Worst tos episode

[Tallguy]

For those in the Spock's Brain camp (the "conventional wisdom" or the "no-brainer answer"):

Why would you rather watch (for example):
The Alternative Factor
I, Mudd
The Empath
And the Children Shall Lead
Plato's Stepchildren
The Lights of Zetar
Turnabout Intruder

instead of Spock's Brain? Or maybe find the episode that you consider the second to the worst and consider why that episode is worse than every other episode and is STILL better than Spock's Brain?

(These are not necessarily my worst although The Lights of Zetar is moving up fast in my ranking. I understand I, Mudd is kinda fun. So is Spock's Brain.)

 

[Farscape One]

For those in the Spock's Brain camp (the "conventional wisdom" or the "no-brainer answer"):

Why would you rather watch (for example):
The Alternative Factor
I, Mudd
The Empath
And the Children Shall Lead
Plato's Stepchildren
The Lights of Zetar
Turnabout Intruder

instead of Spock's Brain? Or maybe find the episode that you consider the second to the worst and consider why that episode is worse than every other episode and is STILL better than Spock's Brain?

(These are not necessarily my worst although The Lights of Zetar is moving up fast in my ranking. I understand I, Mudd is kinda fun. So is Spock's Brain.)

"I, MUDD" and "THE EMPATH" certainly don't belong on a 'worst of TOS' list. One is a comedy (and knows it) and is pretty funny while the other has probably the best example of the brotherhood of Kirk, Spock, and McCoy in the franchise and has a fantastic mood and atmosphere.


While "SPOCK'S BRAIN" is lower tier TOS, it actually has some good ideas in it. And the bridge scene where everyone was chiming in with ideas was really well done.

"THE LIGHTS OF ZETAR" was, to be honest, pretty boring. Which is probably the worst thing a piece of entertainment can be, so it definitely can go to the bottom tier of TOS.

"TURNABOUT INTRUDER" is pretty bad, but Sandra Smith and William Shatner both acted the hell out of it, elevating it somewhat. Still bottom tier TOS.

"PLATO'S STEPCHILDREN" - I totally get why it's called the worst by many, and if not for Alexander, I would probably agree. I would call this the 4th worst episode of TOS.

"THE ALTERNATIVE FACTOR" - this was just a mess of an episode. Easily one of the worst of TOS. For me, the second worst. ("AND THE CHILDREN SHALL LEAD" is obviously the worst.) Robert Brown gave a good performance... but it was just so hard to keep it all straight.


I'm surprised you didn't mention "THE WAY TO EDEN", which is another widely regarded 'worst of TOS' episode, and rightly so. (For me, the 3rd worst. The only reason I don't put it as second worst is because it at least gave Chekov some material. But by the Prophets, was the music in this one annoying and atrocious. When my wife did a watch of TOS with me, she asked me, "I thought you loved me. WHY would you show me this?")

 

[Grant]

Plato's Stepchildren and And the Children....
are like Lazarus -- fighting for all eternity in that negative universe tunnel trying to be worst.
One of my worst is Miri. Bonk bonk indeed.
Interesting two of my worst have children in the name and Miri is all about children
Piece of the Action has that annoying kid on it -- don't like that one either....
I despise Mudds Women as well -- and I, Mudd too. Can't stand the Apple either.
Action
Apple
Alternative
And the Children
stepChildren
I, Mudd
Mudd's Women
Spock's Brain (child like women...hmm)
Zetar

Those are my worst AtoZ

I actually like Way to Eden minus the songs and costumes. I love the ship being hijacked by privileged cultist brats led by a madman.
Weren't most Charles Manson followers from upper middle class families?

Hey, that list makes it look like I dislike women and children...not true!! I don't care for mud though.

 

[suarezguy]

These are not necessarily my worst although The Lights of Zetar is moving up fast in my ranking. I understand I, Mudd is kinda fun. So is Spock's Brain.

It probably is low expectations after "Mudd's Women" but I find "I, Mudd" pretty strong/well-done, I think the humor just fits in much, much better, "Spock's Brain" was just really annoyingly trying to make fun of the characters more than just let them have fun.

Yeah everyone agrees "And the Children Shall Lead" was pretty terrible, one of the worst, but even with it I think it had some interesting ideas/moments and OTOH the bad ideas are obviously, unavoidably bad (so at least a little excusable) but not quite as bad or annoying as (more so bad just shouldn't have been done) the whole brain-stealing and reacting.

"The Empath" I do consider pretty bad and in part annoying for the pretty gratuitous sadism but just not as bad or annoying. "The Lights of Zetar" was pretty boring, still a few times interesting, but that's not such a terrible flaw, "Turnabout Intruder" definitely mixed bag rather than real bad.

 

[Airin]

I'm Tweedledee I'm Tweedledum

Just read the earlier draft version of the script from the other thread.
The writer has Chapel kiss Spock on the lips on the bridge AFTER they return to the ship -- as a joke -- and she teases that Kirk made her do it with his powers.
There is also a line in the script about the Platonians being worse "than kids who poke out the eyes of stray cats."
The episode is by a writer who didn't understand Trek at all.
But late season 3 they were hiring writers who thought kids mutilating domestic pets was still a thing in Roddenberrys vision of the future and that kissing people without consent was only bad if "bad people" were the ones doing it.
So yeah somehow it could have been even worse.

https://tvwriting.co.uk/tv_scripts/Collections/Drama/Star_Trek/1_Original_Series/Star_Trek_3x10_-_Platos_Stepchildren.pdf

Yeah, the early drafts were worse in several areas. For example, Kirk is made to kiss a yeoman (presumably white) instead of Uhura (who kisses nobody, of course). The yeoman is first offended by Kirk showing reluctance to kiss her, and takes that as meaning she's ugly! As if being forced to kiss someone wasn't enough reason to show reluctance... And then, to make matters worse, Kirk starts to enjoy the kiss anyway.
Chapel is also incredibly vain and a complete airhead, as she doesn't seem to worry much about their situation as long as she's given a banquet and the opportunity to kiss "her Mr. Spock".

I guess that the changes in the filmed episode were made by Freiberger at the last minute. I think the guy isn't given enough credit; many s3 episodes were worse until these final rewrites. If anything, Freiberger's fault was not rewriting more extensivey these episodes, the way that Roddenberry and Coon did earlier.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

The yeoman is first offended by Kirk showing reluctance to kiss her, and takes that as meaning she's ugly!

Harboring a secret crush...a vapid self-insert character about to realize her wildest dream, only to find her crush doesn't share it.

 

[Seven of Five]

My Bottom 5:
And the Children Shall Lead
The Way to Eden
Elaan of Troyus
The Lights of Zetar
The Alternative Factor

Spock's Brain is definitely bad, but it makes me laugh at times.

 

[mb22]

I guess that the changes in the filmed episode were made by Freiberger at the last minute. I think the guy isn't given enough credit; many s3 episodes were worse until these final rewrites. If anything, Freiberger's fault was not rewriting more extensivey these episodes, the way that Roddenberry and Coon did earlier.

Probably not a good idea to have bought those scripts in the first place.

 

[Airin]

Probably not a good idea to have bought those scripts in the first place.

I don't think the problem was so much the scripts they were buying as the lack of personnel and time to polish them. A lot of season 1 and season 2 scripts weren't all that good for Star Trek at first. But they had people like Roddenberry, Coon and Fontana rewriting them. Even scripts like "The City on the Edge of Forever" had the crew doing terribly out-of-character things at first. And then of course comes the problem of the cut budget in season 3.

 

[mb22]

Mention should also be made of third season story editor Arthur Singer (Fontana's replacement), who has been portrayed as being clueless about Star Trek. Unlike Freiberger, Singer (who died in 1978) was never interviewed (as far as I know) and thus we don't know about things from his POV.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

I don't know. Take a list of the third season episodes, add in "The Alternative Factor" from S1, and throw a dart. Whatever it hits is your worst episode.

 

[Rowdy Roddy McDowall]

I don't know. Take a list of the third season episodes, add in "The Alternative Factor" from S1, and throw a dart. Whatever it hits is your worst episode.

DAY OF THE DOVE and THOLIAN WEB among others wouldn't deserve such tarring.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Not even The Alternative Factor does. It's oddball, makes no sense and has a lot of Lazarus Falling, but at not time is it dull.

I'd put a few other episodes on the list of "worst" before I get to The Alternative Factor.

 

[Ssosmcin]

For those in the Spock's Brain camp (the "conventional wisdom" or the "no-brainer answer"):

Why would you rather watch (for example):
The Alternative Factor
I, Mudd
The Empath
And the Children Shall Lead
Plato's Stepchildren
The Lights of Zetar
Turnabout Intruder

instead of Spock's Brain?

I would watch
Spock's Brain
The Alternative Factor
The Empath
Plato's Stepchildren
The Lights of Zetar
Turnabout Intruder

A dozen times before

I, Mudd
And the Children Shall Lead
not to mention
A Piece of the Action
or
Charlie X

 

[Tallguy]

Not even The Alternative Factor does. It's oddball, makes no sense and has a lot of Lazarus Falling, but at not time is it dull.

Alternative Factor bores me to tears.

 

[Ssosmcin]

I'm into it merely for how seriously the cast takes everything. It feels like a pre-Gene Coon episode, there's almost no humor and the music cues lean hard on the pre-Gerald Fried / Joe Mullendore lighter music. The melodrama is heaped on like extra helpings of mashed potatoes at family dinner.

LAZARUS: I told you it was a thing. All white, black and empty. A terrible emptiness.
KIRK: Let's get back to the ship.
LAZARUS: He'll kill us all if we don't kill him first! Kill! Kill! Kill! Kill! Kill!

Or

KIRK: What's going on? This leaping from universe to universe. This wild talk about a murdering creature who destroys civilizations What's the purpose?
SPOCK: Jim, madness has no purpose or reason, but it may have a goal. He must be stopped, held. Destroyed if necessary.
KIRK: I don't follow you.
SPOCK: Two parallel universes project this. One positive, the other negative. Or, more specifically, one matter, the other antimatter.
KIRK: Do you know what you're saying? Matter and antimatter have a tendency to cancel each other out. violently.
SPOCK: Precisely. Under certain conditions, when two identical particles of matter and antimatter meet
KIRK: Like Lazarus. Identical. Like both Lazarus', only one is matter and the other antimatter. If they meet.
SPOCK: Annihilation, Jim. Total, complete, absolute annihilation.
KIRK: Of everything that exists, everywhere.

and of course...

KIRK: Everything's all right, Mister Spock, for us.
SPOCK: There is, of course, no escape for them, sir.
KIRK: There is, of course, no escape. How would it be? Trapped forever with a raging madman at your throat until time itself came to a stop? For eternity. How would it be?
SPOCK: Captain, the universe is safe.
KIRK: For you and me. But what of Lazarus? What of Lazarus...?

It's like the writing staff was being paid by the word. Or simply "ugh we're short, so keep fillingin those minutes." Such gloriously overwritten dialog.

Plus we get some great Spock gems like

SPOCK: I fail to comprehend your indignation, sir. I've simply made the logical deduction that you are a liar.

I find this episode impossible to hate.

 

[MarcKle1964]

From the perspective of a younger male TOS watcher at least, METAMORPHOSIS, REQUIEM FOR METHUSELAH and THE EMPATH have some unappealing slow scenes. As a much older TOS fan, I appreciate Rayna but despise Flint's selfishness. Many say METAMORPHOSIS lacks agency because the Companion saves the life of a humanoid women who is too sick to grant permission.

Now....I still think EMPATH has a great message but extra-despicable villains who torture everybody else in sight save Spock. And it seems slower than ever because of the interminable pink-lighted forcefield which traps Kirk and Spock in Act Four. Is it bad? In a few ways. Is it duller than EDEN or CHILDREN? Yes, ultimately. Those two aren't dull.....while those two also don't benefit from Robert Brown's GOOD Lazarus portrayal.

Summing up, the third year certainly has the worst overall installments, but to singularly pick out EDEN or CHILDREN would almost be too cruel or redundant.....I only hope no one selects PLATO or CATSPAW, while realizing I'm being unfair to THE EMPATH in certain ways.

I refuse to watch Empath because of the torture.

 

[MarcKle1964]

I would rather watch bad/fun like SB or TWTE which are both are at least campy (The Mamas And The Papas & Mirror, Mirror Ken Kesey in Spaaacce and Walkin', Talkin' Spockbot & the GEICO cavemen are fun if I turn my brain down to about 15% or enter MST3K mode) than watch bad/boring or bad/pointless eps that seem filmed merely to keep a paycheck coming but are...artless. No proof of passion or an interesting variation on a theme, but the same old story with an altered VIN.

Entertain me, don't bore me. I'm trading some of my finite minutes here to experience your vision. Don't waste 'em.

Hey guys, which episodes seem to be made only for a paycheck? No art, no passion, no nuttin' and you'd rather watch Moe, Larry, Curly & Shemp than see it again?

 

[JonnyQuest037]

Alternative Factor bores me to tears.

Same here. It's both dull and extremely confusing, which is real feat.

 

[Poltargyst]

I'm into it merely for how seriously the cast takes everything. It feels like a pre-Gene Coon episode, there's almost no humor and the music cues lean hard on the pre-Gerald Fried / Joe Mullendore lighter music. The melodrama is heaped on like extra helpings of mashed potatoes at family dinner.

LAZARUS: I told you it was a thing. All white, black and empty. A terrible emptiness.
KIRK: Let's get back to the ship.
LAZARUS: He'll kill us all if we don't kill him first! Kill! Kill! Kill! Kill! Kill!

Or

KIRK: What's going on? This leaping from universe to universe. This wild talk about a murdering creature who destroys civilizations What's the purpose?
SPOCK: Jim, madness has no purpose or reason, but it may have a goal. He must be stopped, held. Destroyed if necessary.
KIRK: I don't follow you.
SPOCK: Two parallel universes project this. One positive, the other negative. Or, more specifically, one matter, the other antimatter.
KIRK: Do you know what you're saying? Matter and antimatter have a tendency to cancel each other out. violently.
SPOCK: Precisely. Under certain conditions, when two identical particles of matter and antimatter meet
KIRK: Like Lazarus. Identical. Like both Lazarus', only one is matter and the other antimatter. If they meet.
SPOCK: Annihilation, Jim. Total, complete, absolute annihilation.
KIRK: Of everything that exists, everywhere.

and of course...

KIRK: Everything's all right, Mister Spock, for us.
SPOCK: There is, of course, no escape for them, sir.
KIRK: There is, of course, no escape. How would it be? Trapped forever with a raging madman at your throat until time itself came to a stop? For eternity. How would it be?
SPOCK: Captain, the universe is safe.
KIRK: For you and me. But what of Lazarus? What of Lazarus...?

It's like the writing staff was being paid by the word. Or simply "ugh we're short, so keep fillingin those minutes." Such gloriously overwritten dialog.

Plus we get some great Spock gems like

SPOCK: I fail to comprehend your indignation, sir. I've simply made the logical deduction that you are a liar.

I find this episode impossible to hate.

I could see that if the Lazerii were to touch in a universe (as opposed to that in-between place) it would create a mighty explosion, but why should it destroy the entrire universe?