• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

What if... Kirk defeated Kruge's ship?

InklingStar

Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
Last night while I was not falling asleep I wondered how the Star Trek story might have turned out had Captain Kirk managed to destroy Kruge's Bird-of-Prey over the Genesis Planet. As you know, the Enterprise fired a single torpedo when the Bird-of-Prey decloaked, but lost the ability to fight once Kruge returned fire. What if Kirk had been more aggressive, and destroyed the Bird-of-Prey before Kruge had a chance to fire?

Presumably he would have simply beamed Spock, Saavik, and David aboard (assuming the Klingons did not kill them all once they lost contact with Kruge.) They then could have gone to Vulcan long before the planet broke apart. Perhaps the Vulcans would have assisted with repairs just as they did the Bird-of-Prey. Kirk would still have had the opportunity, presumably, to remain in command of the ship on his way back to Earth for court-martial.

But that's where it gets interesting. In TVH, the ability of the Bird-of-Prey to cloak was integral to the plot. They avoided detection by telescopes and satellites of 1986 using the cloaking device. If they were in the Enterprise instead, how would they have managed that? Hiding behind the moon, perhaps? Would this leave them close enough to transport? Would Scotty have had to build whale tanks, or would existing rooms on the ship do? The scene where they stop the whaling ship from harpooning George and Gracie would surely have turned out differently.

The climax of the movie also depended on the unique abilities of the Klingon vessel, when it lost power due to the Probe and splashed down in San Fransisco Bay. (Lucky piloting?) With the Enterprise in orbit and without power, could they have gotten the whales into the ocean safely? I don't think the whales could hear the Probe while in orbit, especially without enough power to open a channel.

After all that, presumably things would have been the same afterward. Kirk is given his ship back, and the Enterprise would still need lots of repair work done, meaning TFF might proceed in a similar fashion. But with David still alive, would TUC be any different?

Food for thought. I'll try to sleep better tonight...

PS: TVH was the first Star Trek movie I saw. It was in theaters when I was only three and we bought it on VHS the next year. Until I was older and saw TWoK and TSFS later, I struggled to understand why Kirk and Spock were flying around in a winged green ship rather than the familiar Enterprise from the show, and why they were all wearing different outfits. Good times.
 
What if Kirk had been more aggressive, and destroyed the Bird-of-Prey before Kruge had a chance to fire?

FWIW, I don’t think it had anything to do with Kirk’s aggressiveness. Scotty said he didn’t expect to take the ship into combat, the ship had far less than a skeleton crew, and the ad hoc automation system probably didn’t have a “fire everything we’ve got real quick” button.
 
They avoided detection by telescopes and satellites of 1986 using the cloaking device.

Then again, they avoided detection by telescopes and satellites of 1969 without using the cloaking device, in "Assignment: Earth". And before that in 1968, in "Tomorrow is Yesterday". I don't think Earth's orbital detection capabilities increased much between 1969 and 1986 in the real world. The Trek world is a different matter, of course...

Getting the whales back to Earth might have been a tad difficult in this alternate reality, yes. Perhaps Kirk could have done the spectacular immolation of his beloved starship there, instead of over Genesis? We know the ship does fine in an atmosphere even when everybody is unconscious and most systems are down, as per "Tomorrow is Yesterday". Negotiating her down to the Pacific semi-intact might have been possible despite the jamming from the Probe.

Timo Saloniemi
 
They then could have gone to Vulcan long before the planet broke apart.

Spock would have been much younger if they'd done this - he didn't reach his "actual" age until just before Genesis destroyed itself.

It could be argued that he in fact went past his "actual" age, clearing up some continunity problems with Vulcan's being 60 and looking in their mid 20's (T'Pol, etc)

Otherwise we'll just have to accept that since Spock is half human he ages normally until his 60's and then stays roughly the same physically for the next 100 years
 
Well it would have undermined the scene between Sarek and Kirk when the BoP arrived on Vulcan.

Old scene:
Sarek: Kirk, I thank you. What you have done-
Kirk: What I have done I had to do.
Sarek: But at what cost? Your ship, your son.
Kirk: If I hadn't tried, the cost would have been my soul.

New scene
Sarek: Hey, thanks for coming.
Kirk: No problem.
 
At least we'd have been spared the stupid 'breaking in the new ship' slapstick business from The Final Frontier.

....maybe.
 
Well it would have undermined the scene between Sarek and Kirk when the BoP arrived on Vulcan.

Old scene:
Sarek: Kirk, I thank you. What you have done-
Kirk: What I have done I had to do.
Sarek: But at what cost? Your ship, your son.
Kirk: If I hadn't tried, the cost would have been my soul.

New scene
Sarek: Hey, thanks for coming.
Kirk: No problem.

:guffaw:
 
PS: TVH was the first Star Trek movie I saw. It was in theaters when I was only three and we bought it on VHS the next year. Until I was older and saw TWoK and TSFS later, I struggled to understand why Kirk and Spock were flying around in a winged green ship rather than the familiar Enterprise from the show, and why they were all wearing different outfits. Good times.

Didn't they explain that via the recaps and first scenes on Vulcan?
 
The recap was only in the European version I think (aka THE VOYAGE HOME: Star Trek IV)

Nope, the theatrical version opens up with a Klingon telling us what happened in the previous movie. He's the movie version of the "Last time on Star Trek" guy. ;)

IV would've been very interesting if it was with the Enterprise instead of the BOP. Many of the "problems" that crop-up in the fourth movie wouldn't have been there. Heck, depending on how capable the Enterprise was they probably wouldn't of needed to land or anything they could've just found the whales and beamed them up from orbit given the Enterprise's more acute sensors and the more robust "Federation crystals" would've meant the ship could've turned around right away to go home. (Which means no need to get the radiation from the Aircraft Carrier Enterprise.)

The entire IV movie after the Enterprise (the BOP in the real movie) arrives in 1987.

Spock: "Captain, by my calculations we've arrived at some time in the late 20th century."
Uhura: "Captain, I am receiving whale song! It is coming from San Francisco!"
Kirk: "The city?! Spock?"
Spock: "Captain, it seems to be coming from the Cetacean Institute in Sausalito, two adult humpback whales one male and a pregnant female."
Kirk: "Bridge to Scotty!"
Scotty: "Aye, sir?"
Kirk: "Scotty is the cargobay ready yet?"
Scotty: "Yes sir, the conversion process was easier than I expected. Good thing we weren't in a Kilngon Bird of Prey, the conversion may have bee a wee bit trickier!"
Kirk: "Good, lock onto the two whales discovered by Spock and beam them and the water into the tank. Mr. Sulu you and Spock make your necessary calculations for a return trip back to our own time. Get us there a little earlier, before the probe's arrival at Earth; I want to make sure we've the time and power to plant the whales before the probe arrives and makes the power and atmospheric disruptions to the planet. Let me know when you're done, until then I'll be in my quarters."
 
One thing I would be concerned about, is how well the heavily damaged Enterprise would hold together during time-warp. It has been awhile since I've seen Trek IV, but I seem to remember it being a rough ride.
 
^ It was a rough ride, yes, but we don't really have any way of knowing if that was because Birds of Prey aren't up to the challenge of the slingshot like a Constitution class starship is. Now, in "Tomorrow Is Yesterday," the crew get bounced around a bit during the slingshot maneuver, but it certainly doesn't seem as though the ship is coming apart at the seams like it did with the Bird of Prey.
 
The Enterprise was damaged but if it could survive warp-travel it should've been able to hold up the time-travel at least as well as the BoP did which weren't known for their robustness. (Generations aside.)
 
^ Generations showed no robustness in the BoP. Any ship could survive a battle with the Enterprise if the commanding officer chose to only fire a single phaser shot through the entire battle. :)
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top