Wrath of Khan's Big BooBoo

[Marsden]

How bad was Scott injured. I always noticed he seems to be a bit singed especially on the left side, maybe he couldn't get to a working intercom, realized his nephew really wasn't going to make it and decided he needed to report to the bridge what was happening in engineering?


I agree with J.T.B. Dramatic license is the main reason for this. It certainly worked, too. And I hate when in movies and tv shows something happens, like driving off Reliant instead of being blown up, and everyone acts like it's Miller Time ™ and nothing wrong ever happened. That scene certainly put an end to that.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Meh, we're discussing Preston again? Okay....

If Scott knew Preston was going to die, because of what his radiation badge said and what Scott could see of his wounds, and knew that he'd be waiting in triage behind savable cadets, then Scott might just say what the hell, if Preston asked to see the captain. That cut to the exterior of the ship slowly rotating immediately afterwards suggests that time has passed before McCoy gets around to seeing him.

But, yeah, dramatic license.

 

[DonIago]

Scotty secretly hated his nephew, but couldn't risk his feelings being made public.

So, he was all, "Oops, too late for you...but your dying wish is doubtless to see the Admiral!" At worst he can claim he thought Preston was on his last legs, at best he actually is on his last legs. And maybe his diversion to the bridge will move things from "could be saved" to "can't be saved."

 

[CorporalCaptain]

^

Did I say captain? I meant Admiral!

 

[Marsden]

Meh, we're discussing Preston again? Okay....

.

I was more discussing Scotty, but yeah Preston's corpse was there.

 

[Melakon]

Twenty of Khan's followers fell victim to the ceti eels. How many of them did he intentionally sacrifice while learning its victims were subject to the power of suggestion?

 

[FormerLurker]

They could well have lost fifteen of them in the six months before Ceti Alpha Six exploded.

 

[Timo]

"Space Seed" suggested interfighting as the preferred lifestyle of the supermen. I'd expect a lot of that to happen after the banishment! And of course the winner would sire the most kids, hence to relative uniformity of phenotypes.

I wonder whether something similar happened to the Romulans. They supposedly left Vulcan for their inalienable right to keep on fighting each other. Perhaps the forehead ridges were the inevitable result in no time flat?

Timo Saloniemi

 

[KarmicCurse]

I don't mind an occasional line or two out of whack as long as the plot has no holes. But there's one hole that snaps me out of an otherwise excellent movie: Why didn't they just blow up the Reliant when Genesis was on a build up? You might say that would immediately have triggered the Genesis effect, but if it was ready to go then there would not have been a build up.

Also we really should have had a moment where Khan sees the Enterprise warp away just before the kaboom. It would have been very satisfying for the audience. Khan died thinking he got the revenge he sought.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I don't mind an occasional line or two out of whack as long as the plot has no holes. But there's one hole that snaps me out of an otherwise excellent movie: Why didn't they just blow up the Reliant when Genesis was on a build up? You might say that would immediately have triggered the Genesis effect, but if it was ready to go then there would not have been a build up.

David said it couldn't be stopped, and he should know, so blowing up Reliant wouldn't have stopped it. What David said trumps any suppositions one might have about what rules it should obey. The thing is a magic device, and no one can explain how it operates in the first place.

 

[Shark]

There are no examples in TOS of our heroes idly scanning a star system for irrelevant things such as the number of planets. They focus on their target, as typically they have a schedule to keep. If some nerdy science officer belowdecks performs routine charting on the side, he won't be in a position to realize he should be relaying his as such utterly uninteresting findings to the Bridge ASAP!

The most common way they get anywhere in TOS is to "plot" and "lay in" a "course." That's navigation. To navigate, you have to have a model to tell you where your destination is, or, with a planet, where it will be when you arrive. The best way to keep a schedule would be to plot the most direct course. The Ceti Alpha system was known and charted, Kirk knew it was along their route and Spock knew which planet was habitable. The idea the Reliant came into a charted system and just bumbled around looking at planets, never using its navigation data, is ridiculous.

TWOK is a good movie that has some dumb stuff in it. Meyer approached it on the level of a classic adventure yarn, where deep scrutiny and questioning would be missing the point.

You know, put in this context it really is amusing.

Of course, Captain Dathon's and Commander screams-a-lot's attitude is mildly amusing as well. It's clear these dudes just want to get this stuff over with. Kinda flies in the face of the TNG "We're happy spending centuries scanning things" ethos. Just once I would've liked to have heard Riker say "Screw this, I'm joining a space-band."

 

[Shark]

I don't mind an occasional line or two out of whack as long as the plot has no holes. But there's one hole that snaps me out of an otherwise excellent movie: Why didn't they just blow up the Reliant when Genesis was on a build up? You might say that would immediately have triggered the Genesis effect, but if it was ready to go then there would not have been a build up.

Also we really should have had a moment where Khan sees the Enterprise warp away just before the kaboom. It would have been very satisfying for the audience. Khan died thinking he got the revenge he sought.

Right? No device, no effect. But it's all a matter of plot.

 

[Timo]

Is this really a common viewpoint? There's a big bomb threatening our heroes - solution: shoot at it? I somehow doubt it would have seemed a reasonable course of action to most of the audience... But perhaps I'm way off base there.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Marsden]

I don't mind an occasional line or two out of whack as long as the plot has no holes. But there's one hole that snaps me out of an otherwise excellent movie: Why didn't they just blow up the Reliant when Genesis was on a build up? You might say that would immediately have triggered the Genesis effect, but if it was ready to go then there would not have been a build up.

David said it couldn't be stopped, and he should know, so blowing up Reliant wouldn't have stopped it. What David said trumps any suppositions one might have about what rules it should obey. The thing is a magic device, and no one can explain how it operates in the first place.

Actually, I never thought of that.

And David said it couldn't be stopped, but how could it continue if it was destroyed by a few photon torpedoes?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I don't mind an occasional line or two out of whack as long as the plot has no holes. But there's one hole that snaps me out of an otherwise excellent movie: Why didn't they just blow up the Reliant when Genesis was on a build up? You might say that would immediately have triggered the Genesis effect, but if it was ready to go then there would not have been a build up.

David said it couldn't be stopped, and he should know, so blowing up Reliant wouldn't have stopped it. What David said trumps any suppositions one might have about what rules it should obey. The thing is a magic device, and no one can explain how it operates in the first place.

Actually, I never thought of that.

And David said it couldn't be stopped, but how could it continue if it was destroyed by a few photon torpedoes?

Like I said, it's a magic device that can't be explained. We find out in the next film that it uses protomatter, whatever that is, but it's something dangerously unstable. Maybe it eats photon torpedoes for breakfast, or maybe hitting it with a photon torpedo would just make it go KABOOM, rip a hole in the universe, and kill them all anyway.

 

[DonIago]

I was thinking that maybe the countdown was to a controlled release, whereas a torpedo detonation would cause an uncontrolled release. Potentially even more dangerous.

 

[Timo]

There is that scary blue-white thing whirling and radiating inside. Do we really want to let the genie out of the brittle-looking bottle?

That's the visual impression and dramatic analogy they were going for, probably...

But it's a more general thing, too. Trek is full of characters who are experts on fictional things. Why pick and choose whom to believe? It's painfully obvious that Kosinski is a false prophet when it comes to transwarp travel, but the material is neutral on whether David knows what he is talking about - so why doubt his word? Similarly, if LaForge says he can't save the ship, or Spock says he can't decipher the mystery, why hunt for a second opinion? From whom?

Timo Saloniemi