What they should have done...

[Tebok]

By the time Voyager got home, it should have looked looked somewhat run down with a mix of alien and federation technology. I think some major damage should have been beyond their abilities without use of repair facilities and required the use of equipment and parts from Delta Quadrant Races.

One of the big nitpicks of the show was the endless supply of shuttles and torpedoes Voyager had. They could have easily used alien craft to replace their lost shuttles as well as alien weaponry.

Neelix's kitchen was a great addition, showing how they needed to actually harvest real food rather than rely on replicators all the time, as well as the hydroponics bay. They really should have continued along those lines, making drastic changes in order to keep the ship going and its crew alive.

 

[2takesfrakes]

I agree that VOYAGER should've been threatened much more seriously than it was. Also, the endless supply of shuttles seemed ridiculous, somehow ... though, I could accept the torpedoes being fabricated, rather easily. Otherwise, there were plenty of opportunities to keep the ship in shape and looking spiffy, along the way. This aspect has been greatly exaggerated as a "flaw" of the show. What did ring false was that, despite having a crew on short rations - of every kind - the Holodeck is up and running 24/7 ... mostly, it seems, for Harry Kim's benefit. Also, there were too many Humanoid, rubber-headed aliens in the DQ. It should've been populated with creatures and beings that exceeded even the most discriminating audience's wildest imagination ...

 

[MacLeod]

I agree that VOYAGER should've been threatened much more seriously than it was. Also, the endless supply of shuttles seemed ridiculous, somehow ... though, I could accept the torpedoes being fabricated, rather easily. .

Nope they can't be fabricated easily are we are told they have no way of replacing them. If they ould be fabricated easily they would have a way of replacing them. If they hadn't had that line in we wouldn't be counting the number of torpedeos used or shuttles lost etc..

Because the logical extension of the line is if they can't replace torpedeos, they can't replace shuttles, etc.. etc...

They imposed a limit on what Voyager could or couldn't do, it's not good writing to impose a limit on yourself just to ignore it. Their solution was simply 3 seconds or so

Captain's Log, Engineering reports they have found a way to replenish or supply of torpedeos.

 

[stardream]

They built the Delta Flyer. If they could do that, twice, it stands to reason that they could have also replaced the smaller less intricate shuttles.

I will agree with the complaint about the torpedos, though...although in all honesty, I forgot about the 'no way to replace the photon torpedo' line when I was actually watching the show. Watching it from week to week with long summer breaks somehow it faded from memory. I didn't think about it until years later when I came online and found fans talking about it.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Nope they can't be fabricated easily are we are told they have no way of replacing them. If they ould be fabricated easily they would have a way of replacing them. If they hadn't had that line in we wouldn't be counting the number of torpedeos used or shuttles lost etc..

Because the logical extension of the line is if they can't replace torpedeos, they can't replace shuttles, etc.. etc...

They imposed a limit on what Voyager could or couldn't do, it's not good writing to impose a limit on yourself just to ignore it. Their solution was simply 3 seconds or so

Captain's Log, Engineering reports they have found a way to replenish or supply of torpedeos.

I happen to agree with you, regarding the torpedoes. But from a resource point of view, they're relatively small - certainly, when compared to a Delta Flyer. As for the inconsistency, or ignoring a previously established boundary ... it doesn't ruing the fun for me, especially if allows for "The Adventure to Continue ..." The writing pongs a bit in this franchise, sometimes. And it is frustrating. Especially when something so amazingly cool as The Genesis Project is introduced just to put our Heroes into a mischief and then gets dismissed, without having been adequately explored. But what can happen about the writing, though? Fans complain, but ...

nobody listens.

 

[Sophie74656]

They did end up with a mix of federation and alien technology. After Scorpion they left some of the borg technology, and used more borg technology in the astrometrics lab and in the Delta Flyer.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I always think of the likes of BSG and SGU, where the people were really struggling to get by most of the time and resources were a key concern. VOY really did come across as too easy most of the time, thanks to the reset button.

 

[Vandervecken]

I happen to agree with you, regarding the torpedoes. But from a resource point of view, they're relatively small - certainly, when compared to a Delta Flyer.

Small when compared to the Delta Flyer, which could also be a bomb in a pinch, but large compared to most other things because of the energy expenditure in making something ready to go big boom.



This discussion is interesting--seems they don't actually hit zero torps until Night in season 5. That's not so bad continuity-wise:

http://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/23850/how-did-voyager-replace-its-photon-torpedoes

Also I don't know if you'd include the ST Tech Manual as acceptable canon--I don't ordinarily count book anything--but it does say you can build torps with planetary materials, which makes sense, because it's that or replication or nothing, and Voyager had plenty of access to planets. While I wouldn't ordinarily count anything off screen as canon, in this case it's one or the other in 24th-century Trek, given the right tools: either you replicate, or you build from raw materials gathered on planets or in space. Torps have to be manufacturable somehow. So I accept that they built them from planetary stuff based on the logic of process of elimination.

 

[Sophie74656]

There were plenty of episodes that showed them struggling with food and supplies, having to land to make extensive repairs, having to ration replicator use, etc.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I can think of two or three episodes where that was the case, but the following week it was a moot point, because plot!

 

[Catarina]

we can explain away most of it but boy they sure could make those corridors look like new after being ripped apart. And a sparkling new identical sickbay too! wow...no scarcity for those metals thankfully

 

[Sophie74656]

I can think of two or three episodes where that was the case, but the following week it was a moot point, because plot!

Yes, it's a tv show

 

[Deks]

Actually, given the technology voyager has... any ship in the 24th century would be capable of full self-sufficiency.
They convert energy into matter for crying out loud. There's an abundance of solar energy in every star system, and these Zettajoules of power could easily be used to power the replicators and replicate away at basically anything.
They also have energy converters and self-repair systems.

Replicators were never said to not being able to replicate something... just that they require certain amount of energy to do so.
More complex items likely require more energy.

If anything, Voyager being unscathed most of the time was realistic representation for their technology.
Struggling with food supplies was ridiculous and unrealistic for their level of technology.

I would have loved seeing Voyager parked in a star system doing industrial replication or tying up multiple replicators towards the same use along with transporters for replicating anything apart from using the Warp core.
In addition, it would have been great to see the ship's crew doing a lot more scientific research in labs in conjuction with using the computer's massive computational capabilities to take their ideas and continuously advance their technology (automated R&D... this alone would have solved their slow warp issues within a year or two because even today, IBM's watson is doing research for Humans in mere days that would take us years or decades to do on our own - Starfleet's computer systems are incredibly far more advanced in comparison and are able to do incomprehensibly more stuff at the same time).

Would have been nice to see much faster warp velocities as it is utterly non realistic that they would need 75 years to get back.
SF ships were portrayed to be able to go much faster than that... and even Paris said that Warp 9.9 equals 4 billion miles per second (that's over 21 000 ly's per year).
And Voyager's 'top cruising speed' (meaning the velocity they can sustain indefinitely) was reported as Warp 9.975
That speed would return Voyager to Earth in under a week (considering that every incremental increase past 9.9 results in doubling of speed).

At any rate, torpedoes, shuttles and self-repair isn't the issue... the writers were too negligent in creating a story that FITS with this level of technology... and so they ended up dumbing things down.

The Bussard Collectors alone keep generating power for the ship as its constantly moving... I find it very unrealistic that any Federation ship would run out of power any time soon... and anti-matter... they can probably synthesize more with adequate energy (aka massive solar energy in space), or find alternative sources such as omicron particles that can boost their supplies of anti-matter.

Federation ships were seen as being able to extract energy from all kinds of phenomena or even stars before to make it into useful energy for their ship systems.

Other shows such as Battlestar Galactica have mostly primitive internal technology when compared to the Federation.

Some struggling is fine, but only in the sense if they are under constant attack with no sufficient time to allow the ship to repair itself - actually, this WAS showcased in episode 'Alliances' if I'm not mistaken where Voyager was under continuous attacks from the Kazon for a while.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Agree with the OP.

I also think there are many other things that were just glossed over. For instance, what about the mental health of the crew? 7 years stuck with your work colleagues with the prospect of never seeing your loved ones again or not even making it past your nest birthday. It would've been a great chance to have a counsellor on the ship who actually had something proper to do.

 

[Vandervecken]

we can explain away most of it but boy they sure could make those corridors look like new after being ripped apart. And a sparkling new identical sickbay too! wow...no scarcity for those metals thankfully

Other than Year of Hell, which didn't happen, when were they ripped apart? Can't remember, help.

I can think of two or three episodes where that was the case, but the following week it was a moot point, because plot!

But if they had successfully resupplied and rebuilt, why would it be an issue next ep?

Agree with the OP.

I also think there are many other things that were just glossed over. For instance, what about the mental health of the crew? 7 years stuck with your work colleagues with the prospect of never seeing your loved ones again or not even making it past your nest birthday. It would've been a great chance to have a counselor on the ship who actually had something proper to do.

Oh gods I just saw Neelix taking over that post in my head...ach

I would have loved seeing Voyager parked in a star system doing industrial replication or tying up multiple replicators towards the same use along with transporters for replicating anything apart from using the Warp core.
In addition, it would have been great to see the ship's crew doing a lot more scientific research in labs in conjunction with using the computer's massive computational capabilities to take their ideas and continuously advance their technology (automated R&D... this alone would have solved their slow warp issues within a year or two because even today, IBM's watson is doing research for Humans in mere days that would take us years or decades to do on our own - Starfleet's computer systems are incredibly far more advanced in comparison and are able to do incomprehensibly more stuff at the same time).

Would you have really? Sounds as boring a construction company B reel to me.

 

[Deks]

Would you have really? Sounds as boring a construction company B reel to me.

That would have been an excellent example of collaborative work between the crew and showing their prowess to adapt to the situation using their science and technology, which could be used later on in the show (as opposed to using 'tech of the week which is invented in the nick of time and then forgotten - not impossible of course to invent a new technology/hardware that's really useful on the run, but in that case, don't 'forget' it).

See, you might find that 'boring' because you were accustomed to the notion of having some kind of 'drama' popping up all the time, or having a 'villain of the week', or some kind of ridiculous hardware problem threatening the crew.

I would relish at the idea of seeing the intricate details of showcasing scientific research in Trek and space exploration, and also showing the crew is actually intelligent enough to come up with this stuff on their own.
They technically are, but the writers intentionally keep the characters dumbed down occasionally to increase the 'drama' for the simple reason they cannot write good stories that suit the time frame and technology they have.

Tear and wear is ridiculous for that kind of civilization because they learned to do more with less and make stuff that repairs itself effectively. There's a difference in showing this occasionally if they are under continuous attacks, but after a while, it gets boring and utterly unrealistic for the setting.
Space is pretty vast... even with Warp drive and sensors that can scan dozens to hundreds of Ly's.

 

[F. King Daniel]

There was talk of Voyager ending up with an alien warp nacelle, but it was deemed too expensive, meaning all stock flyby shots would have to be redone.

By the time it was cost effective to do with CG, Enterprise did it in their Xindi arc, which awesomely featured a flying wreck for the second half of the season.

 

[Vandervecken]

See, you might find that 'boring' because you were accustomed to the notion of having some kind of 'drama' popping up all the time

well, yeah--I mean the series did get an Emmy nomination for Best Dramatic Series in season 7. I like drama in my drama, I'm a bit crazy that way.

But look I do understand and in principle I am not against more showing of a detailed universe, even the less-than-exciting parts--it's just that, in practice, it doesn't usually turn out that well. See TMP. See the episodes toward the end of BSG rebooted where Tyrol was repairing the Galactica and Adama was just moping around looking at the Galactica; they were truly dull I thought, and honestly I had a hard time identifying a plot in those eps, let alone an A plot. But hey YMMV and maybe they were good for you.

I think what you would like done is easily done in a book, where there are no competing exciting visuals, and what is more, the reader isn't expecting them. And more, the reader can skip easily if he wants to. Still, even in a book, showing repair, quiet domestic scenes, day-to-day life, or travelogue generally needs to be kept to a minimum so as not to distract from the plot or too much interrupt the pacing of the plot.

 

[Tracy Trek]

Although, it was never shown, wasn't there a mention of Torres in an early episode, asking to convert some part of the ship into a processing facility for the materials or minerals they had to get from the planets they visited. I'm assuming maybe the minerals were dilithium. The point is that it was stuff they had to mine themselves and process it themselves because they didn't have access to a starbase.

 

[Sophie74656]

Although, it was never shown, wasn't there a mention of Torres in an early episode, asking to convert some part of the ship into a processing facility for the materials or minerals they had to get from the planets they visited. I'm assuming maybe the minerals were dilithium. The point is that it was stuff they had to mine themselves and process it themselves because they didn't have access to a starbase.

JANEWAY: Assuming we do find dilithium on this planetoid, we're going to need a refining facility on the ship to process it.
CHAKOTAY: Lieutenant Torres has already asked permission to start modifications to the auxiliary impulse reactor. It could be converted into a crude dilithium refinery.
JANEWAY: The impulse reactor? Sometimes I think B'Elanna goes out of her way to find solutions that ignore Starfleet procedures.
CHAKOTAY: Her arguments are quite convincing. She thinks it can be done safely