When did Fred Freiberger jump the shark?

[Ssosmcin]

Freiberger got around that by creating what was known as the "double-up" episode -

He did institute it into the series, but that method of splitting the cast and shooting two simultaneously was already a practice in Hollywood. While I'm sure there are others, both Lost in Space and Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea did this to catch up on the schedule and meet air dates in their respective first seasons.

Voyage: The Exile / The Amphibians
Lost in Space: War of the Robots / The Magic Mirror and All that Glitters / Lost Civilization

It's a wonder Freiberger didn't do that on Star Trek, especially with episodes like The Tholian Web and The Mark of Gideon (obviously the completion of those scripts would have something to do with it).

 

[Richard S. Ta]

I’ve seen most episodes of Star Trek once and once only, which may seem quite sacrilegious to you guys, but there it is…

I put Requiem for Methuselah on today, inspired by this thread and… gosh, it was rubbish. Just a random pick, but wow… Kirk’s crew is dropping like flies from an epidemic but for some reason he forgets that and falls in love with a robot in the space of a few hours?

Not the Kirk I recognise from earlier stories.

Maybe I just chose a bad one?

 

[Ssosmcin]

Maybe I just chose a bad one?

What could have been a brilliant episode was diminished by Kirk's story. Wanna list of good ones?

Spectre of the Gun
The Tholian Web
Day of the Dove
All Our Yesterdays
That Which Survives

The stories do generally suffer towards the end due to the lack of time, money and the fact that it was down to two guys doing rewrites after the screenwriters were done with them. They had to be "shootable" at least and then move on to the next one. When they lost Fontana, Lucas and even Justman, they didn't replace them with story people. And Roddenberry was long gone. Freiberger had to story edit as well as line produce.

If he had a couple of more people there working on the story editing, I'm sure the final products would have been somewhat stronger.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

What could have been a brilliant episode was diminished by Kirk's story. Wanna list of good ones?

Bixby’s idea of an immortal witnessing all human history was something he’d return to many decades later. That’s a great idea.

But yeah, seeing Kirk so morose in his room to the point where Spock has to mind-wipe him… or seeing Kirk lose sight of the deadly epidemic taking place aboard his ship as soon as an attractive blonde entered the room.

Dear me.

Wanna list of good ones?

Spectre of the Gun
The Tholian Web
Day of the Dove
All Our Yesterdays
That Which Survives

Appreciated. The two I’ve bolded are favourites of mine that I’ve returned to a few times. I’m also a huge fan of The Empath in Season 3.

The others, I’ll be sure to check out.

 

[Tallguy]

Maybe I just chose a bad one?

Yes!

I'm pretty sure it was the last TOS episode I saw. If I saw it when I was a kid I NEVER remembered it and I didn't see it until I got the season 3 DVD box. It's NOT good.

 

[Commander Troi]

I loved Flint and the idea of him, but that may have to do with the very good actor playing him. It'll be interesting to see it again when it pops up in my TOS rewatch.

 

[Poltargyst]

I’ve seen most episodes of Star Trek once and once only, which may seem quite sacrilegious to you guys, but there it is…

I put Requiem for Methuselah on today, inspired by this thread and… gosh, it was rubbish. Just a random pick, but wow… Kirk’s crew is dropping like flies from an epidemic but for some reason he forgets that and falls in love with a robot in the space of a few hours?

Not the Kirk I recognise from earlier stories.

Maybe I just chose a bad one?

In my headcanon, Flint has manipulated Kirk's emotions to make him fall so hard for Rayna to the exclusion of all else as part of Flint's experiment with Rayna. I like the episode otherwise.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

On the recommendation of @Ssosmcin, I put on Spectre of the Gun today.

Solid episode.

I could have done without Chekhov’s idiocy, but then that’s a wider problem that’s not limited to Freddie’s episodes.

Nice design, nice direction and a pretty good story.

My only confusion is why the tranquilliser didn’t work. If McCoy and Spock believed it would work, then surely by extension Scotty and Kirk should have also believed it would be effective?

It’s not like Spock and McCoy are often wrong in terms of chemistry and science? They are both respected scientists among the crew?

So why didn’t it work?

Regardless, a strong episode.

 

[I am not Herbert]

I’ve seen most episodes of Star Trek once and once only, which may seem quite sacrilegious to you guys, but there it is…

I put Requiem for Methuselah on today, inspired by this thread and… gosh, it was rubbish.

Hardly sacrilegious, especially considering that anyone here older then 30 (like me, by a comfortable margin) grew up watching these shows through the happenstance of local syndication schedules. I'm a grade-A TOS enthusiast yet watched "Space Seed" for the first time two years ago.

As for Requiem for Methuselah-- well, to each their own. I saw it for the first time since childhood a few months ago and greatly enjoyed it. There was a good conversation about it on the "Episodes You Once Disliked..." thread a little while back.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

As for Requiem for Methuselah-- well, to each their own. I saw it for the first time since childhood a few months ago and greatly enjoyed it. There was a good conversation about it on the "Episodes You Once Disliked..." thread a little while back.

I thought there was a good idea in it, but gosh, the way Kirk fell for Rayna, so hard, so fast, when his crew were dying in orbit…

It took me out of it. As you say though, each to their own!

 

[Forbin]

I love Requiem, but yeah, I recognize its faults. For me it's not so much Kirk's "blinded by love" (I've been there ), but the silliness of Flint being ALL those famous people of varying specialties and talents.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

I love Requiem, but yeah, I recognize its faults. For me it's not so much Kirk's "blinded by love" (I've been there ), but the silliness of Flint being ALL those famous people of varying specialties and talents.

Something that struck me was the fact that Flint said he found he was immortal, then learned to hide…

And when he says he learned to hide he meant that he established himself over several millennia as some of the most influential figures in humanity’s artistic, cultural and scientific development.

 

[Ssosmcin]

The very definition of "hiding in plain sight."

 

[fireproof78]

Something that struck me was the fact that Flint said he found he was immortal, then learned to hide…

And when he says he learned to hide he meant that he established himself over several millennia as some of the most influential figures in humanity’s artistic, cultural and scientific development.

The Purloined Immortal.

 

[Poltargyst]

Something that struck me was the fact that Flint said he found he was immortal, then learned to hide…

And when he says he learned to hide he meant that he established himself over several millennia as some of the most influential figures in humanity’s artistic, cultural and scientific development.

Well, it's not like there were any film or photographs back then...

 

[fireproof78]

Well, it's not like there were any film or photographs back then...

Except, Leo appeared in an episode of Voyager.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

Well, it's not like there were any film or photographs back then...

You can split it any way you want. Being Leonardo (just to take one example) would mean you exist at the very centre of the renaissance period in terms of both art and science.

That’s not hiding.

 

[Tallguy]

You can split it any way you want. Being Leonardo (just to take one example) would mean you exist at the very centre of the renaissance period in terms of both art and science.

That’s not hiding.

It is when you fake your death and become someone else. Presumably in a different country.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

It is when you fake your death and become someone else. Presumably in a different country.

You are welcome to swallow it.

I just thought it’s one more silly thing in a pretty silly episode.

Likewise McCoy’s reveal at the end that Flint was dying because he needed the ‘Fields’ of Earth to remain immortal.

 

[Tallguy]

Clearly Flint was a) James Mortiarty and b) misunderstood.

Likewise McCoy’s reveal at the end that Flint was dying because he needed the ‘Fields’ of Earth to remain immortal.

I thought that was one of the most sensible things about the episode.