• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Simple Question: Do You Like The Reboots?

Do You Like The Reboots

  • Yes

    Votes: 106 54.6%
  • No

    Votes: 88 45.4%

  • Total voters
    194
...if they hadn't had the Trek logo and many millions thrown at them, they'd have been unknown, direct-to-video losers. Both of them.

Do you honestly think any of the spinoffs would've been a success without the Trek logo and millions of dollars being thrown at them? Do you think TNG would've been the most expensive show on TV from the get-go without "Star Trek" being in the title? Odds are, it would've been cancelled after thirteen episodes.
 
...if they hadn't had the Trek logo and many millions thrown at them, they'd have been unknown, direct-to-video losers. Both of them.

Do you honestly think any of the spinoffs would've been a success without the Trek logo and millions of dollars being thrown at them? Do you think TNG would've been the most expensive show on TV from the get-go without "Star Trek" being in the title? Odds are, it would've been cancelled after thirteen episodes.

The difference being that the later series deserve to sport that logo. Abrams' things do not. Voyager had a great deal of wheat in the chaff. DS9 was often brilliant and the acting was very good post-first season. Didn't watch much Enterprise, but for a while a few storylines, the temporal cold war especially, which I thought fairly inventive for tv sf, had my interest. nuTrek fails on all counts at just about every minute of the two movies' combined running times: writing, acting, or just holding my interest. The two new movies bored me to tears, really. Action becomes dull when it's poorly executed and clunkily introduced, like that horribly overlong ship-to-ship flight scene in STiD. Or the flatly unbelievable and still just dull fistfight between Khan and Spock at the end. Vengeance chasing Enterprise. Dull, dull, dull. Once you get used to the noise, overbearing music, and lense flares, these are snoozefests.
 
Last edited:
What I cant understand is how/why/WTH so many people say ST2009 is so good even though Nero is in it.

I like Nero. But then I like Shinzon too. :shrug:

(I like Shinzon too -- better than Nero.)

I'd edit my post, but here it is: why/WTH so many people say ST2009 is so good even though Nero is in it AND so many people dont like him.

Nero didnt do anything but scream
 
Last edited:
The difference being that the later series deserve to sport that logo.

Why? Why do Deep Space Nine, Voyager and Enterprise deserve to sport the logo?

Abrams' things do not.

This fan of Star Trek thinks the Abrams movies are more "Star Trek" than any of the spinoffs.

Voyager had a great deal of wheat in the chaff.

That is being very, very nice.

DS9 was often brilliant and the acting was very good post-first season.

It put me to sleep more often than not.

nuTrek fails on all counts at just about every minute of the two movies' combined running times. The series often succeed.

The Abrams films definitely failed to put me to sleep.
 
The difference being that the later series deserve to sport that logo.

Why? Why do Deep Space Nine, Voyager and Enterprise deserve to sport the logo?

Abrams' things do not.
This fan of Star Trek thinks the Abrams movies are more "Star Trek" than any of the spinoffs.



That is being very, very nice.

DS9 was often brilliant and the acting was very good post-first season.
It put me to sleep more often than not.

nuTrek fails on all counts at just about every minute of the two movies' combined running times. The series often succeed.
The Abrams films definitely failed to put me to sleep.

Wow sorry I was editing, but this is interesting: you wrote Ds9 put you to sleep, while I was writing that nuTrek does that to me!

They deserve the logo because 1) they at least attempt to tell complex and original science fiction stories, and sometimes succeed, and, 2) the acting is far better. In all of them. Not all the time, but on balance far more often than in nuTrek. Although I will say that at times Scott Bakula was so bad it passed belief; I wondered if he was drunk sometimes (supposedly Nimoy was drunk alot, but I could never tell).

Taste is a varied spectrum alright.

In part, it is the action itself that makes me snooze. It's repetitious, for the most part, with dull, static shots or, worse, bad lighting. Which REALLY makes me want to not watch.

I don't have a lot of other folks' problems with Voyager. In the main, I enjoyed it. Not so nuTrek.
 
Taste is a varied spectrum alright.

It definitely is. :techman:

I don't have a lot of other folks' problems with Voyager. In the main, I enjoyed it. Not so nuTrek.

I think all the spinoffs have their moments. Though it would be hard not too with 600 hours of material between them. But on the whole, they haven't held up very well.

I was watching "A Fistful of Data's" today, only making it about halfway through before turning it off. I found myself looking at the ceiling, looking at the walls, looking at my phone and looking at the clock display on my cable box. The problem being, I really remember liking this episode all those years ago when it first came out.

For me, the Abrams films are what I want from Star Trek. I want it to be fun and exciting. I want it to be a thrill ride. For me, I truly believe they are fairly close to what Gene Roddenberry of 1964 would've done if he had an unlimited amount of money and technology to make Star Trek.
 
Why do people dismiss the criticism that the reboots did away with the continuity? Even if it is still there in that Prime Universe both the big and the small screen will likely never visit again, it is not present in the new universe any new incarnation of ST (film or TV) is likely to focus on.
Pretty much everything I was a fan of in the Star Trek universe was removed. Why should that not contribute to my dislike of the movies?

If a neighbor that you liked commits suicide and someone else moves in to replace him, is that a valid reason to dislike the new guy? It's fine to be upset, but place the blame where it's due. OldTrek would still be going today if they hadn't let the quality drop so badly.
 
They deserve the logo because 1) they at least attempt to tell complex and original science fiction stories, and sometimes succeed,

Being a long-time reader of literary sci-fi, I never really found any version (including the original, my favorite) complex or original.

and, 2) the acting is far better. In all of them. Not all the time, but on balance far more often than in nuTrek.

Each of the series had a good actor or two. But I've found the acting superior in the Abrams movies on an overall scale. Though it really isn't fair to compare the two as each of the spinoffs had 98 or more episodes to iron out the kinks vs. four hours combined for the two movies.
 
They deserve the logo because 1) they at least attempt to tell complex and original science fiction stories, and sometimes succeed,

Being a long-time reader of literary sci-fi, I never really found any version (including the original, my favorite) complex or original.

and, 2) the acting is far better. In all of them. Not all the time, but on balance far more often than in nuTrek.
Each of the series had a good actor or two. But I've found the acting superior in the Abrams movies on an overall scale. Though it really isn't fair to compare the two as each of the spinoffs had 98 or more episodes to iron out the kinks vs. four hours combined for the two movies.

Well, yes, compared to literary SF, often simple and lagging behind in what is considered a fresh idea. This is true of all tv sf that I can see. Nothing on tv has the complexity of ideas of, say, Dick's Martian Time-Slip (time travel via autism? the plumbers union being the most powerful political entity on Mars?). On screen, one or two very strong ideas tend to dominate; we see much more in good literature.

Complex by comparison to 1) other tv sf, and 2) all other tv.

I was watchng the Voyager episode "Blink of an Eye" last week. Actually, although I like this episode, I also kind of detest it, as it's an uncredited rip-off of Robert Forward. But at least they tried to give us an unusual idea as our touchstone idea: time running much faster on a planet's surface (although Forward had us on a neutron star and this "planet" had a "tachyon core", but, anyway)...) and exploring the consequences from there.

As you say, it's not exactly fair to compare a series to a movie, but we can't really compare tv to books, either.

Abrams' movies leave me with such an empty feeling. Like these entertainments are being done to me, instead of me somehow being almost drawn into the story. Maybe it was my usual fan's immersion in the prime universe that made me so prone to enjoy Trek across most of its incarnations, but I don't think so. There was a feeling of heart coming off the screen, and I don't mean a lame Planetteer power. Just a sense that the actors wanted to be there and they wanted to do something for you and, at best, with you. Not to you. I can't explain it better than that I think--it doesn't explain.

That experience with "A Fistful of Datas"? I've had it too. With Best of Both Worlds. It seems so dull and weak and contained compared to what I remember, now. BUT: Cause and Effect is actually better for me, and Chain of Command gets better and better. BoBW was groundbreaking because the foundations of the Federation were being struck at, but years later, after the excitement of that has long faded, there isn't much but a shoot-em-up invasion story. Cause and Effect takes a somewhat new look at time travel and wonders what might happen if SOME information got passed from an "erased" timelime to a new one...and Chain of Command has David Warner and Patrick Stewart playing off each other, wonderfully, and Frakes rises to the occasion to do the same with Ronny Cox's in-my-opinion brilliantly dislikable Jellico. Point being: where in nuTrek do you have anything like the tautness of the presentation of the idea of multiple timelines we see in Cause and Effect (we see none of the spooky, atmospheric stuff that Cause and Effect shows us in a poker game and Dr Crusher cutting flowers) or the fine acting we see in Chain of Command?
 
Additionally, 21st century effects made all the technology shown in Star Trek reboots look far more advanced. However, this is moderately difficult to reconcile with a supposedly more advanced Federation set 70 years in the future, but with less cool looking technology. JJ Abrams could have reconciled both the problems I have by simply having the new movies take place in the future. Then, the canon wouldn't have been screwed up, and the better looking technology could have made sense. He could even have kept the exact storyline, with a few minor details changed.

Dude, they're stories. They are all fictional constructs designed to entertain people, not be a history lesson of the future.

Amen. The point was not to preserve the canon at all costs; the point was to reinvent STAR TREK for a new generation of moviegoers. Preserving the canon doesn't matter if nobody but us diehard fans are buying tickets.

STAR TREK is more than just a encyclopedia of imaginary facts. Continuity is a virtue, but only as a means to an end. It's not an ends in itself.
 
Last edited:
To the above posts regarding what is and isn't Star Trek:

I could go on and on about it and get into endless arguments about whether or not the new movies are "real," but I just can't. It would take too much time, and at my adnvanced age I don't have the patience for it anyway.

But I will condense all of my arguments into this: :rolleyes:
 
To the above posts regarding what is and isn't Star Trek:

I could go on and on about it and get into endless arguments about whether or not the new movies are "real," but I just can't. It would take too much time, and at my adnvanced age I don't have the patience for it anyway.

But I will condense all of my arguments into this: :rolleyes:

You managed all the effort for that driveby, why not the rest?
 
To the above posts regarding what is and isn't Star Trek:

I could go on and on about it and get into endless arguments about whether or not the new movies are "real," but I just can't. It would take too much time, and at my adnvanced age I don't have the patience for it anyway.

But I will condense all of my arguments into this: :rolleyes:

You managed all the effort for that driveby, why not the rest?


Well, to be fair, at this point most of us know all the arguments on both sides by heart now. :)
 
Amen. The point was not to preserve the canon at all costs; the point was to reinvent STAR TREK for a new generation of moviegoers


The McNugget: reinventing the chicken for a whole new generation of people without taste buds.
 
No, I don't like the reboots. They just don't speak to me the way TOS does even now.

I want to like them, and I appreciate the work done by the cast (especially Simon Pegg), but the flashy cinematography and the glib writing leaves me cold. In other words, I've never felt this way before. At odds with the franchise. When I went to both ST and STID at the theatre, I sat there and watched my show perform for a mass of circuits and relays, and felt useless. Unneeded.

All snark aside, I feel like a dinosaur; these new films move too fast for me to appreciate and I can't seem to invest in the characters or the plots.

These films are meant for a new generation of consumers and I'm happy to commit this version of Trek to them. Instead of rejecting the reboots or resenting what "they" have done to my beloved series, I am reminded of what James M. Cain said about the films based on his works: "They haven’t done anything to my books. They’re still right there on the shelf. They’re fine."
 
If a neighbor that you liked commits suicide and someone else moves in to replace him, is that a valid reason to dislike the new guy? It's fine to be upset, but place the blame where it's due. OldTrek would still be going today if they hadn't let the quality drop so badly.

Where do I place blame? All I said was it removed everything I liked about ST so of it doesn't endear it self to me. It's logical.
Also I hope you understand that that is a quite stupid and tasteless comparison. Those are shows/movies not people. Apples and oranges. Or rather apples and...I don't know, cows?
 
To the above posts regarding what is and isn't Star Trek:

I could go on and on about it and get into endless arguments about whether or not the new movies are "real," but I just can't. It would take too much time, and at my adnvanced age I don't have the patience for it anyway.

But I will condense all of my arguments into this: :rolleyes:

You managed all the effort for that driveby, why not the rest?


Well, to be fair, at this point most of us know all the arguments on both sides by heart now. :)

We should make it into a cartoon, and post it to Youtube, it would save so much time. :lol:
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top