spock's warning, it would have given Rayna a chance to "cool off"... gather her thoughts... and continue to exist.

Actually, her "dying" was kind of silly. I mean, Flint was a brilliant man. He wouldn't design circuitry that would implode in on itself. There would be safeties. I could see her locking up and needing a complete "reboot". But "dead"? I know... it's the story. Then there's McCoy, checking for a pulse on the neck instead of using his tricorder to detect brainwaves. What?

 

[Warped9]

Roddenberry had always intended Kirk to be something of a flawed hero. But throughout the series his ship always came first no matter how pretty the scenery. But in "Requiem For Methuselah" we have a case of sloppy writing that runs counter to Kirk's character.

But even there notice he acts incorrectly primarily when Rayna is present. When he learns she's an android and they have the ryrallin he's prepared to leave and get back to the ship. Things start to go nutty again when Rayna shows up to learn the truth of her own existence.

This always brings me back to something that could and should have been shown more clearly--that there's something about or in Rayna's design that makes Kirk particularly susceptible to her. It's the only reasonable way to explain why he goes so ga-ga over her.

 

[Marsden]

Maybe on some level Kirk is not really looking for a Human or even a living woman. He's so married to his ship, the gynoid is the best of both worlds, he can leave her in his cabin for 12 hrs at a time an she'll keep herself busy but not be needy. And I'm sorry at how bad that sounds.

 

[Gary7]

Roddenberry had always intended Kirk to be something of a flawed hero. But throughout the series his ship always came first no matter how pretty the scenery. But in "Requiem For Methuselah" we have a case of sloppy writing that runs counter to Kirk's character.

But even there notice he acts incorrectly primarily when Rayna is present. When he learns she's an android and they have the ryrallin he's prepared to leave and get back to the ship. Things start to go nutty again when Rayna shows up to learn the truth of her own existence.

This always brings me back to something that could and should have been shown more clearly--that there's something about or in Rayna's design that makes Kirk particularly susceptible to her. It's the only reasonable way to explain why he goes so ga-ga over her.

If there was more time for the episode (e.g. those cut scenes left in place), one could speculate that Rayna inadvertently put a trance on him. Her mind so powerful, it could act like the seductive tears of the Dohlman, warping his rationale. But... as you said, sloppy writing. It's hard to do anything but chalk it up to that.

Maybe on some level Kirk is not really looking for a Human or even a living woman. He's so married to his ship, the gynoid is the best of both worlds, he can leave her in his cabin for 12 hrs at a time an she'll keep herself busy but not be needy. And I'm sorry at how bad that sounds.

I think that marginalizes Rayna's intelligence. She's a super smart being and wouldn't be content as a gynoid!

 

[Ithekro]

Well she could be the ship's computer. Kirk's in love with the Enterprise, and if she becomes the Enterprise?

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I had some thoughts about Kirk's missteps too, a while back. If he were in the Navy, he'd be relieved of command. To quote from my old thread:

Albertese just noted in his "And the Children" thread that Kirk left two redshirts behind on Triacus. It's funny how you can watch the episode and not catch it.

But it brought to mind the fact that I've thought several times, "If this episode were real, Kirk would get a court-martial."

"The Ultimate Computer"
Starfleet Command would say Kirk took too long to regain control of his ship, or at least disable its weapons. Hundreds died. The civilian news coverage would crucify him to a fare-thee-well, and he'd be so radioactive that Federation politicians would cover their own asses by scapegoating him and seeing to it that he got at least some of the blame. Total career ender.

"The Way to Eden"
He lost control of his ship to a bunch of barefoot whatdiyacallems who should never have had so much freedom of movement. If this were the Navy, once again he'd be finished. Desk job at best.

"The Apple"
They would question how Kirk got four men killed. This without even knowing that immediately upon beaming back to the ship, he was yukking it up with Spock and McCoy like nothing happened.

"The Enemy Within"
He beat up Wilson, Fisher, and his female yeoman. He discharged a weapon in the Engine Room causing serious damage. Then he menaced the bridge with a phaser and barely talked himself out of shooting the place up at great risk to human life and the ship. Witnesses report he was beside himself. Try that one in a court of law.

TMP
Why did neither Kirk nor Scotty, both of whom were standing in front of the dismantled engineering panel, warn the Transporter Room against beaming anyone aboard? Two people died. This was a classic screw-up in which Scotty better understood that the Transporter was hobbled. while Kirk knew that two people were about to beam aboard. Still, these things wreck careers in real life.

TWOK
I don't even have to spell this one out. Raise the goram shields.

TSFS
Stealing the Enterprise? For this one, Starfleet finally sat up and took notice. They put him on trial. But can you blame Kirk for thinking by this point that he could get away with anything?

I forgot to even mention "Requiem for Methuselah," in which Kirk has to save his crew from a raging epidemic, right after he shoots some pool and goes dancing.

 

[BillJ]

The overall lack of security on the Enterprise. Kirk was definitely lax when it came to visitors access to ship files and areas.

 

[Timo]

I have a hard time figuring out why "Requiem for Methuselah" should count as a Kirk failure. Out of the heroic team, he was the only one who did anything to accomplish the mission!

McCoy was willing to sit in the waiting room till doomsday, listening to nonsense about "minor problems that will soon be solved". Spock just said "insufficient data". But Kirk homed in on the very key of the mystery, and then turned that key until the lock gave. Kirk's actions hastened the acquisition of rhyetalyn; those of McCoy and Spock slowed it down.

"The Enemy Within"
He beat up Wilson, Fisher, and his female yeoman. He discharged a weapon in the Engine Room causing serious damage. Then he menaced the bridge with a phaser and barely talked himself out of shooting the place up at great risk to human life and the ship. Witnesses report he was beside himself. Try that one in a court of law.

This is actually a good example of what courts of law of the TOS era would frequently have to put up with. Absent objective proof for or against evil possession, doppelgängers, time travel and so forth, they'd have to decide between trial by ordeal and erring on the side of lenience.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Forbin]

Let That be Your Last Battlefield - Kirk gave both Lokai and Beale free run of the ship. Both the wanted car thief/professed insurgent, and the obsessive lawman who was chasing him. Kirk told them both they have run of the ship as long as they behave. When they start chasing each other around the ship, Kirk shrugs and says "where could they go?" - on a ship with shuttlecraft and transporters, he asks this?
DOPE!

 

[ToddPence]

In "Space Seed", Kirk tells Marla McGivers that he wouldn't rate her performance as a member of the landing party very highly, because of her obvious infatuation for Khan. I wonder how he would have rated himself in "Methuselah".

 

[Push The Button]

Not raising the shields in the first encounter with Reliant in TWOK.

"This is damn peculiar."

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I should admit it's easy to take shots at Kirk, because he had to facilitate the plots of all these wild episodes. But I still think he's great.

 

[FormerLurker]

Let That be Your Last Battlefield - Kirk gave both Lokai and Beale free run of the ship. Both the wanted car thief/professed insurgent, and the obsessive lawman who was chasing him. Kirk told them both they have run of the ship as long as they behave. When they start chasing each other around the ship, Kirk shrugs and says "where could they go?" - on a ship with shuttlecraft and transporters, he asks this?
DOPE!

Bele and Lokai were quite the pair, weren't they? Valjean and Javert through a mirror, darkly.

 

[Ssosmcin]

I had some thoughts about Kirk's missteps too, a while back. If he were in the Navy, he'd be relieved of command ... it brought to mind the fact that I've thought several times, "If this episode were real, Kirk would get a court-martial."

"The Ultimate Computer"
Starfleet Command would say Kirk took too long to regain control of his ship, or at least disable its weapons. Hundreds died. The civilian news coverage would crucify him to a fare-thee-well, and he'd be so radioactive that Federation politicians would cover their own asses by scapegoating him and seeing to it that he got at least some of the blame. Total career ender.

"The Enemy Within"
He beat up Wilson, Fisher, and his female yeoman. He discharged a weapon in the Engine Room causing serious damage. Then he menaced the bridge with a phaser and barely talked himself out of shooting the place up at great risk to human life and the ship. Witnesses report he was beside himself. Try that one in a court of law.

TMP
Why did neither Kirk nor Scotty, both of whom were standing in front of the dismantled engineering panel, warn the Transporter Room against beaming anyone aboard? Two people died. This was a classic screw-up in which Scotty better understood that the Transporter was hobbled. while Kirk knew that two people were about to beam aboard. Still, these things wreck careers in real life.

Great points on most and, not to take away from the fun of the exercise, but I don't necessarily agree with these three.

"The Ultimate Computer" shows us Kirk under strict orders to put M5, and therefore Daystrom, in control of the Enterprise. Daystrom is unstable. M5 - a machine based on his creator's personality - is just as wacked out. Kirk did everything he could to get the ship under control and the logs (and his own men) will back him up. Bob Wesley takes the brunt of this, which is probably why he's booted out and made governor of Antilles a short time later.

"The Enemy Within." The transporter records, Kirk and Spock's logs, McCoy's medical records and witness testimony clear Kirk before this even gets to trial. When you have crazytown technology like transporters, you expect certain freaky incidents.

"TMP." Kirk just got there and is only vaguely familiar with the upgrades and where stuff is. Even on a good day, he shouldn't be expected to know what every panel on his ship does in every section. The fella in charge of the department, who was there from the start of the refit, who knew every circuit, and who knew the transporter was futzing, AND WHO WAS STANDING RIGHT THERE, gets the heat.

"There's nothing you could have done, Rand. It wasn't your fault."

He's right, it was Scotty's.

Otherwise, spot on.

 

[Poltargyst]

Galileo 7. Take care of the emergency first THEN come back and check out the phenomenon.

 

[Push The Button]

Galileo 7. Take care of the emergency first THEN come back and check out the phenomenon.

So true, Murasaki 312 wasn't going anywhere. It still existed in the TNG era (Data's Day).

 

[MarsWeeps]

"The Ultimate Computer"
Starfleet Command would say Kirk took too long to regain control of his ship, or at least disable its weapons. Hundreds died. The civilian news coverage would crucify him to a fare-thee-well, and he'd be so radioactive that Federation politicians would cover their own asses by scapegoating him and seeing to it that he got at least some of the blame. Total career ender.

No way. Shoving the M5 down Kirk's throat was Starfleet/Wesley's fault. The blood is on their hands. Kirk should get a medal for being able to convince M5 to shut down.

TMP
Why did neither Kirk nor Scotty, both of whom were standing in front of the dismantled engineering panel, warn the Transporter Room against beaming anyone aboard? Two people died. This was a classic screw-up in which Scotty better understood that the Transporter was hobbled. while Kirk knew that two people were about to beam aboard. Still, these things wreck careers in real life.

No, this was just an example of horrible writing. Something as complex as a transporter should constantly be doing self-checks before attempting any transport. There is no way that a screwed up "module" would have gone undetected by the electronics itself and allowed a transport attempt. That was a stupid scene, especially when shortly after, they crack jokes about McCoy having his molecules scattered. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Space Seed - I think one of Kirk's biggest screw ups was allowing Khan full access to the ship's library computer which allowed him to take over the ship. Probably why Kirk dumped him off on a planet, hoping to sweep it all under the rug.

The Enemy Within - obviously not sending a shuttle down but wasn't the transporter good enough to beam down some blankets? Even if they ended up tattered and torn, it would have been better than nothing. Also, we see Sulu heating up rocks with a phaser. Why couldn't the Enterprise heat up a whole mountain of rocks firing its phasers from orbit?

 

[Timo]

Galileo 7. Take care of the emergency first THEN come back and check out the phenomenon.

So true, Murasaki 312 wasn't going anywhere. It still existed in the TNG era (Data's Day).

Then again, the emergency wasn't going anywhere, either.

The writers were clever to establish a rendezvous as Kirk's ultimate aim. Getting there early would do no good to anybody, as the other ship (ships?) couldn't take the medicine forward any faster. They were also clever not to describe the rendezvous in any detail, so we can invent all sorts of plausible scenarios that would prevent Kirk from skipping it and taking the medicine straight to the patients.

The bottom line: Kirk had a specific number of hours to burn. And since his starship was capable of warp ten while usually puttering along at warp six or so, he could opt to spend those hours pretty much as he pleased, and do the actual trip either at speed X or then at a speed something like a thousand times faster!

The Enemy Within - obviously not sending a shuttle down but wasn't the transporter good enough to beam down some blankets? Even if they ended up tattered and torn, it would have been better than nothing. Also, we see Sulu heating up rocks with a phaser. Why couldn't the Enterprise heat up a whole mountain of rocks firing its phasers from orbit?

That's the very point of the episode: the heroes had options, but because "Good" Kirk was such a wimp, his indecision made them miss each and every opportunity before things got worse.

Sending down blankets might have been nice at the very start of the crisis. But it would be of zero help when the night fell: the landing party would simply freeze to death in their blankets. Sending down fuel for fires would accomplish the same: the night simply wasn't survivable without a proper shelter, and the window of opportunity for sending down such a shelter closed on our heroes because of "Good" Kirk's indecision.

(And "better than nothing" doesn't exist. If it's not good enough, you die...)

As for heating up rock, I have a hard time believing there would be a comfort zone between freezing and frying if an area next to the landing party really were to be turned into lava. Digging a cavern would be a better idea, but again something that should have been done while there still was time, not after the landing party had exhausted their phaser batteries while hoping for a timely rescue. (Digging a cavern from orbit suffers from certain rather fundamental geometrical problems!)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

But it brought to mind the fact that I've thought several times, "If this episode were real, Kirk would get a court-martial."

"The Ultimate Computer"
Starfleet Command would say Kirk took too long to regain control of his ship, or at least disable its weapons. Hundreds died. The civilian news coverage would crucify him to a fare-thee-well, and he'd be so radioactive that Federation politicians would cover their own asses by scapegoating him and seeing to it that he got at least some of the blame. Total career ender.

He was under orders from Starfleet to participate in a classified test he knew nothing about. Daystrom, Welsey and the higher ups were 100% responsible for a system the 1701 crew struggled to counter.

"The Way to Eden"
He lost control of his ship to a bunch of barefoot whatdiyacallems who should never have had so much freedom of movement. If this were the Navy, once again he'd be finished. Desk job at best.

Kirk is not a mind reader. With one of the group's members (Tongo Rad) being the son of the Catullan ambassador (IOW, a very important person) , he was not going to Kirk-Fu them into detention. The situation was more sensitive than most believe.

"The Apple"
They would question how Kirk got four men killed. This without even knowing that immediately upon beaming back to the ship, he was yukking it up with Spock and McCoy like nothing happened.

So, what would Decker's fate be for beaming 429 people down to their deaths? If he did not commit suicide, would he be drummed out of Starfleet?

TWOK
I don't even have to spell this one out. Raise the goram shields.

...against a fellow Starfleet ship? That very point was addressed by Khan and Joachim moments before, which the screenwriters anticipated would be a question. If you raise shields against a fellow vessel simply because communications cannot be established, then there's something not quite right about Starfleet.

TSFS
Stealing the Enterprise? For this one, Starfleet finally sat up and took notice. They put him on trial. But can you blame Kirk for thinking by this point that he could get away with anything?

Kirk realized what he was doing, hence his responsible decision to return to earth at the opening of TVH. He's no irresponsible rogue, incompetent leader or reckless. There's an excuse for just about every Kirk action.

 

[MarsWeeps]

That's the very point of the episode: the heroes had options, but because "Good" Kirk was such a wimp, his indecision made them miss each and every opportunity before things got worse.

Nonsense. His senior officers, especially Spock could have suggested, even insisted on all those things and he did not.

Sending down blankets might have been nice at the very start of the crisis. But it would be of zero help when the night fell: the landing party would simply freeze to death in their blankets.

Yeah, you're right. Don't even bother trying. Give up. Hate to see a good blanket go to waste.

As for heating up rock, I have a hard time believing there would be a comfort zone between freezing and frying if an area next to the landing party really were to be turned into lava.

Who mentioned turning it into lava? You're right again. Don't even bother trying. Give up.

Digging a cavern would be a better idea,

Of course, because YOU thought of it.