What would/does Rick Berman think of Picard?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by Damian, Dec 30, 2020.

  1. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Same here. It is completely baffling to me to act like a prequel cannot be suspenseful because we know the outcome. I mean, how in the world did Titanic gross so much money if that was the case? :wtf:
     
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  2. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Commodore Commodore

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    Baja?! I haven't got anything in Baja!
    Plus, with ENT's third season you could still easily dangle the idea that some of the heroes won't make it, because we do KNOW that Earth will still be around for the 24th century, but we don't know what will happen with Archer. That was something I think S3 did well, by focusing on how Earth in peril impacted the characters, especially Trip who's coping with the loss of his sister from that attack on Earth.

    But I guess I'm getting off topic.
     
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  3. Amasov

    Amasov Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, I suppose. You're right.
     
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  4. Amasov

    Amasov Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    And please forgive me. I realize when I read my posts I come off sounding like a wet blanket - moreso recently than in the past.
     
  5. dupersuper

    dupersuper Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Don't forget Dusty Springfield...
     
  6. Serin117

    Serin117 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Too gay.
     
  7. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    No such thing. :)
     
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  8. Serin117

    Serin117 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Too bloody right!
     
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  9. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    For the examples I cited: pure nonsense.

    That's true of any element, be it the writing, the acting, the direction, the cinematography, the set, the lighting, the art design, the whatever. Every element needs to be used in a way that is well thought-out and enhances the story.

    No one is arguing that there are never situations where music -- or these other elements! -- are used in a thoughtless attempt to draw the audience's attention away from an overall bad production. But I am arguing that popular music, just like orchestral music, and just like other elements, can be used in a thoughtful, effective way and that space opera shows should not be obliged to only use orchestral per se.

    Maybe -- maybe not. Music can be more than just a pretty ornament -- it can be something that reacts to and comments upon the scene unfolding, and therefore can enhance the level of depth and sophistication involved. As video essayist Patrick H. Willems noted in his most recent video, for instance, Martin Scorsese carefully chose the songs used in GoodFellas to express the emotional journey the main character goes on. Popular music in a film or TV show can end up being a modern sort of "Greek Chorus."

    I think "The End of the World" was very effective in its use of "Toxic" and "Tainted Love" -- it established very early on that Doctor Who would be a show that was playful and wouldn't have a stick up its ass about its own storytelling; it established that underneath the trappings of a sci-fi adventure show, it would be a romance between the Doctor and Rose (which it was for its first two seasons); and it foreshadowed the ways in which that romance was frankly doomed.

    That is the absolute worst possible way I could ever imagine adding popular music to a scene -- to have it be nothing but "ear candy" that adds nothing to the story, makes no comment upon the story, can easily be removed without affecting anything.
     
  10. Farscape One

    Farscape One Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The biggest problem with using popular music on a series is exactly that... it uses popular music at the time it was produced. Music tastes change a lot over the years. This can age a series or movie much more than if just using a scored composition.
     
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  11. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yup. That's why pop music in media is a gamble.
     
  12. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Even a scored composition can still age things. I mean, while watching the early seasons of TNG one of the things that really pops out these days is how distinctly 1980s sounding the music is.

    Though admittedly, that's preferable the the bland auditory wallpaper the music from the later seasons is.
     
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  13. Farscape One

    Farscape One Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Doesn't age as easily, I think.
     
  14. nic3636

    nic3636 Commander Red Shirt

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    "Faith of the Heart" is a timeless classic that will live forever, and I will hear nothing to the contrary.
     
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  15. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Of my pop culture songs in popular media Faith of the Heart is my favorite.
     
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  16. nic3636

    nic3636 Commander Red Shirt

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    Its my ringtone.
     
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  17. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    I mean, sure, but every element of production can and will age. That's just the nature of art.

    Besides, "popular music" as a term encompasses not just music that's recent but really almost any song produced commercially since the early 20th Century. There's a great deal of popular music that's lasted decades that can work in a space opera -- just look at the soundtrack to both Guardians of the Galaxy films.

    ETA:

    Also, being distinctly of an era is not a bad thing per se. The music featured on Buffy the Vampire Slayer is very distinctly late 90s/early 00s, but that just adds to the show's tone and aesthetic -- it doesn't detract from its artistic strengths.
     
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  18. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    Why should we care what Berman thinks? The dude was an asshole.
     
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  19. Xhiandra

    Xhiandra Captain Captain

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    He's right on the last one: Elnor should be in a catsuit and heels. Maybe Rios as well.

    Yes, but nobody ever uses Unanimated's "Life Demise".

    I'm only half-joking: whilst "popular music" does indeed mean pretty much everything produced in the last century, its use in film and TV doesn't, it mostly means "things that are popular right now, very 'safe', and quite ephemeral in nature."
    Things like experimental Jazz and Metal won't see much (if any) use.

    (as a metalhead, the idea that a song, artist or entire genre is "retro" is so alien to me. There's good Metal and bad Metal, doesn't matter one bit if it's decades old or released yesterday)
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2021