Why is Alley prefered so much over Curtis for Saavik?

[velour]

Alley's Saavik had a compelling personality, charm and good looks. She almost stole the show, even though she was a newcomer to the franchise.

Curtis' Saavik was ho-hum even if she did indeed properly play the Vulcan character as Nimoy intended.

Which Saavik would I want to have a beer, or Romulan ale, with? It would be Alley's Saavik.

Alley was able to pull off the playful interactions with Shatner's Kirk. Quoting regulations, the elevator scene, her reaction to Kirk putting on his eyeglasses. Alley was perfect for that role and that particular movie.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Alley's Saavik's ego was pummeled after the opening sequence. She desperately wanted guidance but Kirk wouldn't do it through words but with action. He knocked her off her pedestal and build her spirits back up. I liked her because of her persistence to corner Kirk in answering a question she needs to know. She used her looks in an attempt to persuade Kirk and doesn't work, she conjures up regulations in order to be under his wing. She refused to give up wanting to learn from Kirk, I loved the scene where Kirk is eating and she solemnly asked what did he do in the test.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

For me, Alley's Saavik is just a much more interesting character. She has wants, desires, and ambitions of her own. She's devoted to Spock, but she's got her own stuff going on, too. The character we met in TWOK positively crackles with potential. It's a shame that the dialogue confirming her half-Romulan heritage was edited out of the finished film, though. What a fascinating backstory that is!

But at the end of the day, Alley's Saavik works because she's obviously passionate and she has a little mystery about her. You want to know more about her.

In contrast, Curtis' Saavik is, quite frankly, dull. The script for TSFS just uses her as a device to get Spock back and never really delves into her feelings about it. This isn't really Curtis' fault, BTW. Nimoy directed her to play it as completely emotionless, and she did her job. (I wonder if there was a bit of self-interest on Nimoy's part there... Who needs Spock if we have a new, young, sexy, female half-Vulcan hybrid who's got all-new possibilities? So instead he gave us a flat, emotionless, full Vulcan who can't help but come off as rather boring next to the resurrected Mr. Spock.) I think the loss of Saavik's original writer Nick Meyer was a factor, as well. I'm sure that he could've developed her better if he'd stayed on for TSFS.

I do think she's very good in the scene where she comes face-to-face with the resurrected Spock for the first time, though.

The problem with Alley is that it's Alley -- that lady from Cheers and Look Who's Talking, not Saavik.

Never a problem for me, since I saw her as Saavik long before I ever saw her in either of those two projects. (I do love her in Cheers, though. Rebecca > Diane.)

Plus, it has to be mentioned that Alley was smoking hot. Yeah, superficial but true and that definitely plays into the discussion.

Yep! That's definitely a factor. Alley had a clear sensuality to her that was a total plus and really worked for the character. She doesn't do anything for me these days, but 1980s Kirstie Alley... WOW!

Curtis is also handicapped there by the fact that her 80s California girl perm looks pretty dated these days, while Alley's more practical hairstyles still look fine.

Exactly. Vulcan's aren't emotionless. To the contrary, they're so repressed because their emotions are too powerful to be let loose (or so they've been taught). Playing a Vulcan is a tricky, but when done right, actors like Nimoy or Lenard or Alley manage to convey the strong emotions and personalities beneath the stoic facades.

Yeah. For my money, we've only had about six decent Vulcans throughout Star Trek: Nimoy, Lenard, Alley, Tim Russ, and a few others. The people who do it wrong just play them as robotic, which is horribly dull. TNG was especially bad at this.

Nimoy once said that he played Spock as a man of tremendous passion, it was just held in check. Other Vulcan actors would do well to remember that.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

One problem I did have with Curtis-Saavik is the lack of any real sense of chemistry between her and David. Alley-Saavik may only have had a couple of scenes with him in TWOK but the promotional/behind-the-scenes photo of them together just seems to sizzle, had they played opposite one another in TSFS who knows what sort of relationship they may have had on screen.

 

[DonIago]

I wonder whether it was felt that with the pon farr sequence in the film, showing anything going on between Saavik and David might make that (even more) uncomfortable.

 

[Longinus]

I prefer Curtis. She actually seemed like a Vulcan. But the two versions of the character are so different, that it would have been better to make them different characters. And I guess then it would have been logical for Curtis' Saavik (or whatever her name would have been at that point) reappear in TUC.

 

[Kilana2]

I prefer Curtis. She actually seemed like a Vulcan. But the two versions of the character are so different, that it would have been better to make them different characters. And I guess then it would have been logical for Curtis' Saavik (or whatever her name would have been at that point) reappear in TUC.

I like both versions of Saavik, but I have Robin Curtis in front of me when I think of Saavik or read novels about Saavik (especially the Mirror Universe novels by David Mack).
And I'm glad that Saavik didn't turn out to be a traitor. They introduced Valeris instead. Valeris showed up again in a novel (Cast No Shadow) where her background was explored further. With the recasting of characters I have my difficulties. Even with Alien prothestics inconsistencies are unavoidable.

 

[Longinus]

I like both versions of Saavik, but I have Robin Curtis in front of me when I think of Saavik or read novels about Saavik (especially the Mirror Universe novels by David Mack).
And I'm glad that Saavik didn't turn out to be a traitor. They introduced Valeris instead. Valeris showed up again in a novel (Cast No Shadow) where her background was explored further. With the recasting of characters I have my difficulties. Even with Alien prothestics inconsistencies are unavoidable.

Yeah, I have trouble with recastings as well. As for Saavik turning out to be traitor, it certainly would have been gut-wrenching. But I'm not sure that would have been a bad thing... It certainly would have elevated the emotional impact on completely different level!

 

[Kilana2]

Yeah, I have trouble with recastings as well. As for Saavik turning out to be traitor, it certainly would have been gut-wrenching. But I'm not sure that would have been a bad thing... It certainly would have elevated the emotional impact on completely different level!

With Saavik as traitor Valeris wouldn't have been put into play. And maybe authors would have found other redeeming aspects of her.

 

[STEPhon IT]

For me, Alley's Saavik is just a much more interesting character. She has wants, desires, and ambitions of her own. She's devoted to Spock, but she's got her own stuff going on, too. The character we met in TWOK positively crackles with potential. It's a shame that the dialogue confirming her half-Romulan heritage was edited out of the finished film, though. What a fascinating backstory that is!

A mistake by Nimoy and Bennett I believed. I've always had trouble with the Klingon Bird of Prey retcon done in TSFS because everything I knew of Klingons were not that. The Bird of Prey looked very Romulan and I suspected Bennett had an itch to explore the Romulans through Alley's Saavik but never came to fruition.

I think Nimoy had zero interest in a Saavik because, in a way, Alley was going to be his successor to the franchise and he was trying to write the character out as fast as he could. Casting Curtis was obvious, to make Saavik more of a menial. TSFS doesn't make any sense from plot to story and execution; if Nicholas Meyer did the third film I strongly doubt Saavik or David would be off of the Enterprise so quickly. The Saavik I knew from II would not have left the Enterprise.

 

[Samuel]

I always thought Saavik was supposed to be half Romulan/half Vulcan as well.
But strictly in my opinion:
1) Alley has a more "Romulan/Vulcan" look to her face with the angular chin line and cheek bones.
2) Alley was first.
3) Alley has had a considerably more successful career subsequent than Curtis.

 

[Pauln6]

Recasting depends on execution . Brandon Routh's Clark Kent was masterful. Kate Bosworth's Lots Lane on the other hand lacked the fire and gumption of Margot Kidder. I do think that Saavik and David's sidelining was probably a mistake. I realise that the eighties was too soon to replace the crew that had quit a bit of mileage left, but they could have included the older crew more tangentially as time went on and had some recurring younger characters.

Much like Michael Burnham, Saavik's redemption after STVI could have been an interesting route to take, if the execution of her betrayal had been more nuanced.

Of course, since TNG kicked off before the TOS franchise had run its course, by that point , they thought that TOS did not need its own successor.

 

[Longinus]

I always thought Saavik was supposed to be half Romulan/half Vulcan as well.

But that did not end up on screen. I never heard about that until many years after I had seen the film. She's a Vulcan.

 

[2takesfrakes]

They looked good together, did they not? Had this pairing actually occurred with Kirstie Alley still in the role, well ... I've no doubts, at all, that Saavik would've been the one wearing The Pants in the relationship, to my chagrin. But how else could it be? David was hardly "a chip off the old block" ...

 

[Haggis and tatties]

I had no idea at the time that two different actors were playing that part as i watched TSFS in 1985 on it's VHS release, no doubt because all we had then were rentals and actually owning a VHS copy of something was not the norm, well not for us at least as we only got our first VHS in 1984.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

One problem I did have with Curtis-Saavik is the lack of any real sense of chemistry between her and David.

Not a big problem for me, since they never got to the point of giving them a romantic relationship on screen. I agree that Alley and Butrick definitely had more chemistry together, though.

 

[STEPhon IT]

I could've sworn I saw a deleted scene of TWOK where Kirk gave his blessing for David and Saavik to hook up. I don't remember where I saw this footage. I wish paramount would stop holding back on ST:II material; I mean, it's not as if they're using bits and pieces to sell videos--it's not in plan period. The 50th anniversary version should've had stuff in it but had a few superlative crap I don't care for.

Hard to believe this studio cares about their most valued property and do nothing to give it some sense of value. The Voyage Home is the highest grossing Trek film ever and it still hasn't had a worthwhile treatment. Uh oh... here comes another spin-off thread.

 

[Amaris]

I prefer Curtis to Alley when it comes to Saavik's portrayal.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

I could've sworn I saw a deleted scene of TWOK where Kirk gave his blessing for David and Saavik to hook up.

The closest thing I've seen to that is a deleted bit from the bridge scene at the end. David and Saavik are reintroduced to each other (odd since they spent several hours together in the Genesis Cave), they make eyes at each other, and Kirk says, "She's learning by doing" as he walks towards the front of the bridge to join Carol and McCoy.

 

[WarpFactorZ]

3) Alley has had a considerably more successful career subsequent than Curtis.

While I also prefer Alley to Curtis in the role, it's a bit unfair to base this on an actor's success. There are lots of reasons people give up on Hollywood, not just talent. Here's an interesting article I found on Robin Curtis. She is now working in real estate development in upstate New York, and sounds quite happy with her choices:

http://womenofupstateny.com/you-can-go-home-again-robin-curtis/