Odd Choices in TOS-R cgi fx

[FrankT]

They really need to stop changing things for current audiences as that's insulting the intelligence. These things stand the test of time surprisingly well unmolested.

Oh, I quite agree. Too bad they never will, though!

The irony is that TNG seems to have been treated considerably better - at least they had most of the material to recomposite, even if there are some differences - and they got The Light Works to rebuild the stuff they couldn't find. I get the feeling that CBS-D should've turned the job over to them. Or... I'd think the Star Trek Continues VFX team could do it better, too...

Maybe now that the Smithsonian is restoring the Enterprise, CBS can borrow it and shoot all the model shots again

Think they'll do it for the 50th anniversary remaster?

 

[The Laughing Vulcan]

And Paramount/CBS do indeed have me over a barrel, as when TOS as meant to be is released on Blu-ray, I will buy it again for the original audio, and hopefully cleaned up original effects.

Haven't they technically done so already?

The new visual effects got new audio effects to go with them, and the theme music was re-recorded. That's the 7.1 MA track that goes with the TOS-R episoded. The 2.0 mono track that goes with the original versions of the episodes should be the original audio, but it isn't. It's especially noticeable from episode 11 onwards in Season 1, where they simply downmixed the 7.1 track, so you get audio for new effects that don't exist in the original version. The rest of the series more of a compromise, but from what I have sampled (I'm watching TOS-R first), the 2.0 audio is often compromised, usually with the re-recorded theme.

 

[FrankT]

Hm. Well there is that ship ambience in Season 1 that I don't remember...

 

[Grant]

Apologies if it was mentioned and I somehow missed it, but the most annoying of the "fixes" in the new versions has nothing to do with new effects, but in needlessly altering an old shot.

Namely, The Apple. Why, oh why, was it considered necessary to re-tint the original shots of the storm clouds? They were a great example of old-school techniques done to perfection, real-life clouds and sky tinted red to match the red sky on the live action set. It was just so perfect, but along come the new guys, and recolored the shots to a gray cast which in no way looks right, or was necessary to the story-telling. Why waste time on that? It's so annoying I can't even watch it.

I'm normally inclined to not judge the work of others in whose shoes I didn't tread, but I defy anyone (including the remastering team) to offer a logical explanation for this.

Nope.

the original was gray. It was changed to red sometime after the original airing. The way looks in TOS-R is in fact the original version.

Check out the episode preview and you can see the sky is NOT red when the lighting flashes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEI2JF1sGnw

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

the original was gray. It was changed to red sometime after the original airing. The way looks in TOS-R is in fact the original version.

Check out the episode preview and you can see the sky is NOT red when the lighting flashes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEI2JF1sGnw

That is true, as far as the preview goes, but that was also unfnished footage, I would surmise. It also shows no phaser beam hitting Vaal when it's doing its smoke and spark death scene.

That is one fun thing about the 'next episode' previews, though. Offhand, I recall the Requiem for Methuselah preview showed a diferent beam effect from M4 when firing on the landing party, as well as Kirt's "my crew" scene without the bridge screen added, just him looking into the camera.

I'll dig up a copy of the un-remastered episode to verify, but I'll bet credits to navy beans that in the episode, the sky was red.

 

[Grant]

the original was gray. It was changed to red sometime after the original airing. The way looks in TOS-R is in fact the original version.

Check out the episode preview and you can see the sky is NOT red when the lighting flashes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEI2JF1sGnw

That is true, as far as the preview goes, but that was also unfnished footage, I would surmise. It also shows no phaser beam hitting Vaal when it's doing its smoke and spark death scene.

That is one fun thing about the 'next episode' previews, though. Offhand, I recall the Requiem for Methuselah preview showed a diferent beam effect from M4 when firing on the landing party, as well as Kirt's "my crew" scene without the bridge screen added, just him looking into the camera.

I'll dig up a copy of the un-remastered episode to verify, but I'll bet credits to navy beans that in the episode, the sky was red.

What I read back when this episode was first remastered was that the original airings were with the blue sky and sometime later somebody tinted the sky in the lightning shots to match.

I think the best chance of finding out is the older the source.

So if anybody has this episode on VHS or Laserdisc--help us out.

CBS fixed the "blue flame" in Paradise syndrome and a shot from "Mirror-Mirror" when fans complained it didn't match the original.

Fans started howling about the blue/red sky as soon as episode aired. They must have went back and looked and it would have been an easy fix if it was originally meant to be red.
Personally I prefer it red.

 

[Ssosmcin]

What I read back when this episode was first remastered was that the original airings were with the blue sky and sometime later somebody tinted the sky in the lightning shots to match.

I think the best chance of finding out is the older the source.

So if anybody has this episode on VHS or Laserdisc--help us out..

Okay, I am looking at the Laserdisc of the episode now. The sky on set is orange/red. The planet itself seen from orbit is also red. When the clouds come rolling in, the sky footage is tinted the same orange/red color. So, if the storm footage was tinted at this time, they did it well. Although it seems odd to me they would go to the trouble of fixing that and not other editing choices that don't add up in other episodes.

Unfortunately, this episode was never on home video before the VHS and Laserdisc releases, so I have nothing earlier to check. If someone has the episode on the earlier 16mm syndication print, or a VCR recording from before 1985, that would be another source.

 

[Grant]

What I read back when this episode was first remastered was that the original airings were with the blue sky and sometime later somebody tinted the sky in the lightning shots to match.

I think the best chance of finding out is the older the source.

So if anybody has this episode on VHS or Laserdisc--help us out..

Okay, I am looking at the Laserdisc of the episode now. The sky on set is orange/red. The planet itself seen from orbit is also red. When the clouds come rolling in, the sky footage is tinted the same orange/red color. So, if they were tinted at this time, they did it well.

Unfortunately, this episode was never on home video before the VHS and Laserdisc releases, so I have nothing earlier to check. If someone has the episode on the earlier 16mm syndication print, or a VCR recording from before 1985, that would be another source.

I'm a little confused.....

do you have it on the 1985/86 era VHS tape?

If yes, then I would guess that I and the article I read back on the 2006/7 timeframe were wrong about the original being blue.
The article I read implied that at the time of the original 2-disc DVD somebody altered those shots to match the other sky shots.

I really prefer the red version and it's too bad that CBS messed up this shot if in fact, it originally was red in 1967.

Still love 90% of the work they did though.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Yes, I do. The Laserdisc and the VHS tapes are from the same prints, but just to be sure, I also popped in the VHS tape just now and the storm footage within the episode is indeed red.

 

[Grant]

Yes, I do. The Laserdisc and the VHS tapes are from the same prints, but just to be sure, I also popped in the VHS tape just now and the storm footage within the episode is indeed red.

In that case--I very much doubt anybody before the 1985 VHS release was goofing around with the sky in that shot.

Maybe the original print they scanned the episode from hadn't had the red added yet and they just missed it or forgot. It clearly would have been an easy thing to adjust in the 2006 time-frame.

By the way were the 1985 VHS versions missing any things that were later restored for DVD/Blu-ray?

 

[Ssosmcin]

Yes, I do. The Laserdisc and the VHS tapes are from the same prints, but just to be sure, I also popped in the VHS tape just now and the storm footage within the episode is indeed red.

In that case--I very much doubt anybody before the 1985 VHS release was goofing around with the sky in that shot.

For all I know, the original broadcast prints could have been blue and maybe the 1985 prints were altered. All I'm saying is, the VHS/Laserdisc prints are red. It's just weird that the Blu-Ray prints would come with the grey sky shots.

By the way were the 1985 VHS versions missing any things that were later restored for DVD/Blu-ray?

Whew, off the top of my head, I can't think of too much. Leaving off my usual rant about the sound mix, the Columbia House prints had a few seconds missing from "All Our Yesterdays" and the Paramount single episode VHS prints were missing bits from the teaser from "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield." The Columbia House VHS of "The Omega Glory" is the only episode to have the original Paramount Logo with the Desilu music attached. Also, depending on the print, "Requiem for Methuselah's" end credits show Rayna spelled as either "Rayna" or "Reena" with a different shot of Spock playing chess underneath...

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Requiem_for_Methuselah_(episode)

For the most part the VHS prints were uncut. If you can think of anything in particular, I'll be happy to check it out.

 

[Grant]

Yes, I do. The Laserdisc and the VHS tapes are from the same prints, but just to be sure, I also popped in the VHS tape just now and the storm footage within the episode is indeed red.

In that case--I very much doubt anybody before the 1985 VHS release was goofing around with the sky in that shot.

For all I know, the original broadcast prints could have been blue and maybe the 1985 prints were altered. All I'm saying is, the VHS/Laserdisc prints are red. It's just weird that the Blu-Ray prints would come with the blue sky shots.

By the way were the 1985 VHS versions missing any things that were later restored for DVD/Blu-ray?

Whew, off the top of my head, I can't think of too much. Leaving off my usual rant about the sound mix, the Columbia House prints had a few seconds missing from "All Our Yesterdays" and the Paramount single episode VHS prints were missing bits from the teaser from "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield." The Columbia House VHS of "The Omega Glory" is the only episode to have the original Paramount Logo with the Desilu music attached. Also, depending on the print, "Requiem for Methuselah's" end credits show Rayna spelled as either "Rayna" or "Reena" with a different shot of Spock playing chess underneath...

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Requiem_for_Methuselah_(episode)

For the most part the VHS prints were uncut. If you can think of anything in particular, I'll be happy to check it out.

Yes, I had read that in "All Our Yesterdays" Atoz's line about
"there is any call for that much anymore." or some such was missing.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

All I have to go by are my memories of watching the show in syndication in the early 70's. My memory tells me the sky was red. That may just underline the unreliability of "eyewitness testimony", but I so clearly remember kid me getting a real sense of 'place' from the red clouds and the red sky on the set.

Now I'm thinking we may never know for sure...

 

[GNDN18]

All I have to go by are my memories of watching the show in syndication in the early 70's. My memory tells me the sky was red. That may just underline the unreliability of "eyewitness testimony", but I so clearly remember kid me getting a real sense of 'place' from the red clouds and the red sky on the set.

Now I'm thinking we may never know for sure...

My memories reach back to 1973 or 74, when WKBD-TV (Kaiser Broadcasting Detroit), was running the original syndication package. I also seem to remember the red skies. Of course, I was distracted by Brian Williams and the RPGs zipping through the living room.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

My memories reach back to 1973 or 74, when WKBD-TV (Kaiser Broadcasting Detroit), was running the original syndication package. I also seem to remember the red skies. Of course, I was distracted by Brian Williams and the RPGs zipping through the living room.

During the commercial breaks, did you have to run to kitchen, ducking sniper fire?

 

[FalTorPan]

The only TOS-R visual element that I strongly dislike is the mesh of the Klingon D-7 battlecruiser, which looks so visibly faceted that it looks like it was made for a 1990s video game.

 

[spockboy]

The only TOS-R visual element that I strongly dislike is the mesh of the Klingon D-7 battlecruiser, which looks so visibly faceted that it looks like it was made for a 1990s video game.

Indeed.

Spockboy

 

[Rat Boy]

I liked what they were attempting to do with the Klingon ship in "Elaan," but the model was kind of a downer. The disruptor fire was also a tad...too flashy for my tastes.