Why do so many fans still think it was canon that Australia didn't want to join United Earth?

[Mage]

In a episode of TNG, there's a discussion wether or not a planet is ready to join the Federation, since it wasn't unified. One character (Troi or Crusher) brings up the HYPOTHETICAL situation of Australia not wanting to join United Earth.

Oddly enough, several times a year, I'll see in a discussion someone making the claim 'remember how Australia didn't want to join'. I'm not sure how, after 20+ years, there's still this confusion about this subject. It was stated clear enough in the episode itself, and you'd think that after years of easy accesible online resources, this would no longer be a misconception.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

In a episode of TNG, there's a discussion wether or not a planet is ready to join the Federation, since it wasn't unified. One character (Troi or Crusher) brings up the HYPOTHETICAL situation of Australia not wanting to join United Earth.

Oddly enough, several times a year, I'll see in a discussion someone making the claim 'remember how Australia didn't want to join'. I'm not sure how, after 20+ years, there's still this confusion about this subject. It was stated clear enough in the episode itself, and you'd think that after years of easy accesible online resources, this would no longer be a misconception.

And....?

By the way, it helps to actually cite the episode you are discussing.

It's "Attached," and the line in question is:

CRUSHER: Well, think about Earth. What if one of the old nation states, say Australia, had decided not to join the World Government in twenty one fifty? Would that have disqualified us as a Federation member?

http://www.chakoteya.net/NextGen/260.htm

Yes, it's clearly a hypothetical contrary to fact.

So, and?

How can we possibly answer a question about the thought processes of unspecific unnamed individuals while lacking specific examples of what they're saying? Fans come to wrong/shaking conclusions all the time. What is there to discuss here?

 

[Mage]

As I stated, my curiousity is in the why/how. I was wondering how a misconception like this can linger so long. I didn't mean anything negative.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Can you cite a specific example of what someone said? Without a specific example, there literally is no answer to the question of why.

 

[Mage]

Can you cite a specific example of what someone said? Without a specific example, there literally is no answer to the question of why.

This topic I saw today was what made me wonder about this again. http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/who-did-the-macos-fight.282799/#post-11698946
The OP's comment on Australia being forced into United Earth.

Again, this isn't about flaming or anything. It is simply about wondering why this idea still lingers.

 

[Timo]

What becomes clear from Crusher's hypothetical scenario is that Australia was one of the several (at least two) nations that did not join United Earth until 2150, the year beyond which the World Government apparently no longer allowed any of the old nation states to exist.

What remains open to speculation is whether it was possible for an old nation state to join before 2150. If so, Australia certainly counts as a "potential rebel" because it (along with at least one other nation) had been dragging its feet where others had not.

The one reason to think the above was possible is the mention of United Earth long before 2150. That is, an organization called United Earth Space/Science Probe Agency existed at least back in the 2060s and possibly before, at a date when at least the old nation state called United States was apparently still in independent existence (with 52 states indicated by the stars in its flag).

Then again, organizations with "United Earth" in their name exist today, for real, and this is unlikely to tie in to any sort of global political unity, in the 22nd century or otherwise... It is theoretically still possible that 2150 was the only year during which joining/not joining the UE was possible, in which case Australia would have no special reputation as a naysayer-till-the-bitter-end.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Serin117]

Weirdest line... As I said in another thread - We're a nation of joiners, not separatists.
UE would have to be into some seriously evil shit for Australia not to want in.

 

[SPCTRE]

pretty sure Australia held a referendum

#Austrexit

 

[C.E. Evans]

As to the OP, sometimes things are misheard. And if enough people mishear it and spread it around, it becomes accepted as a fact, even though it crumbles as such under actual scrutiny.

 

[The Wormhole]

It's likely just a form of Occam's Razor. Everyone assumes Dr. Crusher used Australia as an example for a reason, and them actually being the last hold-out is a logical reason.

 

[Crazyewok]

Well someone was going to be last to join right?

Plus Aussies are pretty smart, maybe they saw how the UN failed in world war 3 and decided to wait it out a bit and see if United earth was doomed too..

 

[Shawnster]

What becomes clear from Crusher's hypothetical scenario is that Australia was one of the several (at least two) nations that did not join United Earth until 2150, the year beyond which the World Government apparently no longer allowed any of the old nation states to exist.

No. it's not clear. What evidence is there that Australia was one of the last to join the World Government as opposed to Crusher picking a country, any country, at random and she happened to say the first country that came to her mind starting with the letter "A."

The only thing clear is that the World Government began n 2150.

 

[Ethros]

I know this always annoys me too, and how it's become almost a canon fact in some fans eyes. I've seen it in timelines, like "2150- Australia, the last hold out, finally joins the United Earth."
Or even written in the novels. ENT- The Good That Men Do was a great read until they used that, I can't remember how, something like Trip thinking "ooh I'm glad Australia finally joined everyone else" or something.

It's beyond clear from the dialogue and delivery she's just picking a country out of the hat.

 

[uniderth]

Wasn't it stated on one of the Chronologies or encyclopedias that Australia was the last to join. I think that's where it came from is being published in an official work.

 

[Nyotarules]

Weirdest line... As I said in another thread - We're a nation of joiners, not separatists.
UE would have to be into some seriously evil shit for Australia not to want in.

They wanted an immigration policy that was tight lol Seriously considering how unpopular open borders with the richer nations of the EU, I doubt it would work in a UE. For a UE to be a valid option for post war humanity, the standard of living everywhere would need to be pretty much the same. Or the Vulcans told them 'you can hang together or you can get blown up by aliens from outer space who are not as logical and peaceful as we are'.

 

[-Brett-]

Star Trek fans are nowhere near as smart as they think they are.

 

[The Wormhole]

Wasn't it stated on one of the Chronologies or encyclopedias that Australia was the last to join. I think that's where it came from is being published in an official work.

Doesn't matter, the Chronology isn't canon. And it has a disturbing habit of taking things spoken on screen way too literally. For example if someone said "around 50 years ago" the Chronology declares it was exactly fifty years prior to the day. That's all the Chronology is doing, taking something spoken vaguely on screen and taking it literally.

 

[Nyotarules]

Well someone had to be the last to join, I would place money on it being a place somewere in North America; chanting 'USA, USA!' sounds a lot better than chanting 'USE, USE!

 

[uniderth]

Doesn't matter, the Chronology isn't canon. And it has a disturbing habit of taking things spoken on screen way too literally. For example if someone said "around 50 years ago" the Chronology declares it was exactly fifty years prior to the day. That's all the Chronology is doing, taking something spoken vaguely on screen and taking it literally.

Exactly, that's what I was saying. People read the book and then perpetuated it as if it was fact.

 

[Tenacity]

I was wondering how a misconception like this can linger so long. I didn't mean anything negative.

Why do some fans think (stemming from the same episode) that a planet has to have a single world government to join the Federation? Picard never said as much.

The planet's two peoples were hostile towards each other, Picard said all previous entrants were unified worlds, that statement makes no mention of possessing a single world government.

People misconstrue what Picard said.