What is "The Fall"?

[Unionized Elf]

But to be cheeky, trek lit "exactly" being the same "exactly" as used in The Good that Men Do?

Personally, that's a line I don't think should have been crossed. It's a moot point, that novel is six years old and the storyline it began has been concluded. And yes, I get it, TATV was only a holodeck intrepretation of events, but as far as I'm concerned it's an episode and whatever is depicted within is of equal canonical value as The City on the Edge of Forever or The Best of Both Worlds or whatever is named the best of the various series. I don't deny TATV is a bad episode and terrible finale, but I was disappointed when even Pocket Books stooped to the level of common fanboys and decided to change the episode to suit their whims.

 

[Markonian]

Concerning Hobus:
In the STO continuity, which is only loosely tied to Trek Lit,
the supernova was caused by Praetor Taris,
and her Reman allies, under the guidance of the Iconians (STO: Taris).

In the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline, Romulus and Remus still exist in 2409 and were not destroyed (STO: Temporal Ambassador).

 

[Skywalker]

IIRC, the only real specific things that we know about the Hobus supernova are that it destroyed Romulus and that it threatened the galaxy. The latter can be interpreted in multiple ways. I look forward to seeing what our esteemed writers and editors come up with.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I just hope the thing that's going to "Fall" isn't the Federation. The writers wouldn't do that, would they?

 

[Deranged Nasat]

I just hope the thing that's going to "Fall" isn't the Federation. The writers wouldn't do that, would they?

The news on that front is that the title is apparently an in-joke of sorts in reference to the season, so there isn't necessarily anything falling. (Prior to learning that, my guess was Romulus; I was indeed hoping this was the 2387 story).

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ At the very least, aren't there multiple future time periods (in both onscreen canon and current Treklit) that clearly have the Federation's survival assured? The 29th century of Braxton, the 31st century of Daniels, the Jake & Nog framing story from TGTMD, etc.

 

[Unionized Elf]

I just hope the thing that's going to "Fall" isn't the Federation. The writers wouldn't do that, would they?

The news on that front is that the title is apparently an in-joke of sorts in reference to the season, so there isn't necessarily anything falling. (Prior to learning that, my guess was Romulus; I was indeed hoping this was the 2387 story).

Heh, got to admit, that is kind of clever.

 

[JD]

IIRC, the only real specific things that we know about the Hobus supernova are that it destroyed Romulus and that it threatened the galaxy. The latter can be interpreted in multiple ways. I look forward to seeing what our esteemed writers and editors come up with.

Yeah, I think what we saw in the movie was vague enough that the authors could easily make it more complex than a simple natural supernova.
As to what The Fall refers to, given some of the teases we've been getting lately I wouldn't be surprised if it was more metaphorical, with no actual "falling" taking place during the series.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I just hope the thing that's going to "Fall" isn't the Federation. The writers wouldn't do that, would they?

My guess is that it's the Typhon Pact.

Although with the Super Bowl ad for the next film promising...

Spoiler: Into Darkness

OUR
*boop boop*
WORLD
*boop boop*
WILL
*boop boop*
FALL

I can see the novels going "Bitch, please!" and killing the entire UFP. Especially with David Mack involved.

Still doubt it. But not as ridiculously impossible an idea as it would have been a decade ago.

 

[Markonian]

^ At the very least, aren't there multiple future time periods (in both onscreen canon and current Treklit) that clearly have the Federation's survival assured? The 29th century of Braxton, the 31st century of Daniels, the Jake & Nog framing story from TGTMD, etc.

Not necessarily. The Federation could fall and be rebuild. What do we know about history from the 26th to the 28th century? Compare the fall and reconstruction of the USA in Postman, Shattered Union and Jericho.

 

[Sci]

Let the speculation begin!

http://www.thetrekcollective.com/2013/02/new-details-on-fall.html

I'm going to spoiler-tag this just in case.

Spoiler: Trek Collective

Picard and his crew are dispatched to uncover the truth behind a “prominent figure within the Federation” who’s emerged onto the interstellar stage. It’s discovered that said individual may well be perpetrating a hoax as to their true identity, and has been doing so for years. This kind of sucks, since this person is now in a position to wield enormous power within the Federation.

So...

Spoiler: Speculation

Any thoughts on who this imposter could be? Any chance this is following up on what PAD set up for Admiral Nechayev in the recent New Frontier books?

Intriguing.

Spoiler: The Above

The first thing it made me think of are those "Birther" conspiracy theories positing that U.S. President Obama was actually born in Kenya and is falsifying evidence of his United States citizenship. We know from Cold Equations II that the next Federation Presidential election is coming up...

Mind you, I'm not endorsing that conspiracy theory or saying the authors at Pocket are. It just makes me think of that phenomenon.

^ At the very least, aren't there multiple future time periods (in both onscreen canon and current Treklit) that clearly have the Federation's survival assured? The 29th century of Braxton, the 31st century of Daniels, the Jake & Nog framing story from TGTMD, etc.

Not necessarily. The Federation could fall and be rebuild. What do we know about history from the 26th to the 28th century? Compare the fall and reconstruction of the USA in Postman, Shattered Union and Jericho.

Pedantry alert:

The United States did not fall in Jericho. Rather, it splintered in two, with Western states coming under the hegemony of the self-declared, corporate-dominated "Allied States of America" after the United States's major cities were destroyed. But the U.S. continued to exist, and the federal government moved its capital to Columbus, Ohio.

Though that of course suggests other dark potentialities. Perhaps the Federation doesn't literally fall, but is split in twain?

Or maybe we're all speculating in wild directions that have no basis in reality purely because of a vague title.

 

[David Mack]

A hint for all of you: "Pride goeth before...."

 

[ATimson]

A hint for all of you: "Pride goeth before...."

Ooh. It's another X-men crossover? Cool.

 

[Kertrats47]

A hint for all of you: "Pride goeth before...."

Ooh, cryptic! Hmmm...

"Pride goeth before a $10.99 all-you-can-eat rib night at Tony Roma's"?

No, that doesn't sound right. Well, I'm stumped.

 

[Markonian]

Pedantry alert:

The United States did not fall in Jericho. Rather, it splintered in two, with Western states coming under the hegemony of the self-declared, corporate-dominated "Allied States of America" after the United States's major cities were destroyed. But the U.S. continued to exist, and the federal government moved its capital to Columbus, Ohio.

Oh, but of course it did. The line of succession was effectively broken and surviving authorities banded together to reform the US government. The same as in Shattered Union.

"Pride cometh before the Fall", I presume. That points towards a Typhon Pact member, I'd guess. The Federation is humble and decent.

 

[Ronald Held]

To some the Federation does not show pride or arrogance?

 

[Kirks_Flying_Wig]

I just hope the thing that's going to "Fall" isn't the Federation. The writers wouldn't do that, would they?

My guess is that it's the Typhon Pact.

Although with the Super Bowl ad for the next film promising...

Spoiler: Into Darkness

OUR
*boop boop*
WORLD
*boop boop*
WILL
*boop boop*
FALL

I can see the novels going "Bitch, please!" and killing the entire UFP. Especially with David Mack involved.

Still doubt it. But not as ridiculously impossible an idea as it would have been a decade ago.

I think that idea is heading down the same path that this board went down five years ago when speculation was rife that Earth would be destroyed in Destiny!

From David Mack's hint above, I'm going with the idea that

Spoiler

this is the beginning of the end for the Romulan Empire, as pride is a theme closely associated with the Romulans, not least in their Seven Deadly Sins anthology.

Unless I'm reading too much into it.

 

[Mage]

Let the speculation begin!

http://www.thetrekcollective.com/2013/02/new-details-on-fall.html

I'm going to spoiler-tag this just in case.

Spoiler: Trek Collective

Picard and his crew are dispatched to uncover the truth behind a “prominent figure within the Federation” who’s emerged onto the interstellar stage. It’s discovered that said individual may well be perpetrating a hoax as to their true identity, and has been doing so for years. This kind of sucks, since this person is now in a position to wield enormous power within the Federation.

So...

Spoiler: Speculation

Any thoughts on who this imposter could be? Any chance this is following up on what PAD set up for Admiral Nechayev in the recent New Frontier books?

I'm just really hoping it's NOT

Spoiler: SPOILER for the above....

Bacco. It would be to obvious ofcourse, but we've had so many novels with her internal monologue telling us so much about how much of a great person she is, it would be hard to swallow if she's suddenly a fraud...

 

[Deranged Nasat]

From David Mack's hint above, I'm going with the idea that

Spoiler

this is the beginning of the end for the Romulan Empire, as pride is a theme closely associated with the Romulans, not least in their Seven Deadly Sins anthology.

Unless I'm reading too much into it.

That's a nice point, Wig. Perhaps this is a Romulan-centric plot after all, even if it isn't about Hobus.

Let the speculation begin!

http://www.thetrekcollective.com/2013/02/new-details-on-fall.html

I'm going to spoiler-tag this just in case.

Spoiler: Trek Collective

Picard and his crew are dispatched to uncover the truth behind a “prominent figure within the Federation” who’s emerged onto the interstellar stage. It’s discovered that said individual may well be perpetrating a hoax as to their true identity, and has been doing so for years. This kind of sucks, since this person is now in a position to wield enormous power within the Federation.

So...

Spoiler: Speculation

Any thoughts on who this imposter could be? Any chance this is following up on what PAD set up for Admiral Nechayev in the recent New Frontier books?

I'm just really hoping it's NOT

Spoiler: SPOILER for the above....

Bacco. It would be to obvious ofcourse, but we've had so many novels with her internal monologue telling us so much about how much of a great person she is, it would be hard to swallow if she's suddenly a fraud...

Not that I'm saying I think it is (for one thing, as you say, far too obvious), but I do think are ways in which the writers could pull off

Spoiler: The Fall, as above

a surprise "she's not quite who she says she is!" without it destroying the Bacco character.

. It would certainly be very difficult, and I don't think it would be a good idea at all, but then these authors have surprised me before by taking ideas I was sure wouldn't work and, well, making them work, so who knows?

I'm sure it won't be, though.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Could it be...

Spoiler: who

Big Bland himself, Admiral Akaar?