How much did TWOK depend on Fantasy Island?

[Melakon]

But Colicos, Ansara, and Campbell weren't names that would generate box office. Nimoy wanted Edward James Olmos, but was overruled.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Noppers, can't get my head around this concept.

By the time TWOK was released, Star Trek was already firmly entrenched in its popularity and the role of Khan well known. People went to see the film not to see Mr Rourke, but to see Khan, and his revenge on Kirk (part of the marketing for the film).

Also, an implied return to a more traditionally Star Trek story helped tremendously.

By the way, Fantasy Island co-star Hervé Villechaize portrayed the main henchman for Bond villain Francisco Scaramanga in Man With the Golden Gun

I don't think Star Trek was as firmly entrenched as you believe or that "Space Seed "and Khan were as popular with the fan base as you think. TWOK made Khan the "number one" Trek villain. I think other adversaries were more likely to be "fan favorites" before TWOK, probably one the Klingons.

 

[kirkfan]

I think Kahn has become Kirk's Moriarty... The only super villain that even came close to beating him.

 

[f14peter]

I don't think Star Trek was as firmly entrenched as you believe or that "Space Seed "and Khan were as popular with the fan base as you think. TWOK made Khan the "number one" Trek villain. I think other adversaries were more likely to be "fan favorites" before TWOK, probably one the Klingons.

Well, I beg to differ. When TMP was released, I was 19 and had seen all the TOS eps, most several times, and was aware of things like international fan clubs, conventions, efforts to revive a television version and so forth. Star Trek catch-phrases were common, and a "Kirk" or "Spock" reference would not be considered odd. No research or evidence, but I would speculate that TOS in the 1970s was getting nearly as many, if not more, broadcast hours nationwide per week than at any other point in the franchise until TNG, DS9 and VOY were all done and well into syndication.

I also knew the Khan character but wouldn't know if he would be considered villain #1. Still, in my opinion Star Trek's "entrenchment" (popularity and/or vast syndication) by the late 1970s is why the franchise even exists at all. Its popularity at that time is why a potential new network even considered reviving it as their flagship program, or that a major motion picture studio decided to hop onto the renewed interest in SciFi and do a movie.

I'm just having trouble digesting the idea that Fantasy Island, which was considered lightweight fluff at the time, having much influence on TWOK. I'd speculate that multitudes more people viewing TWOK didn't know Montalban was Mr Rourke on Fantasy Island than were there for that specific reason.

 

[kirkfan]

I don't think Star Trek was as firmly entrenched as you believe or that "Space Seed "and Khan were as popular with the fan base as you think. TWOK made Khan the "number one" Trek villain. I think other adversaries were more likely to be "fan favorites" before TWOK, probably one the Klingons.

Well, I beg to differ. When TMP was released, I was 19 and had seen all the TOS eps, most several times, and was aware of things like international fan clubs, conventions, efforts to revive a television version and so forth. Star Trek catch-phrases were common, and a "Kirk" or "Spock" reference would not be considered odd. No research or evidence, but I would speculate that TOS in the 1970s was getting nearly as many, if not more, broadcast hours nationwide per week than at any other point in the franchise until TNG, DS9 and VOY were all done and well into syndication.

I also knew the Khan character but wouldn't know if he would be considered villain #1. Still, in my opinion Star Trek's "entrenchment" (popularity and/or vast syndication) by the late 1970s is why the franchise even exists at all. Its popularity at that time is why a potential new network even considered reviving it as their flagship program, or that a major motion picture studio decided to hop onto the renewed interest in SciFi and do a movie.

I'm just having trouble digesting the idea that Fantasy Island, which was considered lightweight fluff at the time, having much influence on TWOK. I'd speculate that multitudes more people viewing TWOK didn't know Montalban was Mr Rourke on Fantasy Island than were there for that specific reason.

Plus you can't tell from his role in Fantasy Island how good a villain Montalban would make, if you didn't remember him from space seed.