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Why did Kirk let Chekov "Man the Weapons Console" in TWOK

enterprisecvn65

Captain
Captain
I know the answer is because it would have been a dick thing to do to say "No get your ass back to sick bay" and so Chekov could payback in kind Khan for all his hospitality.

But really.....This was just another in a line of things in TWOK that shows Kirk really wasn't on top of his game.

1. Lets another Federation ship that is acting strangely, and flat out lies to them about a mechanical issue they're having, approach right next to the Enterprise and doesn't raise his shields, even though the regs say he should and even when Reliant raises hers he still hesitates until it's too late.

2. Seems to forget that Reliant is carrying this weapon capable of destroying everything in sight an that maybe he should either use the nebula to try and slip away for help, or have a commando team ready to beam over immediately after they disable Reliant to secure Genesis on the off chance Khan is still alive and willing to use it and give up his own life to fulfill his vow of revenge against Kirk. Something not too far fetched to think about given how fanatical and rage filled Khan has been throughout and basically shown he'll stop at nothing to get his vengence.

3. Seems to completely not notice his best friend and right hand man slips away with a disaster looming and even after they've escaped doesn't turn to where he should be and say something.

4. During at least for the last 30 seconds of the Genesis countdown, could be more because we don't know when he took up this posture, is just sitting in his chair with his arms folded basically saying "Well, we're fucked this time sorry folks nothing I can do" When, as the commanding officer, he should been screaming in into the intercom at engineering non stop for someone to respond or do something right up to the moment he is blown to atoms by the genesis explosion.

And then there is the Chekov thing. Sure it was nice Chekov came to the bridge to ask if he could help, but he is still clearly F'ed up from the Ceri Eel. He is sewating heavily, walking unsteadily and speaking in a slow and halting manner, all of which indicate he is not fit for action. But instead of ordering him back to sick bay or telling he can just hang out on the bridge he tells him to man the WEAPONS console:confused: Right in the middle of a battle where all computer weapon locking devices are not functioning and you have to aim manually?

I mean really Chekov's that important that even though his equalibrium and balance and motor skills are still impaired you're going to let him be the one to shoot at the Reliant. I mean couldn't Sulu do it? He fired all the phaser shots so far and in STIII Scotty was able to fire photon torpedos from the forward station, so it wasn't a matter of they specifically needed someone at the console Chekov was assigned to. Really as a commanding officer isn't it your duty do decide "Uh...you still look pretty messed up, just grab a seat and hang out" and not give such an important task to someone like that just because you like him.

Well of course Kirk's faith was proved correct as both torpedoes Chekov fired (I'm assuming sulu still fired the phasers) hit and caused catastrophic damage....but really was it a wise command decision? I mean if you play a game of Russian roulette with 5 others and win...OK you were lucky and won. Great, but was it smart to play the game in the first place?

Just seems Kirk couldn't see the bigger picture in many instances here.
 
I was surprised the Weapons Console was not being used until Chekov got there- while Sulu had some controls for the weapons the specialized console had more and better sensors. I know Kirk wanted Sulu at the helm during the battle, but in a fight like that you would think having every advantage you could get.
Chekov was very unsteady and probably had delayed reaction speed as well, but there should have been somebody on the ship that could have taken his place.
Having a few people with communicators looking out hte windows for the Reliant would have helped also...
 
Chekov was presumably the chief weapons officer in TMP. Depending on what theory you describe to regarding what happened between TMP and TWOK, Chekov may have served in that capacity for several years on the Enterprise. Chekov's unsteadiness may have been temporary or confined solely to when he was walking.
 
Chekov was presumably the chief weapons officer in TMP. Depending on what theory you describe to regarding what happened between TMP and TWOK, Chekov may have served in that capacity for several years on the Enterprise. Chekov's unsteadiness may have been temporary or confined solely to when he was walking.

Yeah but how was Kirk supposed to know that. If Spock had been in command he would have "I'm sorry but since you seem unable to walk or talk normally and are sweating profusely and have just been through a trauma affecting your BRAIN, that logically I must assume your overall senses are impaired and I cannot allow you to man the weapons console at this critical point, especially since we are aiming manually."
 
I was surprised the Weapons Console was not being used until Chekov got there- while Sulu had some controls for the weapons the specialized console had more and better sensors. I know Kirk wanted Sulu at the helm during the battle, but in a fight like that you would think having every advantage you could get.
Chekov was very unsteady and probably had delayed reaction speed as well, but there should have been somebody on the ship that could have taken his place.
Having a few people with communicators looking out hte windows for the Reliant would have helped also...
:lol: Good point I never thought of that. What did starfleet have against Windows? I mean they were installed on the ships but never used in situations were the viewscreen was disabled. Or why not keep the viewscreen for all of its advantages but put a couple of big picture size windows on either side of it just in case.
 
Don't forget that the majority of the crew is cadets originally on a training cruise. So it's possible there are no commando units aboard, no one more qualified than Chekov at tactical, and other questions that might arise.
 
Chekov was presumably the chief weapons officer in TMP. Depending on what theory you describe to regarding what happened between TMP and TWOK, Chekov may have served in that capacity for several years on the Enterprise. Chekov's unsteadiness may have been temporary or confined solely to when he was walking.

Yeah but how was Kirk supposed to know that.
He didn't. He simply trusted Chekov, relying on what he knew of him from their years of service together (as such, Kirk may have known that if Chekov himself didn't think he was capable of helping on the bridge, he would have stayed in sickbay).

Was it a gamble that Chekov might not be fit yet to return to duty? Possibly. But perhaps not to James T. Kirk who had faith in Chekov.
What did starfleet have against Windows? I mean they were installed on the ships but never used in situations were the viewscreen was disabled. Or why not keep the viewscreen for all of its advantages but put a couple of big picture size windows on either side of it just in case.
Despite the ships appearing to be at near point-blank range onscreen (due to the restraints of cameras), onscreen dialogue had them miles apart. Inside a swirling nebula, they'd probably really only be visible to one another with the naked eye (or with binoculars) long after they passed within weapons range of one another.
 
commandos? whenever Star Trek had any commandos?
Um I think Kirk goes commando.
But the reason that Kirk lets some dodgy guy on the weapons console is that he phasered the eel that slithered out of his ear. And that they were on a ship full of trainees and Kirk needed all the help he could get.
 
...OTOH, the young officer from the Kobayashi Maru simulation who manned the tactical console there was not shown to have been killed by Khan yet. Why not use him? Kirk didn't worry about letting Saavik do her job.

Having a few people with communicators looking out hte windows for the Reliant would have helped also...

I don't see how. That'd only work at point blank range, and at such a range, the viewscreen worked just fine, too.

When, as the commanding officer, he should been screaming in into the intercom at engineering non stop for someone to respond or do something right up to the moment he is blown to atoms by the genesis explosion.

Why?

Timo Saloniemi
 
I don't think McCoy would have let Chekov out of sick bay if he wasn't fit enough to fill a spot in an emergency situation.

In TVH, Chekov was in critical condition about to go under the knife, but onscreen minutes after McCoy employed the magic brain fixer "Admiral" Chekov was back at the navigation console.

ETA: I think Chekov showed up on the bridge, at least partially, to atone for "sins" committed while under the influence of the evil brain slug. The fact that he was given the weapons console showed that there was no ill will and Kirk still trusted him.
 
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Re: Why did Kirk let Chekov "Man the Weapons Console" in TWOK

Because of the deleted scene where Chekov runs from sickbay to the bridge yelling, "I can do zat! I CAN DO ZAT!"

Poor guy just wants to feel important, y'know?
 
IIRC in the novelization Chekov slips out of Sickbay without permission, and IIRRC David helps him do it, with reservations, and it's in part because Sulu's been injured during the nebula battle.
 
...OTOH, the young officer from the Kobayashi Maru simulation who manned the tactical console there was not shown to have been killed by Khan yet. Why not use him? Kirk didn't worry about letting Saavik do her job.

Having a few people with communicators looking out hte windows for the Reliant would have helped also...

I don't see how. That'd only work at point blank range, and at such a range, the viewscreen worked just fine, too.

When, as the commanding officer, he should been screaming in into the intercom at engineering non stop for someone to respond or do something right up to the moment he is blown to atoms by the genesis explosion.

Why?

Timo Saloniemi

Because he's the mother fucking commanding officer and its duty to everything he possibly can to save his ship and crew. How did he know engineering couldn't hear him even if they couldn't respond and if talked enough someone might hear his directions. At least that what good captains do, not just sit on their ass saying well it's over. There are many tales of real life captains who did everthing they could even when the ship was clearly lost.
 
commandos? whenever Star Trek had any commandos?


Don't be so literal. My point was that maybe knowing there was a powerful destructive device on board maybe it would have been a good idea to send over an armed boarding party to find genesis and secure it. Instead of just assuming "Well Khan's dead I'm sure, and even if he isn't I'm sure he won't activate genesis knowing that it's over for him and he has nothing to lose now....He certanily hasn't shown over the film he's complete crazy and obsessed or anything like that."

I swear Spock's head would explode if he read this board. "commandos, the enterprise doesn't carry commandos so your whole idea of securing genesis with any kind of group you can muster up is wrong"
 
commandos? whenever Star Trek had any commandos?


Don't be so literal. My point was that maybe knowing there was a powerful destructive device on board maybe it would have been a good idea to send over an armed boarding party to find genesis and secure it. Instead of just assuming "Well Khan's dead I'm sure, and even if he isn't I'm sure he won't activate genesis knowing that it's over for him and he has nothing to lose now....He certanily hasn't shown over the film he's complete crazy and obsessed or anything like that."

I swear Spock's head would explode if he read this board. "commandos, the enterprise doesn't carry commandos so your whole idea of securing genesis with any kind of group you can muster up is wrong"

Well, if the sensors couldn't work well enough for a weapons lock, I'd be even less confident about a transporter lock. And I think we can infer from the pacing and dialogue that there'd be even less time to send over a boarding party via shuttle (or even that fancy-schmancy space suit sequence in STID).
 
When, as the commanding officer, he should been screaming in into the intercom at engineering non stop for someone to respond or do something right up to the moment he is blown to atoms by the genesis explosion.
Why?

Kirk was waiting until the moment of the big boom, at which point he'd say, "I'm getting too old for this $#!t."

It would actually fit the tone of the movie.

commandos? whenever Star Trek had any commandos?
Whenever the OP thinks they did, I guess. I was only mentioning them because he brought it up. They must keep Arnold, Carl Weathers, and Jesse Ventura down on a lower deck somewhere.

Naah... the only "commando" they need is Scotty, whenever he wears the kilt.
 
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