Do Captain's go to prison for breaking the PD? Picard never did. Captains probably get a reprimand and ALOT of finger wagging if even that.
What Right Did Janeway Have to Force the Ferenghi Home?
- Thread starter hux
- Start date
Doesn't the PD simply apply to interference with other cultures? Last thread about the PD, it was agreed that pre-warp civilisations were entirely unimportant to it.
Which is why the PD is so worthless. It's a telling off at best.
In fact, not even that. Aren't most captains actually allowed to bend it without any serious repercussions?
In "Justice" they turn up uninvited then when Wesley (I'm with Starfleet, we don't lie) is given a death sentence, they proceed to explain that they couldn't give a fuck. They're taking him back. The PD is clearly just a rule of thumb to be ignored when it proves inconvenient.
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The Prime Directive is the first General Order.
That's just something they can just do.
Starfleet Officers can kill millions of savages from orbit, but lo and behold if they try and teach these same savages they're murdering how to invent a shopping cart.
General Order 24 is the legal extermination of a planet and anyone standing on it.
That's just something they can just do.
Starfleet Officers can kill millions of savages from orbit, but lo and behold if they try and teach these same savages they're murdering how to invent a shopping cart.
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"Normal development" is too easily circumnavigated.
La Forge tried to argue that the Enterprise being present was clearly a naturally occuring development but Picard shut that argument down.
The PD also ignores individuals. A groups of mischievous non-Starfleet humans are presumably allowed to go fuck with a pre-warp planet. If they are then so are the Ferengi.
La Forge tried to argue that the Enterprise being present was clearly a naturally occuring development but Picard shut that argument down.
The PD also ignores individuals. A groups of mischievous non-Starfleet humans are presumably allowed to go fuck with a pre-warp planet. If they are then so are the Ferengi.
When Janeway let them go to return to thier gross habits, yes that is exactly what Kathryn admitted was the truth.
1. The Ferengi are allowed to manipulate anyone, no matter how simple or backward. Are there still places we can shoot fish in barrels?
2. Janeway has no legal remedy to impose her will on foreign nationals opposed to her point of view.
1. The Ferengi are allowed to manipulate anyone, no matter how simple or backward. Are there still places we can shoot fish in barrels?
2. Janeway has no legal remedy to impose her will on foreign nationals opposed to her point of view.
I think Janeway was pretty much a law onto herself during the entire run, she paid attention to the PD when it suited her and her morals.
I doubt anyone from Starfleet would have really objected if they used the Caretakers array to send themselves back in the pilot but on Janeways moral ground she doomed the crew to several years in the DQ.
I doubt anyone from Starfleet would have really objected if they used the Caretakers array to send themselves back in the pilot but on Janeways moral ground she doomed the crew to several years in the DQ.
Um.
The Prime Directive said that the Ocampa had to die, and that the Kazon got the Array.
That was the law according to Starfleet.
In the pilot, that was the law according to Janeway.
She agreed to let the Kazon have the Array.
Then a dying pedophile (Kim is a child) rapist talked her out of it.
Janeway SHATTERED the Prime Directive, because she was too much of a wuss to live with a little blood on her hands.
First episode, straight out of the gate.
Two liars lying to each other.
That's hot.
But if someone else is already fucking with a planet and its people, the PD goes out the window, right? That seems to be the consensus. Because the Kazon and the Caretaker are both interfering with Ocompa, that means Janeway gets to. Because the Ferengi are screwing with the Takarians, she also gets to. Because the Malon were screwing with the natural development of the void aliens, Janeway can to.
PD only applies if you're the first to interfere. If you're second, then you're good to go.
But what about when she gave technology to the Hirogen? Who was fucking with their culture making it OK for Janeway to do the same.
PD only applies if you're the first to interfere. If you're second, then you're good to go.
But what about when she gave technology to the Hirogen? Who was fucking with their culture making it OK for Janeway to do the same.
That convo between Ransom and Janeway is absolutely hilarious. Heck, Ransom comes out more favourably or at least far, far less self deluded then she does.
Do you know what a gang bang is?
Is the 5th rapist who raped, or the ninth rapist who raped, more or less guilty of rape than than the first rapist yelling at her friends to hold my mouth open wider.
Again it's more than one law that we are dealing with here that you mushing together into one super rule.
First Contact Protocols are that the Federation waits until a culture has warp drive before introducing themselves openly as the Federation. It shouldn't matter if every one on a planet knows that the Federation exists, that "aliens" exist, and that warp travel is possible, if they can't warp space for themselves to get out of their solar system and meet the rest of the Galaxy. Even as they invent warp drive (It took the Earthers a century to go from warp one engines to warp 2, meanwhile all along the Vulcans had warp 7 ships.), that's when the Prime Directive and the Non-Interference Policy (TNG Redemption) kicks in again that Mom and dad are not going to let a 17 year old with a brand new drivers licence access to their 1961 Ferrari 250 GT California Spyder convertible. Please remember that the Ferengi BOUGHT Warp drive. They invented nothing, and the Federation treats them the same as any other race that did invent drive for themselves.
It doesn't matter how badly you cock up, by accidentally letting the cat out of the bag about alien life, if they don't have warp themselves, the official mandate from Starfleet and the federation is a nonverbal utterance of "No Comment" or more lies to under line any legend you thought would allow your team to pass as natives.
Nope. See above.
That was a massive cock up by the writers who seem to think that the Prime Directive is about the greater good. it's not. It's about individual truth. Individual truth is usually at the detriment of every other buggers truth.
1. Current habits to the Hirogen life style was trending towards extinction.
2. Allow them to die happy, save billions of innocent passers by from being murdered and skinned over the next 400 years.
3. You can't tell me that they didn't have safari parks with live prey? Or did multi species taskforce, sick of this shit, smash all those safaris to rescue their enslaved people?
4. Oh dear, Holograms exterminate the Horogen species over the course of the next four months. Good one Kathy.
I thought the Malon response to being offered advanced Federation technology, that would save their world and hundreds of nearby systems from ecological collapse, from their littering fetish was priceless: "No thank you, I don't want to lose my job. Being slowly murdered by radiation is how I'm putting my children through college, and my destitution from being an expert in a field that no longer exists, would have a knock on effect of my children ending up as burger flippers at Flipper Burgers, which sounds awful, so bugger off, no thank you."
Which if you remember is what Big Oil says every time someone new invents the water powered car.
It's where someone burns disturbing images into my brain.
Yup, told you.
I saw above. I didn't care for it.
Actions speak louder than words... and prime directives.
Wesley should have died in Justice.
Actually, if Wesley was %85 space god at the time, could he die?
Boring Captains who do their jobs well, and follow the rules, without drama, scandal or gross incompetence, don't get a TV Show.
Actually, if Wesley was %85 space god at the time, could he die?
Boring Captains who do their jobs well, and follow the rules, without drama, scandal or gross incompetence, don't get a TV Show.
I'd put even money on Tracey serving his fair share.
For killing 10's of thousands of aliens, or showing aliens what a phaser looks like?
For all his effort, Tracy tried to alter the balance of power, by helping out the losing side of a war, but sadly despite his most criminal effort, still lost. The course of history for the planet, despite it's population having a slightly different composition remained psychohistorically unchanged.
Ethnic cleansing however is an easily understood tactile crime about blood and numbers, for which this #### is guilty of sin of.
Meanwhile if it's just a moral question about breaking the Prime Directive, then Kirk's speech about Yankies and Communists was probably more damaging since it changed the future of that planet, just like Tracey tried to do over the course of the previous weeks.
For all his effort, Tracy tried to alter the balance of power, by helping out the losing side of a war, but sadly despite his most criminal effort, still lost. The course of history for the planet, despite it's population having a slightly different composition remained psychohistorically unchanged.
Ethnic cleansing however is an easily understood tactile crime about blood and numbers, for which this #### is guilty of sin of.
Meanwhile if it's just a moral question about breaking the Prime Directive, then Kirk's speech about Yankies and Communists was probably more damaging since it changed the future of that planet, just like Tracey tried to do over the course of the previous weeks.
Yeah, it's all good though if your heart is in the right place.
Did phasers used to be more powerful in the TOS era?
Tracy killed thousands of enemy combatants in minutes, per thousand persons per minute, for weeks, until the numbers pressed against him finally overwhelmed the lone Star fleet Captain.
Is Tracy why 24th century phasers are so shite compared to 23rd century phasers?
Tracy killed thousands of enemy combatants in minutes, per thousand persons per minute, for weeks, until the numbers pressed against him finally overwhelmed the lone Star fleet Captain.
Is Tracy why 24th century phasers are so shite compared to 23rd century phasers?
As I've said before, he didn't care which side he was trying to exterminate as long as it wasn't the one that had that illusory secret he was so jonesing for, the one that he thought would make everything alright using smoke and mirrors and bestow the lauds of the Federation upon his brow. Hell, he would've burned them all down for that, if it had been necessary and he had been capable of it. In another thread, someone just gave a couple of instances of exposure to Starfleet, that in the difference in their seriousness, would reasonably allow contact with pre-warp to proceed (I don't think it was you, Guy). The violation here wasn't going to be unbroken, so I'm not sure how much Kirk's correcting some textual errors really trumps Tracey's efforts in justifying the moral superiority to his guys of destroying utter savages with no redeeming qualities whatsoever.
Its called plot tech/armour Phasers are only as powerful as it needs to be at the time. There is a quote in TNG stating that a hand phaser on full settings/wide beam could level a block yet against the Jem'Hadar during the seige of AR-558 that setting would have been very useful.
As far as I remember it didn't matter if every advanced planet in the Delta Quadrant had laws against dealing with the untrustorthy Ferenghi in any way. The planet they were on was a pre warp planet that didn't have any contact with space travelers. Thus the natives couldn't have been warned against the Ferenghi anyway. I have to wonder why the Ferenghi would want to stay on such a primitive, backwards, uncomfortable planet. I think they would have wanted to take their ill gotten gains and return to the Alpha Quadrant according to the rule that it is better to serve in heaven than reign in hell.
Everything you says makes that planet seem like a hellish place to live for anyone used to 20th century comforts, let alone 24th century comforts. I can't understand why the Ferenghi didn't want to pack up valuable native handicrafts to sell to collectors and return to the Alpha quadrant to spend their ill gotten gains for things that were worth buying.
