Why the uniform colour switch?

[Daneel]

I was watching "Trials and Tribble-ations" the other day. During the scene where O'Brien tells Bashir that Command wore gold in the 23rd century and Operations wore red, I started to wonder: why was it switched? Why did TNG (and the subsequent 24th century series) have Command officers in red uniforms and Engineering/Security/Operations officers in gold uniforms when the original series gave us the opposite?

I'm looking for both an in-universe explanation (if there ever was one somewhere) and a production/creative explanation. Did they think that the new style of uniforms looked better in red than gold, and thus they decided to have the higher-ranking characters in the former? Did they just not want to hear any more redshirt jokes?

Any answers or theories are welcome.

 

[Dale]

The production/creative explanation was that Patrick Stewart did not look good in gold. Seriously. I think Data's skin color also factored into the decision.

 

[sbk1234]

For an in-universe explanation, I actually read somewhere that Starfleet made the switch in response to the rumors about unlucky red shirts. Sounds kind of assinine to me. Personally, it does seem like a natural evolution to me, since between TOS and TNG, there was the movie era uniforms which were mostly red.

 

[Praetor]

I'm pretty say what Dale said is correct. sbk1234, the movie uniform in-universe explanation is a very good one.

 

[Dale]

When the movie unis were all red, weren't departments noted by collar colors? I recall a grey and a beige in addition to the white worn by command, though I could be mistaken.

 

[Nardpuncher]

When the movie unis were all red, weren't departments noted by collar colors? I recall a grey and a beige in addition to the white worn by command, though I could be mistaken.

That's right. I think McCoy may have had some teal blue one...but I don't recall. Surely someone will be along with some pics!

 

[Amaris]

When the movie unis were all red, weren't departments noted by collar colors? I recall a grey and a beige in addition to the white worn by command, though I could be mistaken.

From Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfleet_uniforms

Star Trek II through Star Trek VI and Star Trek:Generations

The uniforms were redesigned for Star Trek II The Wrath of Khan. The second movie-era uniform consists of a burgundy single-breasted jacket with a colored strip over the right shoulder designating division, attached to which is a rank pin. A white, gold, grey, dark green, light green, dark blue, light blue or red colored turtle-neck under the jacket indicates division. All officer uniforms have a red stripe on the outside of the legs on the trouers or skirt.
All uniforms include the arrowhead insignia from TOS, now adopted as the Starfleet emblem, on the left chest. Characters also wear a black belt with a buckle shaped like the Starfleet arrowhead.

Here's a pic where you can see the different colored turtlenecks:

I believe Sulu's is gold, Chekov's is grey, I can't see Scotty's, Kirk's is white, McCoy's is green, Uhura's is light blue, Saavik's is red.

By the way, these are my favorite uniforms.

J.

 

[Daneel]

Interesting answers guys, thanks. And thanks for the pic, J. Allen. I never really looked at the movie uniforms too closely -- the overwhelming amount of burgundy made them blend together a bit, at least to my eyes. I did like the look of them though.

In-universe, yeah, I did wonder if maybe the Command = Red decision was influenced by the movie time-period when all Starfleet uniforms were predominantly that colour. It seems as good an explanation as any.

 

[JNG]

The production/creative explanation was that Patrick Stewart did not look good in gold. Seriously. I think Data's skin color also factored into the decision.

You have nailed it.

 

[KevasTrader]

Regardless of the reason, for some strange reason the colour switch just worked aesthetically for me.

I agree that Patrick Stewart would have looked strange in gold (he certainly looked odd in blue/teal in "Tapestry") and the darker red of the TNG era uniforms looks stronger as a "command" colour, especially in the wake of the movie uniforms.

I actually preferred the Movies and DS9/Voyager approach to uniforms, where department colour is a highlight rather than a feature of the uniform.

Regarding Chekov and Uhura in the movies, I always assumed they wore the same lilac/grey colour (that became the DS9/Voyager) undershirt colour. It's just one of those colours that always looked different under different lighting situations. I think there were too many colours and details going on in the movie uniforms (2 to 6).

 

[Finnegan]

What about the uniform changes from TMP to TWOK and beyond?
I've read that all the actors hated the MP uniforms because they were hot to wear and the fabric was itchy and irritating. Apparently, one of the conditions they all imposed on the production staff was that different uniforms would be needed if they were all going to come "on board" and do the second film in the series, TWOK. Can anyone confirm this?

 

[sbk1234]

I think there were too many colours and details going on in the movie uniforms (2 to 6).

Actually, if you look at the real military, there are even more uniform variations and department denotations.

 

[Green Shirt]

I can't see Scotty's
J.

His neck swallows up the collar. We big necked folks have that problem. BTW, look on his shoulder, its gold.

 

[TS-1838-SWATH]

The production/creative explanation was that Patrick Stewart did not look good in gold. Seriously. I think Data's skin color also factored into the decision.

You have nailed it.

YES this it true as well how Johnathan (sp?) Frakes looked in Gold was also another reason there is a topic in the T.N.G. Section somewhere dealing with this as well

 

[plynch]

I can't see Scotty's
J.

His neck swallows up the collar. We big necked folks have that problem. BTW, look on his shoulder, its gold.

And McCoy's is avocado.

 

[clint g]

I think there were too many colours and details going on in the movie uniforms (2 to 6).

Actually, if you look at the real military, there are even more uniform variations and department denotations.

Indeed. In the US Army there are over a dozen different branch colors. I know the navy has its fair share of colors as well for aircraft carrier crews

 

[Tachyon]

Found this pic and yeah.... he does look better in red, doesn't he?

 

[Skywalker]

Found this pic and yeah.... he does look better in red, doesn't he?

I think he looks fine in gold, but only in the latter TNG uniform:



That's something I did up a month or two ago in the ENT forum, regarding a similar topic.