It's kind of hilarious that you take objective, quantitative analysis as "defending."
MLB Offseason 2014-15: Wait, pitchers and catchers report WHEN?
- Thread starter Timby
- Start date
- Status
It's kind of hilarious that you take objective, quantitative analysis as "defending."
I pointed out that the Red Sox have five quality innings-eaters compared to the Yankees' rotation of a broken Sabathia, a soon-to-be-broken Tanaka and an oft-injured Pineda and you think I'm fucking white knighting the Red Sox, whom I rip on incessantly. That's the joke.
But no, keep on carrying your "anyone who criticizes the Yankees obviously does so out of hate and jealousy" torch if it helps you feel better.
I pointed out that the Red Sox have five quality innings-eaters compared to the Yankees' rotation of a broken Sabathia, a soon-to-be-broken Tanaka and an oft-injured Pineda and you think I'm fucking white knighting the Red Sox, whom I rip on incessantly. That's the joke.
You are correct.
Face it, you'd be bored without me Timby
All after the contract to Seattle was accepted. Just as I said.
Timb said:Wins and losses are meaningless and it is highly uncommon for 26-year-old pitchers with a history of a BB/9 in the 4 - 5 range to develop another pitch, yes. And, yes, walking four or five guys a game means you have bad command.
Pro tip: I'm not a Red Sox fan. Oh, you have, what, David Phelps and Adam Warren? Wow, that's a mighty fuckin' rotation.
Rookies have done worse, and yes - better than Boston's. What's your team again? You seem to defend Boston quite a bit.
And yet it really isn't. I will grant that the ceiling of the top end of the Yankee rotation is higher, but all those guys are also MAJOR risks of injury and poor performance. Tanaka should have just gotten the damn TJ surgery, because we all know its coming at this point. Especially for a guy who has a hard, but flat fastball and has to throw his splitter often to be effective. Thats going to kill his elbow after a while, and there has already been evidence that it is.
Pineda is another guy who is talented and has good stuff, but at this point he is like Buchholz. He could be fantastic, or he could be awful, especially with his injury history.
Sabathia is a a disaster at this point. He may be effective for a time, but with his body type his breakdown is going to happen quickly.
And then Phelps and Warren.
On the other hand, the Red Sox rotation, as currently constituted, since I think its likely they are going to add a Hamels or Zimmerman to the top of it, isn't sexy. But it is built of guys who are at least durable innings eaters, young, and have some upside, especially if Masterson can get his velocity and command back that he lost from injury last year.
It seems that you see the names and just dismiss them since they aren't stars, but go on fangraphs, read some the articles, and they will show these guys are all above average pitchers. Especially in the case of Porcello, a ground ball guy with good numbers the past few years who pitched infront of an infield defense that was made of swiss cheese. If anything having the better Boston infield will improve his numbers.
Also, Timby doesn't defend the Red Sox FO all the time. He's been critical of many of their deals, even some that have worked out for them. Perhaps though, you see people defending their moves, because their FO has been building better teams then the Yankee FO has for the last decade.
Here is an article I read earlier today:
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/do-the-red-sox-have-a-ground-ball-fetish/
I pointed out that the Red Sox have five quality innings-eaters compared to the Yankees' rotation of a broken Sabathia, a soon-to-be-broken Tanaka and an oft-injured Pineda and you think I'm fucking white knighting the Red Sox, whom I rip on incessantly. That's the joke.
You are correct.
Face it, you'd be bored without me Timby
I'd have to settle for discussion with people who don't refuse to let facts get in the way of an opinion, which would indeed be a terrible shame.
Considering I spent two pages railing on them for what they did to Rick Renteria, you'd think it would be patently obvious.
Considering I spent two pages railing on them for what they did to Rick Renteria, you'd think it would be patently obvious.
Yeah, poor Rick. How much is he getting paid to do nothing again?
Considering I spent two pages railing on them for what they did to Rick Renteria, you'd think it would be patently obvious.
Yeah, poor Rick. How much is he getting paid to do nothing again?
It is truly astounding how little you grasp what kind of damage it does to a guy's career when his boss says that he's done a hell of a job and really made an impact and he absolutely has a job for next year, only for said boss to turn around and say "oh, just kidding" when someone else becomes available. I'm sorry, but firing the guy after explicitly saying he will be back the next year makes you a liar. Yes, Epstein wasn't expecting Maddon to be available, but the reason there's no "playbook" for these situations (as Epstein kept saying) is because no GM has been dumb enough to promise someone a job and then a month later rip that job away. (This is why it's moronic to give such blanket statements. Even so, you shit the bed yourself, you deal with it.) It says, "This guy Renteria wasn't good enough to be the Cubs' manager even though we said he was." Congratulations, you've fucked his future job prospects.
It's devastating to institutional integrity and it tells the rest of the league, "Theo Epstein may lie to you about your job security."
Furthermore, it's also a complete sham and it's ridiculous MLB didn't come down on the Cubs for it -- there's enough of a problem with so few minorities in coaching positions as it is, and for that reason MLB has very clear rules stating that closed hiring processes shouldn't exist (rules that the Cubs flagrantly ignored). Of course, it didn't stick because Theo Epstein is a dark wizard of PR and probably deserves to be in the Hall of Fame for that alone.
But, hey, the Cubs replaced a Mexican with a quirky middle-aged white guy who makes his players do weird shit on road trips and who will likely have a negligible effect on the win - loss record, everybody celebrate!
I'm still laughing at how Yanks did not know you were a Cubs fan.
Paying attention would take time away from sniping and coming up with such original witticisms as "A-ROID."
Considering I spent two pages railing on them for what they did to Rick Renteria, you'd think it would be patently obvious.
Yeah, poor Rick. How much is he getting paid to do nothing again?
It is truly astounding how little you grasp what kind of damage it does to a guy's career when his boss says that he's done a hell of a job and really made an impact and he absolutely has a job for next year, only for said boss to turn around and say "oh, just kidding" when someone else becomes available. I'm sorry, but firing the guy after explicitly saying he will be back the next year makes you a liar. Yes, Epstein wasn't expecting Maddon to be available, but the reason there's no "playbook" for these situations (as Epstein kept saying) is because no GM has been dumb enough to promise someone a job and then a month later rip that job away. (This is why it's moronic to give such blanket statements. Even so, you shit the bed yourself, you deal with it.) It says, "This guy Renteria wasn't good enough to be the Cubs' manager even though we said he was." Congratulations, you've fucked his future job prospects.
It's devastating to institutional integrity and it tells the rest of the league, "Theo Epstein may lie to you about your job security."
Furthermore, it's also a complete sham and it's ridiculous MLB didn't come down on the Cubs for it -- there's enough of a problem with so few minorities in coaching positions as it is, and for that reason MLB has very clear rules stating that closed hiring processes shouldn't exist (rules that the Cubs flagrantly ignored). Of course, it didn't stick because Theo Epstein is a dark wizard of PR and probably deserves to be in the Hall of Fame for that alone.
But, hey, the Cubs replaced a Mexican with a quirky middle-aged white guy who makes his players do weird shit on road trips and who will likely have a negligible effect on the win - loss record, everybody celebrate!
It is truly astounding how much you exaggerate what has actually happened here. This happens to players all the time. Do you go to bed weeping if a player is promised a job but the team signs a better player as a FA for that position? Does it reflect badly on the GM each and every time? It literally happens dozens of times a year.
If RR ever gets another job in baseball what'll you say then?
The people whose job it is to investigate such things haven't found anything improper--but I'm sure you know best.
Biggles
Or claiming that Mike Tomlin was a PC hire.
Or claiming that Mike Tomlin was a PC hire.
You're comparing apples to oranges. The difference is that it's very rare for a player to be "promised" a position, and furthermore rosters are always fluid. The entire point of a coaching staff is stability.
If I signed a three-year contract with an employer, and after my first year I was told I was doing a great job and that my employer was looking forward to having me on in year two, then a few weeks later suddenly told me I was out of a job and I'd been replaced, I'd be fucking pissed, and people around me would say it was bullshit, and they'd be right. (Because I have been in that position, and it is bullshit.) Organizations aren't exempt from behaving appropriately just because they're in fucking baseball instead of white-collar corporate America.
I suggest you google "the dreaded vote of confidence" to see how often this happens to mgmt. For players, if you don't think it happens often I can't help you.
Did you keep getting paid through that contract you signed? Because that's all you've been promised no matter what anybody says. Dealing with that, in white collar corporate America or sports (where it should even be expected) is life.
Just because that's the way it is doesn't mean it's right.
"Suck it, labor" is never an acceptable answer.
I agree. And the only reason why there hasn't been an uproar about this is because it was Theo Epstein who made the move; if this had happened across town with the White Sox, people would be screaming for Reinsdorf to sell, Hahn to quit, etc.
--Sran
He's getting paid per the contract terms.
That's the Sox red-headed stepchild mentality shining through.
That's my point; there appear to be certain teams and individuals that get away with everything because of how they're perceived by the public, but that does make what they're doing any less wrong? Why do the Cubs get a pass because they're the Cubs? The size of their fanbase notwithstanding, what have they accomplished in their sport that exempts them from treating people with respect? Is it Renteria's fault that the Cubs haven't won anything of consequence since 1908?
Of course, this is the franchise that blames its troubles on farm animals and fans who happen to be sitting near foul balls. Why should it surprise anyone that they'd be willing to fire a manager after promising to keep him for at least another season?
--Sran
- Status
