Windows?

[Timo]

In terms of today's physics, if it is transparent, then it is rigid and shatters. Doesn't matter whether it is/contains aluminum or not; it can't have the free electrons that make metals malleable, or those will gobble up all the light.

Doesn't necessarily mean it would be weaker than the non-transparent bits, of course. It might be perfectly valid to make the whole ship out of the window stuff and then just paint some bits over, as with Larry Niven's General Products hulls. But in Trek, we see windows shatter and we don't see walls shatter. So either the windows are an accepted weakness, or then the walls fail in some other fashion no later than the windows do.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mytran]

The windows are always shown as being a lot thinner than the walls though

 

[Timo]

Might just mean the transparent stuff is that much stronger than the opaque stuff.

Or that there is stuff between the very thin opaque layers of the walls, but that it is not a good idea to put stuff where the windows are.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mytran]

Might just mean the transparent stuff is that much stronger than the opaque stuff.

That's not really compatible with this though:

In terms of today's physics, if it is transparent, then it is rigid and shatters. Doesn't matter whether it is/contains aluminum or not; it can't have the free electrons that make metals malleable, or those will gobble up all the light.

As to your second point:

Or that there is stuff between the very thin opaque layers of the walls, but that it is not a good idea to put stuff where the windows are.

We sort of see that in the shows, where the outer hull sticks out further than the window "glass" and intrudes further into the cabins on the inside. There could well be a layer of transparent aluminium sandwiched there as well, of course.

TBH, all this talk of breaking windows just reinforces my belief that they are a really bad thing to put on a starship!

 

[Timo]

That something "is rigid and shatters" doesn't mean it would be weak. This just describes its failure mode. A plate made of two inches of good quality diamond would be rigid and would shatter, but would still be much more durable than two inches of steel or titanium that "is soft and tears" as a failure mode.

Nothing so far forces us to think that windows would be a weak point on starships. Sometimes they break. Sometimes walls tear open. Sometimes warp cores blow up. Apparently, none of these three pose a statistically significant risk that should be alleviated by removing the windows, the walls or the warp cores...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mytran]

Except that the windows shatter upon a mere crash landing in Generations (even the bridge dome!) whereas the wall remain nicely intact. The weak point of the saucer clearly seems to be the transparent areas

 

[Timo]

But as said, this is only one instance. In other instances, it is the walls that tear while windows do fine. And even in this instance, we can't really say the walls did not tear, except on the bridge.

Sounds like misleading bias, is all.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[STEPhon IT]

I don't recall Klingon disruptors hitting all 2000 windows, or the dome atop the bridge that does shatter... nope. It's just an effect meant for tension and drama.

I call it another heads up their asses moment with the team of Berman and Company. That glass shattering scene was stupid, as a matter of fact, that entire movie was stupid.

 

[Steven P Bastien]

My house would be more secure from intrusion if I had no windows and windowless doors with massive deadbolts. But, who would want to live there. Not me, at least.

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

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[Prax]

"a mere crash landing"

 

[Mytran]

"a mere crash landing"

Given what the ship has been through (and what conditions it has to endure even during normal flight) then I stand by my choice of adjective.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I was hoping this thread was about the holodecks and their unreliable operating system.

 

[Stroudarian]

I think I remember an episode of TNG with Lt. Commander Data referencing a Transparent Aluminum Alloy, but I might be mistaken. It makes sense, considering in the movie “Star Trek: The Voyage Home”, Dr. McCoy and Commander Scott are discussing the invention of the formula for such material.

 

[Mytran]

I think I remember an episode of TNG with Lt. Commander Data referencing a Transparent Aluminum Alloy, but I might be mistaken. It makes sense, considering in the movie “Star Trek: The Voyage Home”, Dr. McCoy and Commander Scott are discussing the invention of the formula for such material.

I can tell you started reading on page 2 of this thread

According to Data in the episode In Theory, the windows are made of a transparent aluminium alloy

Found the line in question.

DATA: I detect no unusual readings along standard parameters. Curious. The transparent aluminum alloy of this window is exhibiting a pattern of transient electrical currents.

There you have it, folks; end of thread. As for glass shattering in the scenes mentioned in this thread, we can rationalize as those scenes taking place in alternate universes. I've seen that rationale pop up around here from time to time .

 

[Boomstick]

I always assumed it was solidified Vulcan saliva.

 

[dauntless]

I think I remember an episode of TNG with Lt. Commander Data referencing a Transparent Aluminum Alloy, but I might be mistaken. It makes sense, considering in the movie “Star Trek: The Voyage Home”, Dr. McCoy and Commander Scott are discussing the invention of the formula for such material.

Isn't that the 'Hello Computer' scene?

I was going to give a long winded explanation from the 90s TNG Tech Manual but yes, it's transparent aluminium.