Here's how I've seen it: Starfleet quacks like a duck, therefore it must be a f'ing duck. It acts like a military through and through, is the primary defensive/armed force of the Federation, therefore it must be military.
"Starfleet is not a military organization" (Peak Performance)
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This has only been true for about a hundred years (and some people still don't quite agree to using the term that way
). Many a definition in Star Trek is a throwback, as the show portrays the 23rd century using 1960s terminology... By the time of Archer's adventures, the usage might have reverted back to "military" being just foot soldiers and their vehicles and aircraft and submarines and whatnot, and "Starfleet" being something else altogether, a fighting force operating starships and playing a role quite comparable to the sailing-era navies.
Timo Saloniemi
Picard is pretty consistent throughout the series in emphasizing Starfleet's role in exploration over its militaristic role (but Starfleet does serve both roles). The writing, though, on this point in the early seasons is overly heavy-handed. I mean the whole point to "Peak Performance" is a very forgettable and mostly pointless "war games" exercise.
It's not a bad premise though. The TOS episode "The Ultimate Computer" uses the framework of war game to build a pretty interesting story around it.
Until the Ferengi showed up this episode wasn't all that bad in my opinion, but that's a discussion for a different thread perhaps.
Later in Conundrum, an amnesiac crew quickly surmise that the Enterprise is a warship based on the complement of torpedoes and phaser banks they have. Uh huh, not a military. I suppose other vehicles of exploration like the Space Shuttle were also armed to the teeth.
Early TNG is too easy to pick apart for its hypocrisy. Heck, in Pen Pals, the crew was pretty much arguing FOR allowing a civilization to die (Data and Pulaski as the only voices of reason) by handwaving the Prime Directive. Millions of people were saved only because a little girl explicitly asked for help at just the right time. Psh. Later on they pull the same BS in Homeward.
Early TNG is too easy to pick apart for its hypocrisy. Heck, in Pen Pals, the crew was pretty much arguing FOR allowing a civilization to die (Data and Pulaski as the only voices of reason) by handwaving the Prime Directive. Millions of people were saved only because a little girl explicitly asked for help at just the right time. Psh. Later on they pull the same BS in Homeward.
That was kind of my point earlier, though. People tend to think of "militaristic" as being a very specific type of thing, when historically it has in fact encompassed a great number of responsibilities much broader than simply being an aggressor or a defender. To be sure, maintaining the territorial imperatives of their respective empire (or in Starfleet's case, the Federation) is core to that, which is what probably makes Starfleet a military. But the definition of a "militaristic role" is fluid. It can be anything from being on a supply run, to charting fascinating scientific phenomena, to fighting off an aggressive force. Starfleet is a military, and their role is military, no matter whether it involves charging up the ship's weapons or not.
The definition of military responsibilities have been that way historically, and I imagine they would continue to broaden and diversify well into Picard's time. Admittedly, none of this explains Picard's belief that Starfleet isn't one...
I'm actually more bothered by Riker's "I think it's a waste of effort to test our combat skills. It's a minor province in the make-up of a starship captain."
I like Riker, but he come off like a doofus when saying stuff like this. It's as awful as his line in "The Neutral Zone" about the 20th century civies "from what I've seen, there's nothing to redeem".
Again, I view it less the characters saying and more Roddenberry speaking right through them.
I like Riker, but he come off like a doofus when saying stuff like this. It's as awful as his line in "The Neutral Zone" about the 20th century civies "from what I've seen, there's nothing to redeem".
Again, I view it less the characters saying and more Roddenberry speaking right through them.
I remember this exact subject was covered months ago in a General Trek Discussion. I think the general consensus was Starfleet is a quasi-military organization themed loosely by Roddenberry on the Horatio Hornblower Navy combined with a "Wagon Train to the stars" and modernized as series developed and real-world cu'ture changed.
They had just been taken to school by the Borg and Q, so Riker's view on combat skills is reckless.
Earlier in season 1, I think it was Lonely Among Us, Riker describes war like some curiosity that he can't fathom. Babies, it's a ship of babies.
While it's clear that this was the intention, there's just enough evidence to the contrary to make it an issue we occasionally have to figure out for ourselves.
I do still think the most reasonable assumption is that what defines 'military' has broadened to such an extent by the 24th century that the word is not typically used in that context anymore. Starfleet *is* a military, of sorts... but they'd never describe themselves such.
While it's clear that this was the intention, there's just enough evidence to the contrary to make it an issue we occasionally have to figure out for ourselves.
I do still think the most reasonable assumption is that what defines 'military' has broadened to such an extent by the 24th century that the word is not typically used in that context anymore. Starfleet *is* a military, of sorts... but they'd never describe themselves such.
I think they left it open-ended so they could have their cake and eat it too.
^ Agreed. Makes discussion fun, though.
agreed
I think people are quite profoundly misunderstanding the dialogue there.
Nobody argues for letting the civilization die, not seriously. LaForge throws that idea to the table in order to ridicule it, and there are many takers - while Picard just sort of reminds everybody that the Prime Directive exists for a reason. The real issue causing argument there isn't what's happening to the civilization, but Data being insubordinate, and preaching to the choir about it. If anything, Data is making it more difficult for Starfleet to help the natives.
What would a military organization do in such a situation? In Earth history, some of those gather brownie points by providing humanitarian aid, others blackmail with promises of such, some rejoice in the misery and perhaps lob a few cannonballs or pestilence-ridden corpses to the mix. The modern trend, however, is for the troops to be loyal executors of civilian policy, and if Picard weren't being a watchdog about that, then the Federation really would be a militaristic entity.
Timo Saloniemi
I'd certainly call Starfleet a para-military organization though. And I do understand Riker's point, battle and warfare in the TNG era was meant as the last resort after atttempts at peace had failed. Rike did come though in The Best Of Both Worlds, but in the end Voyager showed us that there's more than one way to beat the Borg and DS9 showed us that there was another way to beat the Dominion, other than sheer force of arms.
Ah yes, that troubled me too. Considering Picard would not have lived long to captain the Enterprise were it not for his tactical skills and his original combat maneuvers aboard the Stargazer...I hardly think it's such a "minor province".
Not really, we've repeatedly have heard/seen Starfleet engaging in territorial wars, going back to Errand of Mercy.
But the existence of Peak Performance's war game would seem to indicate that Starfleet considers itself to be a military.
Picard might have thought the war game were unimportant, but Picard's superiors at Starfleet Command must have known different, that why they assigned Picard to the game in the first place.
How isolated is Picard (and his command) in this silly idea that Starfleet isn't a military?
