Why the Dominion could never beat the Borg

[Jono]

Could the Borg assimilate the Great Link?

Possibly not. We've seen that assimilation isn't infallible with Species 8472 being immune, so given the unique nature of Changelings they might also be immune.

Nothing in canon says neither way, but in the DS9-relaunch (non-canon) they showed that a Founder could resist assimilation.

 

[Deckerd]

It would have made a great two-parter though.

 

[Marie1]

I definitely think that Dominion would own the Borg. Or at least put up a rather huge fight. If the Dominion had to retreat, fine, but I'm willing to bet they'd throw a huge ton of subspace mines at the Borg that would probably help, just like transphasic weapons would. If it comes into real space inside the shields... and if they were big enough, or had enough numbers...

Also:

Do we know how much damage 8472 did to the Borg? They eventually went back into their space in the end didn't they?

 

[Sci]

^And the first cube we see last ten seconds against the Enterprise! <_<

I know, transphasic torpedoes.

Destiny has some great parts, but that was a very undramatic way to start the festivities.

Fair enough -- though I felt it was compensated for by the fact that that same cube had obliterated all life on Ramatis, a Federation planet, driving an entire species to extinction in just a few moments.

 

[Deks]

There is a very good possibility that subspace mines could be detected by the Borg easily.
Their sensors are much more advanced in comparison to other races.
Voyager was able to scan at least 2000 LY's ahead with it's Astrometric sensors when they encountered a region with no stars/planets that was about 2000 ly's long, whereas before the lab/sensors were invented, they had an ability to scan in a radius of 40 LY's (at least that's how far Janeway said they scanned for Borg activity when 7 picked up a homing beacon from the U.S.S. Raven).

It isn't just a matter of how much farther Borg sensors can scan ... it's also a matter that they have a way of detecting things regular SF sensors for example don't.

If the Dominion had issues conquering the AQ with a combined force of both the Breen and Cardassians (and the Dominion likely sent about a half of their fleet initially), I have issues with the assumption they'd put up a fight.
They'd essentially be in the same position as the Federation.
Send 1 cube ... sure, it will likely be destroyed.
Send 10 cubes ... well, it's game over.

Also, over the argument if the changelings could be assimilated ...
It's a questionable aspect, but there is a possibility that it could be done if modifications would be done to the nanoprobes that would acquire abilities to shapeshift along with the changelings into whichever state they morph into.
After all, the Borg can incorporate aspects of other biological species into the collective.
8472 were invulnerable due to their extremely powerful immune system ... but at the same time, they were from another dimension, and still susceptible to nanoprobes when reprogrammed to camouflage themselves as the 8472 cells (which is a temporary solution) so they have a shot at destroying the cells in question (actual assimilation would likely be possible with enough time to investigate the matter).

And changelings were still susceptable to biological viruses ... one of which nearly killed them entirely.

 

[Myasishchev]

^And the first cube we see last ten seconds against the Enterprise! <_<

I know, transphasic torpedoes.

Destiny has some great parts, but that was a very undramatic way to start the festivities.

Fair enough -- though I felt it was compensated for by the fact that that same cube had obliterated all life on Ramatis, a Federation planet, driving an entire species to extinction in just a few moments.

The devastation wrought is wrenching enough, to be sure. But obliterating the biosphere of a single planet isn't all that impressive a feat in Star Trek--I'm surprised more worlds weren't scoured clean by the Dominion, especially once they started losing, just like I'm surprised there's not more really high-body-count terrorism given the easy availability of antimatter. But it's okay that it's not too hard to end life on any particular world, because the planets taken by themselves aren't the big stakes, the existence of the federations and empires uniting them are.

Sucks for Riva, though.

 

[captcalhoun]

Why don't the Borg just swarm the Federation with tactical cubes then?

Why would they bother? The Federation is all the way across the galaxy and much less advanced. What would make it so important as to deserve that kind of attention?

because we're an annoyance that they can't assimilate and ultimately because

Spoiler: Destiny

the Borg originated with humans.

 

[Sci]

Why don't the Borg just swarm the Federation with tactical cubes then?

Why would they bother? The Federation is all the way across the galaxy and much less advanced. What would make it so important as to deserve that kind of attention?

because we're an annoyance that they can't assimilate and ultimately because

Spoiler: Destiny

the Borg originated with humans.

Spoiler: Destiny, too

Actually, the Borg don't know that. That knowledge was lost to the ages according to Mack's trilogy.

In Destiny, though, it's explained that the Borg decided to target the Federation for eradication -- not extermination, eradication -- because of Voyager's collapsing their transwarp network in "Endgame," preventing any Borg vessels from using transwarp technology. This major blow was the final straw to the Collective -- the Federation had already thwarted too many attempts at assimilation and thereby proven too much of an irritant and potential future threat. It is implied that the Collective has done this many times in the past to other species that were both highly resistant to assimilation and deemed a potential threat to the Collective.

 

[Stewey]

A lot of interesting thoughts on this one. My own theory is that the founders probably designed the Jem Hadar with biology that could resist the assimilation process.

Simply theory but to me it works.

 

[The Borg Queen]

because of Voyager's collapsing their transwarp network in "Endgame," preventing any Borg vessels from using transwarp technology. This major blow was the final straw to the Collective

But Voyager only took out ONE Transwarp Hub.

The Borg have SIX of them throughout the Galaxy.

 

[Deks]

because of Voyager's collapsing their transwarp network in "Endgame," preventing any Borg vessels from using transwarp technology. This major blow was the final straw to the Collective

But Voyager only took out ONE Transwarp Hub.

The Borg have SIX of them throughout the Galaxy.

You are forgetting that when the crew plotted this plan in the Astrometrics lab (with future Janeway resistant to the idea at the time), it was mentioned by Tuvok himself that ALL of the hubs are interconnected and that a chain reaction would be initiated if they caused a subspace explosion.

Let's also remember that 7 stated: 'the TW network has been obliterated' when they exited the conduit in the AQ riding inside that sphere ... which was perfectly clear in the meaning that ALL hubs in the galaxy were destroyed via subspace explosions in a chain reactions.
And it's only logical because the explosion originated from inside TW.
When they destroyed 1 manifold, it caused a chain reaction that spread to ALL others.

End result= no more TW hubs in the galaxy (and why the Borg finally deemed the Feds as a potentially serious threat even though they may not have perceived them as too big of a one before ... they finally came to the conclusion that the Feds could come up with ideas that just might penetrate their defenses and deal a crippling blow such as the one Voyager did).

 

[The Borg Queen]

Aha, I forgot about that bit.

Why can't the Borg just build some more?

 

[Sci]

because of Voyager's collapsing their transwarp network in "Endgame," preventing any Borg vessels from using transwarp technology. This major blow was the final straw to the Collective

But Voyager only took out ONE Transwarp Hub.

The Borg have SIX of them throughout the Galaxy.

No, "Endgame" made it clear that taking out that one hub had destabilized the entire transwarp network.

Aha, I forgot about that bit.

Why can't the Borg just build some more?

I imagine you're talking about a massive engineering project that would take years to reconstruct.

Plus, even if they can rebuild them, that still means the Federation has established itself in the Borg's mind as a series threat that needs to be exterminated.

 

[Navaros]

Even Voyager beat the Borg tons of times.

The Dominion would wipe the Borg out without even breaking a sweat. No question.

 

[Aquehonga]

These 2 Trek boogeymen {The & The DOMINION} have never met in Trek continuity & the way things look probably never will

Who'd win? I think Paramount would end a /Dominion War the same way King Kong vs Godzilla & Freddy vs Jason ended

Only other logical option is SPECIES 8742 raids the /Dominion wrestling match, extinct-guish-ing BOTH and then..................................

 

[Infern0]

Even Voyager beat the Borg tons of times.

The Dominion would wipe the Borg out without even breaking a sweat. No question.

I think everyone knows that that was dreadful writing, The Galaxy Class Enterprise D could do nothing against Borg Cubes, yet that little intrepid had no problems with them.

 

[Sci]

Even Voyager beat the Borg tons of times.

The Dominion would wipe the Borg out without even breaking a sweat. No question.

I think everyone knows that that was dreadful writing, The Galaxy Class Enterprise D could do nothing against Borg Cubes, yet that little intrepid had no problems with them.

Actually, when you look at it, Voyager actually defeated the Borg only three times before getting magical transphasic torpedoes from the future. Once in "Child's Play" when they managed to beam a photon torpedo onto a ship that a Borg sphere had pulled inside of it to assimilate it, letting the Voyager crew detonate it inside the sphere's shields, damaging it long enough for Voyager to get away, and then twice in "Dark Frontier" against two very small Borg craft -- first by beaming a torpedo onboard a small probe, and then by collapsing a transwarp conduit that they knew a Borg diamond was inside of.

At no point did Voyager ever engage in combat with an actual, honest-to-God cube and emerge victorious before "Endgame."

 

[Meredith]

How about the Borg attacking in the Gamma Quadrant via the Delta Quadrant, and the Dominion and Federation have to team up to Have the Gamma Quadrant because the dominion are getting their changeling asses handed to them?

 

[Anika Hanson]

I dont see why the couldnt, I mean if Janeway and her one ship could thwart the Borg time and time again I dont see why the entire Dominion couldnt

 

[Jono]

How about the Borg attacking in the Gamma Quadrant via the Delta Quadrant, and the Dominion and Federation have to team up to Have the Gamma Quadrant because the dominion are getting their changeling asses handed to them?

I doubt the Federation would be that willing to help. They suffered a two year war where the Dominion invaded and conquered their worlds and killed their citizens, I can see many on the Federation Council not supporting a war to aid the Dominion.

Plus given the fact that it is a war on the other side of the galaxy where the Federation his little knowledge and support the military leaders would be wary of dispatching a large force to aid the Dominion partly due to the fact that ship in the Gamma Quadrant might not be available to aid in the defence of the Alpha Quadrant.