It seems to me that the writers intended them to represent ?????!!!!!
Who Were The Bajorans?
- Thread starter Kate Nichols
- Start date
...Everybody.
That is, the writers did their damnedest to keep the conflict of DS9 as generic as possible, so that the victims and villains could be anybody they wanted at any given week. There never was a moment where the Cardassians "couldn't do X because the Nazis never did that" or the Bajorans "must be shown being Y because the Palestinians always were that". The roles could be adjusted to reflect daily topics or be distanced from those - or, the most often, to effortlessly fit some preconceived slot when the writers were copying an old movie or episode from another show or whatever.
But to keep the controversy going, what's your suggestion?
Timo Saloniemi
That is, the writers did their damnedest to keep the conflict of DS9 as generic as possible, so that the victims and villains could be anybody they wanted at any given week. There never was a moment where the Cardassians "couldn't do X because the Nazis never did that" or the Bajorans "must be shown being Y because the Palestinians always were that". The roles could be adjusted to reflect daily topics or be distanced from those - or, the most often, to effortlessly fit some preconceived slot when the writers were copying an old movie or episode from another show or whatever.
But to keep the controversy going, what's your suggestion?
Timo Saloniemi
Insert "oppressed group" and allow the viewer to project onto that/read into it based on their experiences and world view.
That, after all, is the point of good allegory - to be flexible enough for the audience to find meaning in rather than being so prescriptive as to become parody.
That, after all, is the point of good allegory - to be flexible enough for the audience to find meaning in rather than being so prescriptive as to become parody.
Is this a question or are we supposed to try and guess your answer?
Any peoples who have been subjugated and repressed over the ages by those with more power.
Deep Space Nine took Wild West archetypes and put them in a sci-fi setting.
Quoting from Memory Alpha:
"In the DVD season special features the creators talk about the similarities between Deep Space Nine and an old Western setting Sisko as the mayor, Kira as a Native American, Bashir as a country doctor, Odo the lawman, Quark as the local barkeep, and Miles O'Brien the everyman wed to the local schoolmarm Keiko."
"The change in the setting spawned when Brandon Tartikoff originally approached Rick Berman about the show, he specifically said he wanted it to have a new format; if The Next Generation was Wagon Train in space, Deep Space Nine was to be The Rifleman in space – a man and his son coming to a dilapidated town on the edge of a new frontier."
Other groups have been mentioned in relation to the Bajorans, but it's Native American that sticks out to me.
Just an aside, I think it's DS9's adoption of that framework that let them hit the ground running. TNG and VOY both ended up with very underutilized characters, but the only one who needed revision in DS9 was Dax, the only character not really part of this Western idea.
Quoting from Memory Alpha:
"In the DVD season special features the creators talk about the similarities between Deep Space Nine and an old Western setting Sisko as the mayor, Kira as a Native American, Bashir as a country doctor, Odo the lawman, Quark as the local barkeep, and Miles O'Brien the everyman wed to the local schoolmarm Keiko."
"The change in the setting spawned when Brandon Tartikoff originally approached Rick Berman about the show, he specifically said he wanted it to have a new format; if The Next Generation was Wagon Train in space, Deep Space Nine was to be The Rifleman in space – a man and his son coming to a dilapidated town on the edge of a new frontier."
Other groups have been mentioned in relation to the Bajorans, but it's Native American that sticks out to me.
Just an aside, I think it's DS9's adoption of that framework that let them hit the ground running. TNG and VOY both ended up with very underutilized characters, but the only one who needed revision in DS9 was Dax, the only character not really part of this Western idea.
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I imagined they were intended to represent Beliebers, er, believers. Initially as Palestinians, then theists. Here's a question, how well were the Prophets represented? Or, were the Bajorans fools to keep believing in them after their true nature was discovered? Was it discovered? I guess I think more should have been done to make them more than just super-advanced aliens. If they even really were super-advanced. Coming from a non-linear dimension doesn't mean you've advanced beyond time.
M
marlboro
Guest
This is very interesting. I have to admit to not really getting a native American vibe from the Bajorans. Jews, Palestinians, northern Irish - I can see bits from all of them, but not native Americans.
Ive also never really understood the Wagon Train to the Stars thing either. I love westerns, but rarely have I seen a Trek episode that reminds me of one. Especially not Wagon Train. I don't understand why it would even be pitched as a western since the genre was well past its heyday by 65.
DS9 was The Rifleman in space, not Wagon Train. You can see the first episodes of The Rifleman to see how much influence it had on the pilot (debunking the notion tharmt they plagiarized Babylon 5 in the process).
No specific group, just in general a group of people in any given oppressed war ridden country that resent the privileges first world countries just see as the standard.
I don’t get an a Native American feel from them, either.
I'm just revisiting the first season of DS9 now, and I'm surprised how poorly served Dax is. I don't remember her being so peripheral - even in the episode ''Dax" she hardly says anything. And this after having a prominent role in the pilot.
Very odd. I guess they wanted to avoid technobabble 'anomoly of the week' plots for the science officer. It took a while to find her role.
It's only when the writers realised that after 300 years and seven lifetimes she'd have a thirst of life and adventure. I find its the episode that sees the return of Kang, Kor and Koloth that she becomes the more fun-loving Dax we all know and love.
From Memory Alpha:
"The introduction of the Bajorans in "Ensign Ro" seemed to suggest that Rick Berman and Michael Piller, who wrote the episode, sympathized with the plight of the Palestinians. "The Bajorans are the PLO but they're also the Kurds, the Jews, and the American Indians," Piller responded. "They are any racially bound group of people who have been deprived of their home by a powerful force [....] When you talk about a civilization like the Bajorans who were great architects and builders with enormous artistic skills centuries before humans were even standing erect, you might be thinking a lot more about Indians than Palestinians." (Cinefantastique, Vol. 23, No. 2/3, p. 38 & 43) Berman, discussing "Ensign Ro", similarly emphasized that the Bajorans were not modeled on any particular real-life group; "The Kurds, the Palestinians, the Jews in the 1940s, the boat people from Haiti – unfortunately, the homeless and terrorism are problems [in every age]." (Star Trek: The Next Generation Companion)
...
Regarding parallels between the Bajorans and real-world cultures, Ronald D. Moore commented, "Depending on the episode, you could also call Bajor Israel, or Iran, or even America and the Cardassians could be Germans, or Russians or several other examples. While these parallels do enter our discussions and sometimes are more overt than others, we don't really try to make Bajor a direct analogy to any specific contemporary country or people. Blending the experiences of many Earth peoples and races into our storytelling allows us to comment on these subjects without advocating a particular political point of view, while at the same time allowing us to view the topics in a different light without the baggage of contemporary politics." (AOL chat, 1997)"
"The introduction of the Bajorans in "Ensign Ro" seemed to suggest that Rick Berman and Michael Piller, who wrote the episode, sympathized with the plight of the Palestinians. "The Bajorans are the PLO but they're also the Kurds, the Jews, and the American Indians," Piller responded. "They are any racially bound group of people who have been deprived of their home by a powerful force [....] When you talk about a civilization like the Bajorans who were great architects and builders with enormous artistic skills centuries before humans were even standing erect, you might be thinking a lot more about Indians than Palestinians." (Cinefantastique, Vol. 23, No. 2/3, p. 38 & 43) Berman, discussing "Ensign Ro", similarly emphasized that the Bajorans were not modeled on any particular real-life group; "The Kurds, the Palestinians, the Jews in the 1940s, the boat people from Haiti – unfortunately, the homeless and terrorism are problems [in every age]." (Star Trek: The Next Generation Companion)
...
Regarding parallels between the Bajorans and real-world cultures, Ronald D. Moore commented, "Depending on the episode, you could also call Bajor Israel, or Iran, or even America and the Cardassians could be Germans, or Russians or several other examples. While these parallels do enter our discussions and sometimes are more overt than others, we don't really try to make Bajor a direct analogy to any specific contemporary country or people. Blending the experiences of many Earth peoples and races into our storytelling allows us to comment on these subjects without advocating a particular political point of view, while at the same time allowing us to view the topics in a different light without the baggage of contemporary politics." (AOL chat, 1997)"
Who hasn't been treated like crap by someone(s) and held on to one thing they believe in in order to get through dark times?
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