"Where Silence Has Lease": Nagilum's observations

[Mojochi]

Well that's a handy rationalization I don't completely buy

 

[Ragitsu]

Well that's a handy rationalization I don't completely buy

For Nagilum, the (presumably human) scientists or both?

 

[at Quark's]

Well, while it is viewing humanity through a very unfavourable lens, those observations aren't necessarily invalid.

• Finds no tranquility in anything.

That could be linked to their desire to explore. Not being content with what you know, the status quo, but always desiring to know more - that is, after all, a kind of intranquility.

• Struggles against the inevitable.

If Nagilum was as powerful as it seemed, he could have forced death on one third of the crew had he really desired to do so, and in that sense it would have been inevitable, but they kept struggling against that fate, finding that 'compromise' unacceptable.

• Rash.

Blowing up the ship, preferring to cause your own end ensuring all die, rather than let Nagilum kill only a portion of them could be viewed, I suppose, as rash.

The 'militant, agressive, hostile' part could be due to their ship bristling with weaponry, their blowing up that Romulan warbird (even though it fired on them first), and perhaps how Worf responded on that fake Yamato.

• Quick to judge.
• Slow to change.

Those are harder for me to place.

Disclaimer: I don't agree with Nagilum, only saying he could interpret events that way.

 

[Unimatrix Q]

It's also interesting that that the writers had Nagilum create illusions of romulan warbirds instead of ferengi marauders.

Weren't the Ferengi still meant to be the main enemies of the Federation in TNG, at this point?

 

[Orphalesion]

Eh, Nagilums assessment sounded more some pseudo-philosophical bullpoop put there by an uninspired script writer.

I don't think it has any direct relation to what happened in the episode.

 

[Ragitsu]

Nomex tick.

 

[Ragitsu]

Eh, Nagilums assessment sounded more some pseudo-philosophical bullpoop put there by an uninspired script writer.

I don't think it has any direct relation to what happened in the episode.

I don't necessarily disagree with everything it stated...I just think it would've been neat to connect those remarks to the crew's actual actions instead of having the assessment based (solely?) off of mind-reading.

 

[Ragitsu]

The guy is thinking of the ship, not individual people. That's not being selfish.

Come to think of it, Picard was willing to put the Enterprise in harm's way for an individual ("Justice"). A later episode would examine the necessity of sacrificing a crew member for the safety of the ship, BUT...they're also big on "Leave no one behind.".

 

[Dukhat]

It's also interesting that that the writers had Nagilum create illusions of romulan warbirds instead of ferengi marauders.

Weren't the Ferengi still meant to be the main enemies of the Federation in TNG, at this point?

The Ferengi stopped being credible enemies of the Federation after the first episode they were featured in.

 

[Orphalesion]

And the Romulans were re-introduced at the end of Season 1, possibly to replace the Ferengi as "main antagonists"

 

[Oddish]

Regarding Haskell, we don't know everything. Maybe he had a wife onboard, or a kid in the ship's daycare center. Is it wrong for him to want to go for the star fix and guarantee their safety? And regardless, sacrificing two crew to save 1000 is a reasonable decision, one that both Riker and Worf would completely support.

The comparison that comes up (and was hinted at in this episode) is that of scientists performing tests on laboratory animals...tests that occasionally result in the death of a subject.

"Scientific Method" revisits this theme. And, Janeway's response is surprisingly similar to Picard's.

 

[Ragitsu]

Regarding Haskell, we don't know everything. Maybe he had a wife onboard, or a kid in the ship's daycare center. Is it wrong for him to want to go for the star fix and guarantee their safety?

Maybe, maybe and maybe. All we have to go on for certain is that which was displayed.

And regardless, sacrificing two crew to save 1000 is a reasonable decision, one that both Riker and Worf would completely support.

I'm sure they would probably volunteer, but that's not the same as sacrificing them. The Captain has shown that he doesn't allow that kind of arithmetic to guide his decisions ("Justice", "Where Silence Has Lease" and "Man of the People").

 

[Oddish]

Good thing Riker wasn't testing him in "Thine Own Self"!

 

[dupersuper]

"Scientific Method" revisits this theme. And, Janeway's response is surprisingly similar to Picard's.

Starfleet captains don't appreciate being effed with...

 

[Ragitsu]

Good thing Riker wasn't testing him in "Thine Own Self"

Remember When The Bough Breaks?

RADUE [on viewscreen]: Captain, we want you to understand the nature of your choice. A small demonstration of our power.
(Something whizzes around the planet and knocks the Enterprise spinning out of orbit, into deep space) PICARD: What was that?
DATA: I believe it was a repulsor beam.
PICARD: Position report.
LAFORGE: This is unbelievable, sir. According to my calculations, we're three days from Aldea. At warp nine.
RIKER: And they call that a small demonstration?
PICARD: Geordi, get us back to Aldea. Warp nine.
LAFORGE: Aye, sir.
RADUE [on viewscreen]: Captain, if you don't accept our terms, the Enterprise will be pushed so far away that by the time you return, your children will be grandparents.

How many children were taken? How many people reside onboard the Enterprise? Fifty to sixty years (at least) at Warp 9? Yeah...if it were a simple matter of comparing numbers, Picard would have ordered the ship to leave. This assumes, of course, that Radue could have made good on his threat and wasn't just throwing hyperbole out there.

 

[at Quark's]

This assumes, of course, that Radue could have made good on his threat and wasn't just throwing hyperbole out there.

Most likely he couldn't have made good on his threat.

Even if only because if those abducted children stayed there, they would become infertile as well (as Beverly asserts at the end of the episode).

 

[dupersuper]

Most likely he couldn't have made good on his threat.

Even if only because if those abducted children stayed there, they would become infertile as well (as Beverly asserts at the end of the episode).

Well, he didn't know that at the time.

 

[Ragitsu]

They were in the dark on that particular fact until it was brought to their attention.

 

[Ragitsu]

...can you imagine if the events of Star Trek: Voyager had been kicked off not because of the Caretaker's desire to find a mate, but because of one seriously steamed Radue?

Janeway: "Oops."

 

[Farscape One]

Well, while it is viewing humanity through a very unfavourable lens, those observations aren't necessarily invalid.

• Finds no tranquility in anything.

That could be linked to their desire to explore. Not being content with what you know, the status quo, but always desiring to know more - that is, after all, a kind of intranquility.

• Struggles against the inevitable.

If Nagilum was as powerful as it seemed, he could have forced death on one third of the crew had he really desired to do so, and in that sense it would have been inevitable, but they kept struggling against that fate, finding that 'compromise' unacceptable.

• Rash.

Blowing up the ship, preferring to cause your own end ensuring all die, rather than let Nagilum kill only a portion of them could be viewed, I suppose, as rash.

The 'militant, agressive, hostile' part could be due to their ship bristling with weaponry, their blowing up that Romulan warbird (even though it fired on them first), and perhaps how Worf responded on that fake Yamato.

• Quick to judge.
• Slow to change.

Those are harder for me to place.

Disclaimer: I don't agree with Nagilum, only saying he could interpret events that way.

Good points on how Nagilum could have seen the crew.

He obviously could have either been telepathic or was able to go through the ship's database. Possibly both. This explains why he was able to create a fake Romulan warbird and the Yamato.

Regarding 'quick to judge' and 'slow to change', he could be referring to the historical records. Or just the thoughts of the crew. 'Slow to change' could be a reference to our history, as real change does take a very long time. 'Quick to judge' could very well refer to the same thing.


In any event, this has always been one of my favorite episodes. Excellent creep factor, great premise, great performances. And it kicked off the TNG season 2 theme of how dangerous space really is. (At least, I feel that was the theme. Few seasons in the franchise really capture that feel like this one did.)