What was the IRS for?

[rfmcdpei]

Well, then I guess it'll still be a surprise for you.

I was also gunning for a divided Romulus at the time of the nova. Having a single Empire (and a moderately led one, at that) doesn't seem as interesting to see go foom.

This is a slight aside, but has anyone ever discussed the possibility that the nova was the inciting incident for the Klingons conquering the Romulans in the "All Good Things" future? I mean, all things being equal, if the nova was a natural event, then it'd happen in all of the various alternate Trek timelines.

It's a cool idea, but Romulus is mentioned by name in the "All Good Things" alternate future. Maybe Spock launched in time, or maybe the supernova (which may well have been unnatural - just look at "The Q and the Grey") never happened.

For those interested, The Needs of the Many technobabbles the hell of of the Hobus supernova. Short answer: 20 years later, they still don't really know what happened.

One problem is that the names of some species' homeworlds--"Romulus" and "Cardassia" come to mind--are frequently used as names for the wider civilizations rooted on those homeworlds. When Garak talks about Cardassia, he's talking as much about Cardassian civilization as the actual planet of Cardassia.

At this stage, speculation is sterile. IMHO.

 

[rfmcdpei]

I would also like to get back on track and say that I am disappointed that the IRS plot was resolved so relatively quickly. Donatra would have made a fantastic ongoing character and I figured that something similar would happen, with Tal'aura dead replaced by someone sane and competent, but that there would be a reconciliation with Donatra bringing the IRS back into the Empire while retaining the title of Empress. This would have raised the potential for internal conflict in the Empire with Praetor obligated to honor the Typhon Pact agreement, and Donatra favouring closer ties with the Khitomer Alliance powers.

While the idea of a politically divided Romulan civilization was interesting, the problem was that it had the potential to result in another catastrophic galactic war. It was difficult enough to keep Germany and Korea divided when the Cold War superpowers were able to dominate their client data. How much more difficult would it be to keep the two Romulan states from going at each other--and drawing everyone in--when the divided nation in question is arguably the most intact and potentially post-Borg nation in the Alpha and Beta Quadrants? Since continued catastrophic war would put me off, and the division looked to be fairly temporary anyway, the collapse of one empire into another seemed likely and plausible, especially the way George did it.

Quick question, is the Countdown comic regarded as canon, or just the film.

The film's screenwriters, who also wrote the story premise of Countdown, have acknowledged that it is not canonical.

However, Star Trek Online has chosen to incorporate it into their version of the continuity (and vice-versa, because the uniforms appearing in Countdown are the ones designed for STO). It's a prominent enough story that it might be deemed worthy of referencing regardless of its "canon" status (something that isn't remotely as important as fans tend to think it is). To date, the novels have shown no indication of following Countdown's lead, but I don't think any definitive contradictions have arisen yet either, so if there were some future editorial or executive decision to incorporate Countdown, or at least aspects of it, into the novelverse, it could still happen.

Is there anything in Countdown that is specifically excluded by events in the novelverse? Moderately friendly Vulcan/Federation-Romulan relations, say, are present. Is the praetor a man, though?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Countdown takes place in the universe of Star Trek Online, which has already been demonstrated to be incompatible with the novelverse.

 

[DimesDan]

^ Countdown takes place in the universe of Star Trek Online, which has already been demonstrated to be incompatible with the novelverse.

Does it?

I was under the impression that it exists in the "prime" universe because it ties in to the reason why Nero and Spock go back in time and thus making it "canon" and that "it really happened."

 

[David Mack]

What was the IRS for? To quote Triumph the Insult Comic Dog, it was "for me to poop on!"

 

[Christopher]

Is there anything in Countdown that is specifically excluded by events in the novelverse? Moderately friendly Vulcan/Federation-Romulan relations, say, are present. Is the praetor a man, though?

Well, the praetorship could change hands in the course of five years. If -- and this is a big if -- the novel editors decided (or were instructed) to make the books compatible with Countdown, I think it could be done, though it might require some contrivances.

^ Countdown takes place in the universe of Star Trek Online, which has already been demonstrated to be incompatible with the novelverse.

You're misunderstanding how this works. It's hardly unprecedented for different tie-in continuities to incorporate some of the same events; obviously, every tie-in "timeline" must incorporate the events of canonical Trek episodes, even if they otherwise contradict each other.

Countdown was created to tie into the Prime universe and the Abrams film universe -- more specifically, to tie them together, to provide a bridge between them. The developers of Star Trek Online chose to incorporate elements of Countdown into their continuity, and the artists of Countdown chose to adopt the uniform designs from STO in turn. These are works of fiction choosing to borrow from one another -- just as STO also chose to borrow certain elements from the novel continuity while disregarding others.

It's not there are actual discrete timelines out there that the various tie-ins are somehow observing and chronicling. These are made-up stories that sometimes cross-pollinate to whatever degree the storytellers find useful. STO has chosen to draw on Countdown and vice-versa, yes, but that doesn't preclude the lit-verse from drawing on Countdown as well if it chooses to.

There is precedent for one tie-in work being referenced in two or more different, incompatible tie-in continuities. Diane Duane's Rihannsu continuity was referenced in other Pocket novels and in the DC Trek comics, even though there were contradictions between the novel and comics continuities of the day (for instance, their incompatible versions of Kirk's first mission as Enterprise captain). Similarly, some elements from the Rihannsu continuity are being referenced in the modern novel continuity even though it's separate from the '80s novel continuity. So it's not like "belonging" to one tie-in continuity makes something off-limits to other tie-in continuities.