Why does Abrams keeps giving the middle finger to Trek fans?

[Vance]

Do you actually read what your fellow posters post, the ones who hate the film i mean.

Yes. And I'm going to say, factually, that the amount of 'hate' being levelled comes from the 'supporter manaic' side by an order of magnitude than those who don't like it. This does not excuse the personal attacks from either side. It's not a contest. There's no vote. There's nothing to win.

You even do this in this very post, where you resort to some indirect attacks against them. Honestly, I do feel that I can write better Trek than most of the official guys have in recent years, and I've been actually TOLD that by some of them. But I do openly admit that I have a huge ego - but it took YEARS of stroking.

 

[3D Master]

Do you actually read what your fellow posters post, the ones who hate the film i mean. Yeah these guys post some jibes but when ever other thread is being derailed because the new E is a polished turd, or building on the earth is obsurd, it gets a little tiring to see that. Also when peole who've NEVER made a movie in their life,or write sketchy fan-fics say they can do better than writers who've written million dollar blockbusters, and directors who made a better Godzilla movie than Tristar did it gets a little unnerving. It's called an ego check. Nobody here is going to be shooting anyone else from here in the movie line when the film comes out.. Calm down.

Any idiot with a type writer that writes a script that has the Enterprise built in a space dock, has by definition written a better movie.

 

[SalvorHardin]

Do you actually read what your fellow posters post, the ones who hate the film i mean. Yeah these guys post some jibes but when ever other thread is being derailed because the new E is a polished turd, or building on the earth is obsurd, it gets a little tiring to see that. Also when peole who've NEVER made a movie in their life,or write sketchy fan-fics say they can do better than writers who've written million dollar blockbusters, and directors who made a better Godzilla movie than Tristar did it gets a little unnerving. It's called an ego check. Nobody here is going to be shooting anyone else from here in the movie line when the film comes out.. Calm down.

Any idiot with a type writer that writes a script that has the Enterprise built in a space dock, has by definition written a better movie.

Well, you've got that first part covered. If you also have a type writer you should give it a shot and send TPTB a script for Trek XII since it's now too late for Trek XI.

Meanwhile, after several users have provided actual quotes that show Abrams has actual respect and love for Trek, they have been conveniently ignored.

 

[Captain Robert April]

Talk is cheap. What's he's putting on the screen says something completely different.

 

[Vigilance]

Talk is cheap. What's he's putting on the screen says something completely different.

Yes, how dare he make a movie that you don't like.

Doesn't he know that you, and you alone, are the arbiter of trek fandom?

 

[trekkerguy]

Talk is cheap. What's he's putting on the screen says something completely different.

Yes, how dare he make a movie that you don't like.

Doesn't he know that you, and you alone, are the arbiter of trek fandom?

And as such has apparently already has an advanced screening.

 

[Vance]

Yes, how dare he make a movie that you don't like.

And how DARE April not like this movie! I mean, dammit, what does he think he is? A CONSUMER? A FAN? A MAN WITH HIS OWN OPINIONS? The bastard! :P

 

[trekkerguy]

Yes, how dare he make a movie that you don't like.

And how DARE April not like this movie! I mean, dammit, what does he think he is? A CONSUMER? A FAN? A MAN WITH HIS OWN OPINIONS? The bastard! :P

Yes, how could he possibly think he's a consumer, he has consumed nothing as he has NOT SEEN IT. Opinions of a trailer pherhaps? Yes, but none of us can have an opinion of the movie since we HAVE NOT SEEN IT.

Very good points Vance.

Bastard... dunno on that you may have to ask him.

 

[Vance]

Bastard... dunno on that you may have to ask him.

You're continuing to argue a false point, in that he's unable to make a conclusion on the movie based on the amount of information we've seen thus far on it.

From what he's seen of the movie, he's determined that it sucks. Frankly, it's a valid point, because he's seen enough for him to come to that conclusion. The parts he's seen, and how it's sold, and how it's discussed, have burned him on the movie.

It's no less valid a position than any person on this forum who automatically assume the movie will be 'just what Trek needs', and all the hyperbolic positive (even worshipful) comments on the movie.

 

[trekkerguy]

Bastard... dunno on that you may have to ask him.

You're continuing to argue a false point, in that he's unable to make a conclusion on the movie based on the amount of information we've seen thus far on it.

From what he's seen of the movie, he's determined that it sucks. Frankly, it's a valid point, because he's seen enough for him to come to that conclusion. The parts he's seen, and how it's sold, and how it's discussed, have burned him on the movie.

It's no less valid a position than any person on this forum who automatically assume the movie will be 'just what Trek needs', and all the hyperbolic positive (even worshipful) comments on the movie.

From the trailer it looks like just what Trek needs. Or it looks like shit.

I could care less if he sees it or not, that's his(or anyones) choice. But due to having not seen it, his opinions carry about as much weight as a tachyon when it comes to the final product.

Imagine a Video Game reviewer saying ""Insert game name here" sucks!" though he has not played it. He would be laughed at because he has no basis for his analysis of a final product, which he has not experienced.

He is fully entitled to feel he wouldn't like it and therefore avoid it like the plague. But most rational people are not going to take an uneducated opinion as having any value to them.

And the point about being a consumer means nothing if someone does not pay to see something, they are not a consumer and have invested nothing into that product, therefore have no valid complaints about it's outcome.

 

[Vance]

Okay, then everyone who says how good this movie is, and how great it is, and how much I should kiss Abrams ass, should also shut the hell up because they haven't seen this movie either and are just as unqualified to speak upon it.

Simple, really.

 

[trekkerguy]

Okay, then everyone who says how good this movie is, and how great it is, and how much I should kiss Abrams ass, should also shut the hell up because they haven't seen this movie either and are just as unqualified to speak upon it.

Simple, really.

There's a difference between declaring something crap that you havn't seen, which is what most the naysayers are doing, and giving reason why it looks good. I have nowhere even once said it IS good or WILL be. I think it will be for whatever reasons. I have not declared it a great success nor will I till I see it. And rarely have a seen someone in support of the film do that either. Mainly it is the naysayers who have already decided and refuse to budge on the subject, even refusing to see it so there is no chance they can be proven wrong. If I am wrong once I have seen it, I will admit it. But I happen to have an open mind and want to give it the chance.

People on both sides approach this wrong. But the debate will not, nor should it, be ended. People just need to stop putting declarations on things that havn't experienced yet.

 

[Vance]

But you still fail to answer the question...

Why should I spend money to watch something that looks bad to me just to say to a bunch of internet people that I actually saw it first?

Why not just say "looked like shit, didn't see it" and do something I'm more likely to enjoy instead?

 

[trekkerguy]

But you still fail to answer the question...

Why should I spend money to watch something that looks bad to me just to say to a bunch of internet people that I actually saw it first?

Why not just say "looked like shit, didn't see it" and do something I'm more likely to enjoy instead?

You shouldn't. If it looks like shit to you then you most certainly should not.

BUT, I would not be able to accept you telling me it actually was shit because
you will have had no practical experience to base that off of.

I hope you do find something that will entertain you if this doesn't seem like it will,
but you are only going off an impression not a fact.

 

[tauntme]

Right. Make any excuses you naysayers want, they all mean squat. Likewise, the people that herald this movie as the best Trek movie ever need to pipe down.

When the movie comes out and the rest of us go see it, and you haven't, don't you dare say it was "shit" when we start discussing the movie.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

crazy idea but could we possibly, oh I don't know wait for the longer second trailer that actually gives plot info that will likely come out some time between now and when the movie comes out before deciding if it will suck or not.

 

[EnderAKH]

But you still fail to answer the question...

Why should I spend money to watch something that looks bad to me just to say to a bunch of internet people that I actually saw it first?

Why not just say "looked like shit, didn't see it" and do something I'm more likely to enjoy instead?

You shouldn't. But just as with Enterprise, Serenity, Stargate, Doctor Who, BSG, and others, why frequent a forum dedicated to a work when all you're gonna do FOR MONTHS is espouse how much you hate said thing? Why sit in a forum and just go, over and over, "Nope, don't like it. Still don't like it. No change, the not likin' it stays. I started to think maybe I liked it, but then I watched the trailer again, and decided I was wrong, I still don't like it."

I understand watching the trailer and posting once or twice "Didn't like it, here's why." But to visit the forum for Trek XI for months just to talk about how much you DON'T LIKE the movie, and how much you don't want to see the movie? Seems like a huge waste of time and effort.

Why not just say "looked like shit, don't want to see it" and talk about something you'll more likely enjoy instead?

 

[Vance]

Why not just say "looked like shit, don't want to see it" and talk about something you'll more likely enjoy instead?

Actually, I do. MOST of my posts are in the art and tech forums, but there's a lot of spillover (obviously) because the new movie is the 'fresh new package'.

And, despite wether or not I like this movie, some of my fandom projects (such as Jaynz) may be affected by what this movie introduces, so I'm keeping an eye on it.

Otherwise, it just saddens me to see TrekBBS turn into a YouTube comments secton.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

crazy idea but could we possibly, oh I don't know wait for the longer second trailer that actually gives plot info that will likely come out some time between now and when the movie comes out before deciding if it will suck or not.

I don't actually have a problem with people declaring that they know enough now to know that they won't like the movie.

I've already seen more than enough to know that I'll really like it.

As far as I'm concerned, for it to suck means that everything we haven't seen and heard yet is operating on an entirely different creative level than everything we have seen and heard so far - and I've never seen a movie where that turned out to be the case. By the time this much information is available I can pretty much tell whether the experience will be worthwhile or not; the only question is will it turn out to be "I really liked that for a couple of hours" or "this exceeded my expectations; I really love it and want to see lots more."

 

[Jackson_Roykirk]

crazy idea but could we possibly, oh I don't know wait for the longer second trailer that actually gives plot info that will likely come out some time between now and when the movie comes out before deciding if it will suck or not.

Knowing the plot really won't help either. Even Nemesis and TFF looked to have relatively interesting plots based on their trailers, but those films "sucked" anyway.

I've always contended the "PLOT" of a film is over-rated and a film's execution of a plot is vastly more important than the plot itself.

Every trailer shows us only a film's genre, a glimpse at the production values, and a very basic sketch of a plot. Obviously we are all fans of this genre, or we wouldn't be on this forum. We can deduce the overall quality of a film making from the look of the production values. However, a trailer can't tell me whether or not the plot or story will be well-executed.

The first trailer for ST:XI so far showed me that the production values of this film are of a quality that I like; it has given me enough information that I know I want to see this film. That doesn't mean that I will definitely like it -- it only means that I want to see it.

I may be interested in a second trailer showing me more plot, but knowing the plot won't make me decide whether or not I want to see the film.