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Why are TSCC's ratings in decline?

1. The Terminator of the show, Cameron (Summer Glau) is not a compelling Terminator. She is not robotic enough and the storylines about her has been bland and 'been here done that' about her trying to be more human. We got seven years with Data on TNG about such and it was great then, not so now. She should play it more how Arnie plays it in the movies - cold, emotionless, no need to understand the nuances of human culture beyond what is needed to complete her mission.

That would make for an incredibly boring character from week to week. People (well, at least I) expect characters to evolve over the course of an episodic television series, so I think the producers have made the right choice. In fact, I find the main reason I keep tuning in is to see the nuances of character development occurring with Cameron.

2. Too many variables, not enough resolution. So they blew up Cyberdyne systems but the Terminators have kept coming. Which means they didn't change the future much. So their focus should be on how the future might have changed, and why it didn't according to how they wanted it even after Cyberdyne corps have been blown to bits. Why aren't there any links to the show back to Cyberdyne?

3. A woman, a kid, a scrawny looking scientist and a big lunking man destroyed one of the top research facilities in the USA for robotic systems. So why aren't Sarah and her child more in the news? How come in the real world, Interpol and a bunch of other law enforcement agencies working together can bring down a prostitution ring given enough time, but in nearly two decades they have not been able to find Sarah and her cohorts? Granted both of them do not exist anymore, but Sarah and John should be national sensations by now!

4. IF Skynet is truly defeated in the future, and their last ditch attempt was to send back the first/second Terminator, and if time is linear in both the future/present universes, why isn't the Resistance taking over the facilities of Skynet now and stopping all the hoopla? Has Skynet been defeated or not? Why is Skynet still functioning after the defeat?

These things would crawl up the mind of any intelligent viewer/fans (and I'd say there are lots of them) and if these issues are not brought up or resolved then there is truly no fun in the mythos left, is there?
All of these arguments could similarly be leveled at the films; they are not exclusive to the TV series.
 
3. A woman, a kid, a scrawny looking scientist and a big lunking man destroyed one of the top research facilities in the USA for robotic systems. So why aren't Sarah and her child more in the news? How come in the real world, Interpol and a bunch of other law enforcement agencies working together can bring down a prostitution ring given enough time, but in nearly two decades they have not been able to find Sarah and her cohorts? Granted both of them do not exist anymore, but Sarah and John should be national sensations by now!

In fairness, the timeline for TSCC has T2 taking place about two years before the first episode and then they jump about ten or thirteen years from that point. So, in essence, they were completely off the map for a good decade. Perhaps any authorities that were seriously following them dropped the case due to lack of evidence. It would kinda align with how people were treating Ellison's claim that Sarah was still around during season 1.
 
1. The Terminator of the show, Cameron (Summer Glau) is not a compelling Terminator. She is not robotic enough and the storylines about her has been bland and 'been here done that' about her trying to be more human. We got seven years with Data on TNG about such and it was great then, not so now. She should play it more how Arnie plays it in the movies - cold, emotionless, no need to understand the nuances of human culture beyond what is needed to complete her mission. And her mission is to protect John Connor. That's her primary objective, to follow her programming. Her movements are made out to be too human - not a fault of Summer as she is doing what she is told - but the guidance she needs is to play the character to be more robotic.

To successfully protect the Connors she has to be able to blend in as an actual human. In Season One she wasn't trying as hard and was somewhat stiff. In the second season she's trying to better understand humanity - which is necessary for her assignment to protect John. She's not the only Terminator that is being shown to do this. Catherine Weaver/T-1001 is learning about humanity and human emotions for her assignment. Cromartie was learning about humanity and displayed emotions a few times. I wouldn't exactly say that Arnie was cold and emotionless in the films. In T1 he was, but in T2 you can see evidence of his not being so cold. T2 is a big example of this.

2. Too many variables, not enough resolution. So they blew up Cyberdyne systems but the Terminators have kept coming. Which means they didn't change the future much. So their focus should be on how the future might have changed, and why it didn't according to how they wanted it even after Cyberdyne corps have been blown to bits. Why aren't there any links to the show back to Cyberdyne?

Because Cyberdyne Systems Corporation probably doesn't exist anymore. Most of its work is being done now through Zeira Corp. Cyberdyne has been mentioned on the show though a few types - but in the past tense. In T3 - it's not canon to TSCC though - Cyberdyne went bankrupt and was bought by Cyber Research Systems following the destruction of their lab complex.

3. A woman, a kid, a scrawny looking scientist and a big lunking man destroyed one of the top research facilities in the USA for robotic systems. So why aren't Sarah and her child more in the news? How come in the real world, Interpol and a bunch of other law enforcement agencies working together can bring down a prostitution ring given enough time, but in nearly two decades they have not been able to find Sarah and her cohorts? Granted both of them do not exist anymore, but Sarah and John should be national sensations by now!

In the pilot and immediately following in the first episode of the series it was established that the FBI had listed the Connor case as closed because Sarah and John committed suicide at the bank. The bank was destroyed by the temporal transporter and they were locked inside the vault - which was ground zero for the explosion. Why would they put time and resources into a case that was literally over?

In Mr. Ferguson is Ill Today John Connor was arrested in Mexico for a misdemeanor; however, one of the police officers recognized him from his time living in the town as a child. His information was forwarded on to Interpol and Ellison was contacted. He went to Mexico to retrieve Connor, but Cromartie arrived before he did. John escaped and Ellison reported back to his superiors in the Bureau (despite not being an active agent - but he was the only one experienced with the Connors so he was asked to check in on it) that it was not John Connor.

4. IF Skynet is truly defeated in the future, and their last ditch attempt was to send back the first/second Terminator, and if time is linear in both the future/present universes, why isn't the Resistance taking over the facilities of Skynet now and stopping all the hoopla? Has Skynet been defeated or not? Why is Skynet still functioning after the defeat?

Again also discussed in a recent episode; however, in the timeline of the series, Skynet has not been defeated in the future and is still operational. They have also explained that there are multiple parallel universes in play in the series (including characters who are from alternate universes).
 
The problem imo with TSCC is that it got too complicated. I have seen every episode and I really have to struggle to keep up with everything, they need to get back to basis.


After watching LOST since season 1, the plot in TSCC seems downright simple in comparision. At least the latter answers some questions in a timely manner.
 
I'll tell you why it is not being watched more and more:

1. The Terminator of the show, Cameron (Summer Glau) is not a compelling Terminator. She is not robotic enough and the storylines about her has been bland and 'been here done that' about her trying to be more human. We got seven years with Data on TNG about such and it was great then, not so now. She should play it more how Arnie plays it in the movies - cold, emotionless, no need to understand the nuances of human culture beyond what is needed to complete her mission. And her mission is to protect John Connor. That's her primary objective, to follow her programming. Her movements are made out to be too human - not a fault of Summer as she is doing what she is told - but the guidance she needs is to play the character to be more robotic.
Cameron is plenty robotic in behaviour - she makes no excuses for being a Terminator, doesn't seem to think she is inferior to humans and she seems to have considerably less problems with killing humans (pretty much like swatting a fly for her) than with killing Terminators (there have been hints she doesn't particularly like killing her own kind). I don't particularly see her trying to be "more human" either, except insofar as it helps with her mission and with manipulating humans. Sure, Cameron apparently likes to learn and she even seems to appreciate things like dancing and music, but those seem inherent to the robot, not a result of a desire or a move to be human - Cameron always had something with Chopin, apparently. This is probably because Cameron was designed and programmed to be an infiltrator rather than Terminator, and the design goal was for her to be able to mimic humans very convincingly - which she indeed has demonstrated in some circumstances. When she is acting "normally" though, we still see a robot rather awkwardly trying to fit in with the humans. And I don't see a desire to be more human - when she says to John that she can feel, this is presented as either part of an agenda to manipulate him, or as something that is inherent in this model of Terminator. She does not say she would want to feel, it's merely a matter-of-fact statement that she does. No emotion chip needs apply.

Cameron does have to appear something that resembles emotions (this was evident even in S1 though, it's not new), and she seems to think it's important that John does not see her (and other Terminators) as inherently cruel beings, but then Arnold's T800 showed similar tendencies in T2. As James Cameron said in an interview, "tin man found his heart" at the end of T2, when he understood why humans cried, why not killing is important, and when he sacrificed himself for them. Even the T1000 in T2 showed signs of getting frustrated/irritated at times, also an emotion-like state (for that matter, Skynet deciding to rebel against its makers also would have to be based on emotions, like fear). Cameron is not unique in this. If the T800 from T2 had spent months with (allied) humans instead of days, it would have to adapt further as well.

Regardless of whether or not Cameron is trying to be "more human", few would call her uncompelling. A look at any TSCC related message board shows that she is by far the most discussed character on the show, and I think many viewers see her as the main attraction in TSCC, due to both a compelling fictional character and a popular actress.

2. Too many variables, not enough resolution. So they blew up Cyberdyne systems but the Terminators have kept coming. Which means they didn't change the future much. So their focus should be on how the future might have changed, and why it didn't according to how they wanted it even after Cyberdyne corps have been blown to bits. Why aren't there any links to the show back to Cyberdyne?
There are links to Cyberdyne - Andy Good was a Cyberdyne intern, and Dyson's assistant. He develops Skynet (a version of it, at least) in TSCC. And one of the characters kills Good in the present, but it doesn't seem to have helped, partially because Terminators are also doing their best to protect Skynet in the present, making sure it gets build.
The characters are aware that they are changing the future, and that there may be multiple version of the future (this is tackled head-on in a particurlarly good S2 episode).
In this case, perhaps the problem is that the audience needs to actually pay attention to the show, or even watching it in the first place (?), before attacking it.

3. A woman, a kid, a scrawny looking scientist and a big lunking man destroyed one of the top research facilities in the USA for robotic systems. So why aren't Sarah and her child more in the news? How come in the real world, Interpol and a bunch of other law enforcement agencies working together can bring down a prostitution ring given enough time, but in nearly two decades they have not been able to find Sarah and her cohorts? Granted both of them do not exist anymore, but Sarah and John should be national sensations by now!
They probably were, many years ago. They have been dead for 8 years though, now. It's a very cold case, and there are bigger fish to fry now with 9-11 and all.

4. IF Skynet is truly defeated in the future, and their last ditch attempt was to send back the first/second Terminator, and if time is linear in both the future/present universes, why isn't the Resistance taking over the facilities of Skynet now and stopping all the hoopla? Has Skynet been defeated or not? Why is Skynet still functioning after the defeat?
Changes in the past affect the future. The robotic hand and half intact CPU of the first Terminator (T1) made Skynet stronger by T2, because now it was developped quicker because its own advanced tech got retro-engineered. In TSCC, the destruction of Cyberdyne led to an intern there building a Skynet that was in the end, probably even more advanced than what was Skynet in T2 - ironically because it got developped later (though this also delayed judgment day), so it could take advantage of newer technologies. Attempts during TSCC to further change the timeline seem to even have resulted in Skynet gaining strength in the future.

These things would crawl up the mind of any intelligent viewer/fans (and I'd say there are lots of them) and if these issues are not brought up or resolved then there is truly no fun in the mythos left, is there?
TSCC does not have a bad track record at resolving storylines, considerably better than the often highly acclaimed BSG does (core storylines from S1 still have not been resolved on that show). There was a big revelation in the last episode, for example, the answer to a question that was introduced early in S2, and by mid-S2 it's at least partly resolved. When there is an actual (and logical) pay-off,a bit of mystery in a show like TSCC is a good thing.
 
bad track record for resolving...

last night when they said "you've been looking so hard for the Turk."

I went and screamed at my monitor with out any thought, my subconscious just vomited "NO YOU HAVEN'T!"
 
I think part of the problem with the ratings could be the structural gulf between the film series and the ongoing series; the films are spectacular and brutally relentless chase narratives, and the ongoing series, since it can't duplicate that strategy, is trying very hard to be something else: a deliberately-paced drama in the vein of Lost, BSG, or Mad Men that variously depicts the individual perspective of each of the characters and builds intrigue out of what they do or do not choose to reveal to each other and why.
 
bad track record for resolving...

last night when they said "you've been looking so hard for the Turk."

I went and screamed at my monitor with out any thought, my subconscious just vomited "NO YOU HAVEN'T!"
TSCC has a very good track record for resolving things, when compared to critically-acclaimed shows like Lost and BSG. The former is even a big success with viewers as well, so why are season-spanning mysteries seen as bad when TSCC does them and as excellent TV when Lost or BSG does it - and those 2 shows often milk every mystery out for a long time?

I think Mordock is right: the TV series is very different in many respects from the fast-paced, adrenaline packed movies, and only part from the audience of the movies may accept the new approach. The public that watches "lost", OTOH, may have been repelled by the "Terminator" and SF labels, as Lost didn't start out as an SF show at the start.
 
OT: It actually gained over a million Nielsen viewers in last week's episode. This weeks looks like it could do well because of its mystery/horror like storyline.

In a lot of respects TSCC is a lot like Smallville: it does best when it deals with Terminator mythology storylines. Judgment Day, the Future War, etc.
 
This show is the show I look forward to most every week. Smallville being second. Now when Lost and BSG start that will change, but I think Terminator is a decent little show and for me, is something I really look forward to. The fact that it ISN'T just terminator of the week and chase after chase after chase, is what makes it interesting. We are seeing Skynet being built by itself...that is very cool.

And Summer Glau...holy shit.
 
Well, where I feel the show is losing itself is that they established the red-headed T-1000 at the beginning of this season and she's kind of been put on the back burner, and only borught around every once and a while to deal with the black cop dude. I would have thought that she would have been a major adversary much like Cromartie was in the first season.

Then they could have also been focused more on establishing the future resistance team. The military academy episode was a good start, but that direction was quickly dropped.

They're spending way too much time on this John-Riley relationship thing. It's becoming Terminator 90210. Which is what I was afraid of before this series even started airing.

But that said, I wished they'd explore more with the possibility that a human could fall in love with a machine and vice versa like was alluded to in the season 2 premier, thus blurring the difference between human and machine.

All I'm saying and hoping for is that by the end of this season, that there's some major pay-off in the end that makes all of these "filler" episodes make some sort of sense.

All I know is that I never get tired of watching Summer Glau. She's one cute girl and I recently discovered that she's not as young as she's portrayed in the series. She's actually 27. Born in '81.
 
And Summer Glau...holy shit.

she's hot

Tell me about it...here's my current desktop:

desktop.jpg
 
They're spending way too much time on this John-Riley relationship thing. It's becoming Terminator 90210. Which is what I was afraid of before this series even started airing.

But that said, I wished they'd explore more with the possibility that a human could fall in love with a machine and vice versa like was alluded to in the season 2 premier, thus blurring the difference between human and machine.

These two storylines go hand in hand from what I've been hearing.
 
They're spending way too much time on this John-Riley relationship thing. It's becoming Terminator 90210. Which is what I was afraid of before this series even started airing.

But that said, I wished they'd explore more with the possibility that a human could fall in love with a machine and vice versa like was alluded to in the season 2 premier, thus blurring the difference between human and machine.

These two storylines go hand in hand from what I've been hearing.

They'd almost have to. We're hearing "X has become X 90210" too much recently. Its become a cliche. So far John has met one human girl that he likes and is trying (in his messed-up way) to forge some kind of relationship with. Its realistic and hardly taking over the show, and anyway, since it turns out that Riley is from the future anyway, all is not what it seems.
 
Well, where I feel the show is losing itself is that they established the red-headed T-1000 at the beginning of this season and she's kind of been put on the back burner, and only borught around every once and a while to deal with the black cop dude. I would have thought that she would have been a major adversary much like Cromartie was in the first season.
Weaver is a major adversary, but there are 22 episodes this season, we don't need it all at once. Weaver will be back in the last episode before the break, and apparently it will be with a bang. In the meantime, she hasn't been doing half bad with manipulating Ellison and building her own AI.

Regarding 90210; what Bishbot said. Since Riley is not what she seems to be, and she is actually there to stop Cameron from growing to close to John, it's all connected to the future war and man/machine relation. The Weaver/Ellison/Turk("John Henry") storyline also might be about that, all things considered.
 
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They should use the Terminator intro music (dundundun dunn dunn dunnn!). Without it, the Terminator mythos seems light. :(
 
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