And every time I watch that episode I immediately think back to the Hoshii we saw in "Fight or Flight" and I think "Yeah... nope."
Why is there resistance to the idea of Starfleet being military?
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Join Starfleet: Explore strange new worlds, seek out new life and new civilizations, and disintegrate them.
I always imagine Starfleet recruitment ads showing away teams on paradise planets with nice green pastures that include native females with few inhibitions. "Join Starfleet, explore the universe." Then you join and end up assigned to AR-558, a dark rock pit with Jem'Hadar as neighbours and undetectable subspace mines that can go off anywhere at anytime. Hey, even the Federation practices false advertising.
While I am of course on the "Is a Military" side of the argument, I will point out that at no part in that post you quoted did I call Starfleet military. I just brought up a canonical situation that was at odds with the speculative recruitment ad I thought up.
I can imagine the ads would have changed just before the war started to something more along the lines of recruitment posters for the two World Wars. While Starfleet posters would normally be more peacetime and scientifically inspired after Camp Khitomer back in the 2290s.
Oh no I know that. I was just having fun
It's simple. It's all very apparent onscreen. No mystery. Starfleet is clearly the only interstellar military they have, and it serves that function, but whenever possible it emphasizes other activities. It's emphasis is not military. There. Now our long national nightmare is over.
I sometimes think the resistance to Starfleet being a military is because there are some troubling implications if that is so. Star Trek depicts Starfleet as (at least seemingly) having a tremendous amount of power and influence in Federation affairs, especially if they are functioning in both diplomatic and defensive circles.
We really don't know much about life in the Federation outside the realm of Starfleet, so one could make the argument that the perspective is somewhat skewed. Starfleet is always being posited as presenting "the best and the brightest" the Federation has to offer. It's clear that the Federation pours who knows how much of its' resources into keeping Starfleet operational.
So, we have a system with a command hierarchy that inherently must function undemocratically, bears a tremendous responsibility for both diplomacy and defense, to say nothing of the fact that Section 31 is an extension of their duties in the Federation (though of debatable legality/morality).
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What if Starfleet is the Federation?
Originally, I had the thought (as some have suggested) that the Federation functions like a military dictatorship. What if, as some have suggested, the Federation is really just an alliance of otherwise independent worlds, but Starfleet is what really ties them all together?
That would go a long way toward explaining the enormous power and influence Starfleet appears to wield. That way, it's really Starfleet that runs the Federation, and the Federation Council is the elected leadership to which they are (ideally) accountable.
We really don't know much about life in the Federation outside the realm of Starfleet, so one could make the argument that the perspective is somewhat skewed. Starfleet is always being posited as presenting "the best and the brightest" the Federation has to offer. It's clear that the Federation pours who knows how much of its' resources into keeping Starfleet operational.
So, we have a system with a command hierarchy that inherently must function undemocratically, bears a tremendous responsibility for both diplomacy and defense, to say nothing of the fact that Section 31 is an extension of their duties in the Federation (though of debatable legality/morality).
...
What if Starfleet is the Federation?
Originally, I had the thought (as some have suggested) that the Federation functions like a military dictatorship. What if, as some have suggested, the Federation is really just an alliance of otherwise independent worlds, but Starfleet is what really ties them all together?
That would go a long way toward explaining the enormous power and influence Starfleet appears to wield. That way, it's really Starfleet that runs the Federation, and the Federation Council is the elected leadership to which they are (ideally) accountable.
Only problem with this notion is that Starfleet doesn't seem to operate much inside of Federation space and mostly skirts around the periphery. They also seem to leave member worlds alone for the most part, and even the collective Federation members generally mind their own business.
So I would kind of agree with you up to this point: It could be that the Federation isn't actually that IMPORTANT of an organization to most governments, and is something more similar to the United Nations or NATO. It's certainly a factor in international politics and foreign policy, but it's not even the most important factor, and most Federation members will, in conversation, identify by their home planet or home species and not as "Federation citizens." Earth might be the exception that proves the rule because the Federation is their main contribution to galactic society and they're the main ones holding it together (so it's sort of like a college town that is completely unremarkable except for the fact that it holds the State University and has a Big-10 football team. Nobody gives a shit about the town for any other reason, and nobody in town gives a shit about anything else).
To me, it just works to think of Starfleet as a hybrid agency. Yes, it's a space military, but it's also a space agency. It's like if NASA, NOAA, the Coast Guards, and the Air Force Space Command merged for some reason. Whatever the plot needs Starfleet to be, that's what it is. At least, this approach works for me...
I would certainly agree with the notion that Starfleet often seems to function "for the purposes of this episode".
People overstate how much involvement in diplomacy Starfleet has. The Federation has a separate service dedicated solely to diplomacy, the Diplomatic Corps which is responsible for negotiating and hammering out treaties and all that jazz. Starfleet's role in diplomacy is usually just hosting dignitaries and VIPs and transporting them, which is also something militaries do today.
Incorrect, Section 31 has no connection to Starfleet at all. They are a criminal organization who simply use an interpretation of the thirty-first section of the Starfleet charter as rationalization and justification of their actions and existence.
I think someone already brought that up.
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/why...t-being-military.282470/page-24#post-11835937
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/why...t-being-military.282470/page-24#post-11835937
What is your source to support that Section 31 is a criminal organization?
It's mentioned multiple times in their DS9 episodes. Also, if you want to go non-canon, the novels make it very clear. Especially David Mack's recent novel Control, which IMO is the definitive Section 31 story.
It's always been made very clear they aren't. This isn't even a vague and open to interpretation like the military thing, Section 31 is a criminal organization, has always been depicted as one, and no one has ever tried to claim otherwise.
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