Why Does It Bother Us That Twilight is So Popular?
- Thread starter Andonagio
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Without sounding too much like a stuck record, Buffy's depiction of men is not exactly my favourite aspect of the series. It comes to something when the guy who quite literally turned in to a monster minutes after sleeping with her was the most positive relationship she had.
There's the guy who was only after one thing and dumped her after getting it, the guy who'd rather hang around with Vampires and then there's her abusive relationship with Spike (which worked both ways).
Off the top of my head, the closest thing any Buffyverse character ever had to a positive relationship was Angel's relationship with Nina (the werewolf girl), and even then he kept her chained up in his basement three nights a month!
There's the guy who was only after one thing and dumped her after getting it, the guy who'd rather hang around with Vampires and then there's her abusive relationship with Spike (which worked both ways).
Off the top of my head, the closest thing any Buffyverse character ever had to a positive relationship was Angel's relationship with Nina (the werewolf girl), and even then he kept her chained up in his basement three nights a month!
Doesn't phase me any. Many people who look from the sidelines at something that many people like, tend to never fully understand it and just revolve around the typical stereo-types surrounding that thing.
Take Star Trek for an example. Many of us have many reasons why we're fans and why we keep coming back to the movies, shows, books, games, etc..... yet for everyone else who doesn't get star trek just think it's a nerdier Star Wars thing and it's all about starships, laser beams, etc..... they don't get what's beyond the 3 second surface scan that sucks people in.
I see the same thing applied here for Twilight. Some people think its focus is on a paticular group, sending a paticular message, and isn't all that original, etc..... and that all the fans fit into some stero-typical group (sound familiar anybody?)
Once they get through their various movie releases, there'll still be a fan following, but it'll greatly drop off and years down the road, the whole Twilight thing will probably be in the spotlight about as much as Titanic or the Matrix is today..... which is very little.
AKA: They'll just be another bunch of movies, with another group of fans/followers and life will go on.
I agree that this is probably the only important thing. Sure, media shapes our view of the world, but I believe that most 13-year-old girls have the ability to distinguish the fantasy they see on TV or in theaters from reality. They're smart enough to know that relationships don't usually work this way and are intelligent enough to draw their own conclusions. I know the "War Crimes" article linked earlier in this thread might suggest otherwise, but that kind of overpowering influence is a rare exception.
It bothers me because it's a complete ripoff of Buffy and Angel right down to Edwards huge brow and spikey hair. Yet no one calls it for what it is. I mean, I hate Harry Potter but at least it was original. And the whole psychic thing in the mix? Yeah, she stole that from True Blood. The woman is to good vampire romances what The Jonas Brothers are to real music.
From what I hear the books are very cute and well-written. So I'm willing to give that the benefit of the doubt.
But the first film was one of the worst films I've ever seen. I've been accused of not liking it because I'm a guy and it's a chick thing. Not true. I liked Gilmore Girls and Bring It On. I've even been entertained by various Meg Ryan and Kate Hudson films. This film was irredeemable it was so bad. And many Twilight fans agree with me to.
So no, I don't hate Twilight. I just think there are better versions of it out there and the movie was just a badly made piece of shit.
From what I hear the books are very cute and well-written. So I'm willing to give that the benefit of the doubt.
But the first film was one of the worst films I've ever seen. I've been accused of not liking it because I'm a guy and it's a chick thing. Not true. I liked Gilmore Girls and Bring It On. I've even been entertained by various Meg Ryan and Kate Hudson films. This film was irredeemable it was so bad. And many Twilight fans agree with me to.
So no, I don't hate Twilight. I just think there are better versions of it out there and the movie was just a badly made piece of shit.
Heh heh. There's a lot of that going around in this thread.
Who cares if this is porn for teenage girls? 90% of movies are porn for teenage boys. I don't care about vampire movies and didn't when I was a teenage girl, either, but why complain about this particular stupidity and not the stupidity of, say, making a movie franchise based on toys for little boys?
Now THIS bothers me.
FAZE!!! FAZE!!!
That felt like reading a Virginia Woolf novel.
Here's an example of Twilight's negative wave. Near Dark is NOT Twilight!!! Never mind that the guy is the "Bella" of the story.
At least those vampires aren't playing baseball on the cover! In Twilight they played baseball! Nooooooo!
Why'd you say that twice?
S
Stone_Cold_Sisko
Guest
Lets just say I notice no difference in quality between stuff like Twilight, and your average Michael Bay Transformers 2012 movie or your average superhero comic. Mindless romantic angst is no different than mindless explosions. Bad dialogue, bad characterization, cheesy dialogue. And so forth.
Frankly I hate stuff like Voyager and Enterprise more than Twilight... the former ruined something I actually cared about! The latter.... well, teenage-girl-based romantic-angst was never my genre to begin with (fan of Buffy notwithstanding)
Frankly I hate stuff like Voyager and Enterprise more than Twilight... the former ruined something I actually cared about! The latter.... well, teenage-girl-based romantic-angst was never my genre to begin with (fan of Buffy notwithstanding)
The interesting thing is while there's a lot of hatred for Transformers (and/or the sequel) in geekdom... very little of it hates the idea of basing a movie on a toyline, compared to the amount of hatred there is towards basing movies on Meyer's novels. And you know, I grew up with the original Transformers cartoon and it was dreadful, sort of hilariously bad in retrospect, so even if Bay was adding all new kinds of awful it's not like he was working with sanctified material to begin with.
I guess Transformers didn't teach people bad lessons about sexuality, though, so as source material it gets a free pass? (Even still, I'll bet even money that somewhere on the internet somebody gets off on Optimus Prime/Megatron combinations.)
I heard a rumor that Kevin Smith (Silent Bob, director) spoke at last year's Comic Con in San Diego about how teenaged girls were more in attendance that year. People were annoyed at all the girls there, but he brought it into perspective by saying, "Don't knock these 14 year old Twilight fangirls because in 4 years or so they're going to be 18 year old Twilight fangirls, and since most of them are currently into emo, by then they'll be into Goth and submissiveness" I'm paraphrasing what I heard.
My exact words when I posted in the Transformers 2 review thread months ago were "the worst movie I've ever paid to see". That opinion has not changed. If you want me to complain about the stupidity of that movie then you had better clear your schedule because you're in for a long day.
Twilight is actual pornography, as in it is an aid to masturbation. As I said before, I don't particularly mind that, but be honest about it. I don't particularly care if teenage girls read and watch stories about some century old Vampire who happens to fall for the dorky girl nobody else wants (a character designed for the teenage girl audience to identify with). When it comes down to it, teenage girls are the easiest audience in the world, the world's biggest suckers. How else can the concept of the Boy Band be explained ?
If, however, it's okay for teenage girls to enjoy that then I'm sure it's also okay for teenage boys to enjoy the odd comic book or video game with unrealistically rendered female characters ? That won't stop seemingly every comic book blog and news site moaning endlessly about the portrayal of women in comics, now will it ?
Since comic books and video games are the last two places left where you will find stories written with men in mind, it's no surprise that it's okay to complain about them but not about the likes of Twilight, High School Musical and the Jonas Brothers. Then the little girls grow up and they continue to be fed unrealisitic portrayals of men in "romantic" comedies, but we're not allowed to complain about those either.
In BDSM circles, submissives, male, female and somewhere inbetween, already outnumber dominants by about 10 to 1. Plenty of perfectly healthy, balanced people enjoy being sexually submissive.
Here's the video.
He doesn't say anything about submissiveness, though. There's a part where is sounds like he stumbles over saying "goth permissive."
I'd assume that's because comics are (obtensibly) for readers regardless of gender, even if it tends to skew male. The Twilight saga is unabashedly for girls. If we were to say, well, 'Power Girl is basically porn for boys', what would the reaction be - from the fanboys, no less?
I don't have a problem with the franchise, but some of the fans-- just like hardcore fans in ANY franchise-- get on my nerves.
I've heard it called by someone "What happens when your little sister hits puberty and starts writing Buffy fanfics".
Then again, I've heard it called Anne Rice fanfic with the MS-Word "Find and Replace" function run over it a couple of times.
I've heard it called by someone "What happens when your little sister hits puberty and starts writing Buffy fanfics".
Then again, I've heard it called Anne Rice fanfic with the MS-Word "Find and Replace" function run over it a couple of times.
Heh heh. There's a lot of that going around in this thread.
Who cares if this is porn for teenage girls? 90% of movies are porn for teenage boys. I don't care about vampire movies and didn't when I was a teenage girl, either, but why complain about this particular stupidity and not the stupidity of, say, making a movie franchise based on toys for little boys?
Now THIS bothers me.
FAZE!!! FAZE!!!
Don't faze me, bro.
(yes, I know I deserve any and all beatings for that
)
You know, not to insult anybody in here, but I don't understand the whole Angel/Buffy relations.... I tried watching both shows and they were more cheesy and had worse acting then Hercules and Xena Warrior Princess, let alone the effects. I personally felt the acting in the Twilight movie was way better then anything I seen in those shows. The problem with tv shows is that they're usually rushed, and it is very easy to see it in the acting. Most of the time all I saw in those shows was the actors just going through their routines.
If people like Buffy and Angel, sure, all the power to you, but personally speaking I think it's laughable to try and compare Buffy/Angel to these movies..... besides vampires being in both stories, I don't see any other similarities. Maybe there was some love thing in Buffy like in the movies, but I couldn't get into it enough to want to care or know..... and Buffy/Angel arn't the original vampire/human relationship masters anyways. They, like Twilight, are merely sapping from the same old stories...... I just see people using one over the other because one was around first..... but seem to forget they there was much more before Buffy.
If people like Buffy and Angel, sure, all the power to you, but personally speaking I think it's laughable to try and compare Buffy/Angel to these movies..... besides vampires being in both stories, I don't see any other similarities. Maybe there was some love thing in Buffy like in the movies, but I couldn't get into it enough to want to care or know..... and Buffy/Angel arn't the original vampire/human relationship masters anyways. They, like Twilight, are merely sapping from the same old stories...... I just see people using one over the other because one was around first..... but seem to forget they there was much more before Buffy.
We already know what the reaction would be. Endless blog posts and moaning about how women are portrayed in comic books - how they're unrealistically drawn etc.
