Why does Vaders suit make him slow and less powerful?
- Thread starter GeneHunt
- Start date
I think you need to review the concept of a "saga" and films in a series being in the same continuity. Or do you intend to argue that ROTJ Palpatine is not a Sith because no one in the OT says the word "Sith"?
Let's face it, the stuff they've established in Star Wars canon - specifically regarding the uses of the force, means that Darth Vader could have repaired a large amount of his injuries had he so desired.
Obviously this would be dependent on learning advanced force mastery shit that only the likes of Palpatine or Yoda, etc would be aware of, but Anakin/Vader was a prodigal force user and quite possibly the individual with the most potential to be the most powerful force sensitive being to have ever lived.
Obviously this would be dependent on learning advanced force mastery shit that only the likes of Palpatine or Yoda, etc would be aware of, but Anakin/Vader was a prodigal force user and quite possibly the individual with the most potential to be the most powerful force sensitive being to have ever lived.
We all know "Why does Vader's suit make him slow and less powerful."
Because the OT was filmed in the '80 and the prequels in the '00.
This thread should be named "Find a realistic in-universe explanation for Vader's martial underperformance in the OT or argument why it actually wasn't a sub-standard showing".
Because the OT was filmed in the '80 and the prequels in the '00.
This thread should be named "Find a realistic in-universe explanation for Vader's martial underperformance in the OT or argument why it actually wasn't a sub-standard showing".
I think most of us in this thread were already operating under this exact pretense.
The "elephant in the room" is the 30 years between films, but it's the exact same situation as trying to rationalize why some technology today already surpasses what was seen in ST:TOS, or why at the end of SW:ROTS with all that advanced technology, suddenly the Empire looks like Nazis.
So instead, we look for in-universe explanations, because that's more fun.
I'm reminded of an HBO standup comedy routine by a Rick Overton I watched during the early, maybe mid 80s.
He started off talking about the elaborate lengths fans would go to perfect their costumes. After describing a Halloween encounter with the observation that instead of going to college, "kids are getting into character," he seques to the duel in "The Empire Strikes Back", noting the differences in style.
In a nutshell, Overton points out, "There's Luke, he's young and he's cocky, swinging his blade like..." Rick then makes a lot of frantic buzzing, humming and clashing sounds into his mike. "But, Vader, he's all cool like, not even breaking a sweat." Overton then takes on a casual, outright disinterested pose, casually flicking his wrist as though handling a musical conductor's baton during a peaceful piece of music. Then he acts like he tosses the saber in the air and calmly scratches his backside. The "air" saber falls into his hand to continue parrying Luke's manic strikes.
Then, as Vader, Rick says, "You have learned much, but you are not yet a Jedi."
As Luke, "Oh, yeah! Well, I still have a few tricks up my sleeve!"
SLICE!!!
As himself, "Then that's the ONLY thing he had up his sleeve! Now Luke will HAVE to find a girlfriend!"
Sincerely,
Bill
He started off talking about the elaborate lengths fans would go to perfect their costumes. After describing a Halloween encounter with the observation that instead of going to college, "kids are getting into character," he seques to the duel in "The Empire Strikes Back", noting the differences in style.
In a nutshell, Overton points out, "There's Luke, he's young and he's cocky, swinging his blade like..." Rick then makes a lot of frantic buzzing, humming and clashing sounds into his mike. "But, Vader, he's all cool like, not even breaking a sweat." Overton then takes on a casual, outright disinterested pose, casually flicking his wrist as though handling a musical conductor's baton during a peaceful piece of music. Then he acts like he tosses the saber in the air and calmly scratches his backside. The "air" saber falls into his hand to continue parrying Luke's manic strikes.
Then, as Vader, Rick says, "You have learned much, but you are not yet a Jedi."
As Luke, "Oh, yeah! Well, I still have a few tricks up my sleeve!"
SLICE!!!
As himself, "Then that's the ONLY thing he had up his sleeve! Now Luke will HAVE to find a girlfriend!"
Sincerely,
Bill
I admit I didn't even think of the possibility that Palpatine intentionally had Vader's suit outfitted with substandard parts just to keep him in line. It would definitely fit Palps' MO.
Yeah.. my thoughts exactly. We are to believe that the right hand man of the Emperor only gets second grade equipment installed by incompetent droids? The only possibility where that makes sense is the urgency in the first few hours where nothing specialized is immediately available and standard parts are used to at least save his life until engineers and biotech specialists have the time to custom design Vader's suit.
Could be but in the long run it would be a double edged sword.. there were still many powerful Jedi who escaped Order 66 and could be a match in Vader's handicapped state.. why risk the one loyal servant needlessly? If i were the Emperor i'd have a bomb or something else installed in the armor and keep the detonator with me.. simple solution. Additionally i don't think the Emperor would have lost in a straight out fight against Vader even with a state of the art suit. That guy held his own and defeated Yoda at the peak of his powers and was definitely up to challenge of defeating Vader. However since it's alluded to it could have been an entirely different matter had Anakin not been mortally wounded..
I never exactly suggested that Vader was made with substandard parts; rather, I agreed with the OP that there is a gap between Grievous and Vader that needs to be addressed.
Indeed, the Emperor seems to have gotten rid of a lot of droid technology used by the Separatists. Anything on the level of the MagnaGuards is totally absent in the OT, except in the form of leftovers like IG-88, and I'm sure the Emperor wanted it that way [Wookieepedia backs up the notion that EU appearances of the MagnaGuards in the OT era were contrary to Imperial decree: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/IG-100_MagnaGuard#Post-Clone_Wars].
But I think it's reasonable that the Emperor discouraged any attempt to improve Vader's suit beyond what he got when he was first assembled. That could have been accomplished simply by making sure that better technology was not to be found anywhere, except possibly in some Imperial caches kept secret from Vader, and by subverting Vader's will so that Anakin the genius who could fix anything wouldn't even want to to try to fix himself.
Indeed, the Emperor seems to have gotten rid of a lot of droid technology used by the Separatists. Anything on the level of the MagnaGuards is totally absent in the OT, except in the form of leftovers like IG-88, and I'm sure the Emperor wanted it that way [Wookieepedia backs up the notion that EU appearances of the MagnaGuards in the OT era were contrary to Imperial decree: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/IG-100_MagnaGuard#Post-Clone_Wars].
But I think it's reasonable that the Emperor discouraged any attempt to improve Vader's suit beyond what he got when he was first assembled. That could have been accomplished simply by making sure that better technology was not to be found anywhere, except possibly in some Imperial caches kept secret from Vader, and by subverting Vader's will so that Anakin the genius who could fix anything wouldn't even want to to try to fix himself.
Vader might've been slow but hee was a villain with some real presence onscreen. I remember just before Luke's first lightsaber duel with Vader started in The Empire Strikes Back, you could feel him and hear him before he was seen onscreen. Vader didn't need to run around and backflips, he was VERY powerful without doing any of that.
As mentioned in the link I gave upthread, the Wookieepedia lists N-K Necrosis and his NK-3 units as existing during the Rebellion era. I don't claim this is so.
