What if: Berman Led Star Trek Remake?

[Finnegan]

I don't totally hate Berman. TNG and DS9 were certainly pretty well-crafted shows, the others to a lesser and lesser extent. Frankly, I thought both Insurrection and Nemesis kinda sucked and really "jumped the shark" as far as the films starring the Next Gen cast. No wonder the studio execs put a stop to them. Berman and his "team" kind of lost their way with Trek, with every new offering being just an ever more inferior rehash of what had gone before. Really, how many Voyager or Enterprise episodes
were just a rip-off of a similar TOS, TNG or DS9 episode? Way too many.

I was so completely disappointed when I ponied up my hard-earned cash to see Nemesis--only to see yet another lukewarm, hokey "Lore" story--oh, sorry, I mean "B4". Sad, mindlessley repetitive, non-original and infuriating! The stupid dunebuggy scene with Picard, Worf and Data was just as bad and embarrassing as Spock wearing "Gravity boots" in ST5, and that's saying something!

Heres what STXI would be with Berman at the helm: Lore, er, sorry, I mean "B4" would have way too many cute scenes and would struggle to find his humanity. Yawn. The newly unveiled Enterprise F would probably have flames painted on it's side (pimp my starship, anyone?), and would be an even faker looking all-CGI monstrosity. Yawn. Riker and Troi as a happy, married couple. Yawn. Wesley Crusher would be back, and would save everybody in a time of crisis--or would be an evil genius/bad guy in a "surprise" twist "for the fans". Yawn. Geordi would have even more normal looking eyes, robbing the character of what made him different and of any interest to anyone. Yawn. Picard and Beverly would finally declare their love and marry in yet another Trek wedding--hey it worked so good with Riker and Troi, right? Right? Jadzia and Worf?
O'Brian and cakehole? Kirk and Mirimani? T'pol? The dead guy, "Styles", and his bride in TOS ep "Balance of Terror"? Didn't Lwaxana get married, too? Yawn. Then, he could really shake up the Trek universe and bring back Alexander, Worf's stupid kid--need lots of scenes with him for that trademark gripping Berman "drama"! Where has he been? How's he doing in school?--we NEED to know, dammit! Then, we would meet a really lame, weak, uninteresting "Villain" with a few faint latex wrinkles on his nose--to show us he is some kind of alien, get it?--to really push the story over the edge and take us to Berman's version of going to 11, a la "Spinal Tap". Double yawn.

No thanks--I'll take J.J. and the new life he and his team will hopefully breathe into the franchise.

I take it back--I do hate you Rick Berman.

 

[jgdst]

Bless Berman's heart; the franchise owes him a lot. But the franchise definitely started to feel tired and in need of new blood. BLOOD!!

Well, Nemesis and TATV aside, I enjoyed the vast majority of Berman's Trek. I think, after 25 seasons and 4 movies under his stewardship everyone involved got burned out by the end.

In reflection, its probably a good thing it ended when it did, but I still would have looked forward to a new Trek series with him at the helm.

I agree with both of you. I actually think Berman did a lot of good, but after so long, it's easy to fall into some clichéd plotlines, or start giving some characters short-shrift, or even just go mad with power...

If he had had some kind of input in this film, I don't think it'd be a totally bad thing. If I'm remembering my pre-Enterprise interviews correctly, wasn't it Braga, not Berman, who claimed he'd never watched or paid attention to TOS - with pride, it seems?

Also... if the OP is anything to go by (did I see praise for Nemesis, by the way? ), if the new blood has the AIDS, we could all be infected by the end of May if this film turns out to be a dud.


Just as a side note, if Berman and co. were responsible for "sane and sensible" starship registrations and prevented other similar travesties, riddle me this: How did Excelsior end up with blue nacelles in Flashback?!

QED, surely?

 

[The Wormhole]

Just as a side note, if Berman and co. were responsible for "sane and sensible" starship registrations and prevented other similar travesties, riddle me this: How did Excelsior end up with blue nacelles Flashback?!

QED, surely?

The events of Flashback were from the perspective of Tuvok's fragmentary memory. Besides, that episode has more problems then blue nacelles on the Excelsior (Lt. Valtane's death, anyone?) And besides, mistakes do happen. No one is perfect.

Now purposely giving a ship only one nacelle or a registry starting with zero is just sloppy and worse than Berman's worst "crime" (TATV).

 

[jgdst]

Just as a side note, if Berman and co. were responsible for "sane and sensible" starship registrations and prevented other similar travesties, riddle me this: How did Excelsior end up with blue nacelles Flashback?!

QED, surely?

The events of Flashback were from the perspective of Tuvok's fragmentary memory. Besides, that episode has more problems then blue nacelles on the Excelsior (Lt. Valtane's death, anyone?) And besides, mistakes do happen. No one is perfect.

Now purposely giving a ship only one nacelle or a registry starting with zero is just sloppy and worse than Berman's worst "crime" (TATV).

DAMN! I can't believe Latin failed me, though why would Tuvok's "memory" include exterior shots of a ship that included lighty-up engines? I will concede, however, that there's simply no defense to a 0TATV to the face. Well played, sir

 

[ALF]

Diss Berman all you want. At least he knew that a four digit registry shouldn't begin with zero. And aside from the Enterprise D in AGT, all Starfleet ships designed in Berman era had an even number of nacelles.

If you enjoy re-reading this post as much as I do, try it with the Simpsons' "Comic Book Guy" voice. It does wonders for me.

As for Berman... well, he has nothing to do with Trek anymore.
How richer we all are now in spirit. I liked his work, but let's move on.
"Yes we can."

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

With a Berman reboot, you can all be sure that we'll "all be very pleased."

 

[Ovation]

Now purposely giving a ship only one nacelle or a registry starting with zero is just sloppy and worse than Berman's worst "crime" (TATV).

No, it isn't. Really. There is NOTHING inherently "wrong" with either the nacelle count or the registry number--no rules that say they are not allowed, no precedent that excludes their possibility. You don't like it--that point is way beyond nauseatingly clear--but you have yet to successfully explain how these two points constitute anything nearly as catastrophic as your posts suggest. Your personal distress about them is NOT sufficient.

 

[Sci]

Diss Berman all you want. At least he knew that a four digit registry shouldn't begin with zero. And aside from the Enterprise D in AGT, all Starfleet ships designed in Berman era had an even number of nacelles.

.... is that really how you judge the quality of a Trek production? By technical minutiae? By whether or not a ship registry uses "0" at the beginning or whether or not a ship has an even number of nacelles?

Seriously?

 

[Samuel T. Cogley]

Diss Berman all you want. At least he knew that a four digit registry shouldn't begin with zero. And aside from the Enterprise D in AGT, all Starfleet ships designed in Berman era had an even number of nacelles.

If you enjoy re-reading this post as much as I do, try it with the Simpsons' "Comic Book Guy" voice. It does wonders for me.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Diss Berman all you want. At least he knew that a four digit registry shouldn't begin with zero. And aside from the Enterprise D in AGT, all Starfleet ships designed in Berman era had an even number of nacelles.

.... is that really how you judge the quality of a Trek production? By technical minutiae? By whether or not a ship registry uses "0" at the beginning or whether or not a ship has an even number of nacelles?

Seriously?

Unfortunately, he isn't the only one as has been demonstrated on this board since the first photos were released.

Technical minutiae trumps story trumps character and equals that dirty word-- canon! This is all that matters to some. It is unfortunate but painfully true.

 

[Sector 7]

Diss Berman all you want. At least he knew that a four digit registry shouldn't begin with zero. And aside from the Enterprise D in AGT, all Starfleet ships designed in Berman era had an even number of nacelles.

If you enjoy re-reading this post as much as I do, try it with the Simpsons' "Comic Book Guy" voice. It does wonders for me.

As for Berman... well, he has nothing to do with Trek anymore.
How richer we all are now in spirit. I liked his work, but let's move on.
"Yes we can."

I do this. Also try reading the responses with Bart's voice!

 

[Jon1701]

The "0" will be a significant plot point.

I have it on good authority from an inside source with inside information inside his head that Nero is attempting to go back in time and change history by painting the number "0" on the hulls of Starfleet vessels.

How devilish

 

[Therin of Andor]

The dead guy, "Styles", and his bride in TOS ep "Balance of Terror"?

Tomlinson was the groom, not Stiles.

 

[Finnegan]

The dead guy, "Styles", and his bride in TOS ep "Balance of Terror"?

Tomlinson was the groom, not Stiles.

You are correct, Sir...

 

[The Wormhole]

No, it isn't. Really. There is NOTHING inherently "wrong" with either the nacelle count or the registry number--no rules that say they are not allowed, no precedent that excludes their possibility.

Roddenberry's Rules of Starship Design say warp nacelles need an even number of nacelles, which the Kelvin is in blatant defiance of.

And registries have never started with zero, and there have been three-digit registries before. Like the Grissom.

 

[Jon1701]

No, it isn't. Really. There is NOTHING inherently "wrong" with either the nacelle count or the registry number--no rules that say they are not allowed, no precedent that excludes their possibility.

Roddenberry's Rules of Starship Design say warp nacelles need an even number of nacelles, which the Kelvin is in blatant defiance of.

And registries have never started with zero, and there have been three-digit registries before. Like the Grissom.

Meh.

So what?

This is oft quoted, but I've never seen it written down. Did he really say it?
If we are going to go down the "canon" route, I've never heard a line of dialogue in any episode of star trek that said that you have to have an even number of nacelles or that a registry number couldn't start with zero.

Its a number. On a ship. A number.

It's almost certainly a joke, or a homage to someone. 05/14 is probably his grandfathers birthday, his dogs birthday or his lottery numbers.

 

[The Wormhole]

No, it isn't. Really. There is NOTHING inherently "wrong" with either the nacelle count or the registry number--no rules that say they are not allowed, no precedent that excludes their possibility.

Roddenberry's Rules of Starship Design say warp nacelles need an even number of nacelles, which the Kelvin is in blatant defiance of.

And registries have never started with zero, and there have been three-digit registries before. Like the Grissom.

Meh.

So what?

This is oft quoted, but I've never seen it written down. Did he really say it?
If we are going to go down the "canon" route, I've never heard a line of dialogue in any episode of star trek that said that you have to have an even number of nacelles or that a registry number couldn't start with zero.

Its a number. On a ship. A number.

It's almost certainly a joke, or a homage to someone. 05/14 is probably his grandfathers birthday, his dogs birthday or his lottery numbers.

The fact that there has never been a registry in 42 years of Trek starting with zero should be enough reason to not do one. That is there's never been a registry higher than two digits starting with zero, so don't try using NX-01 as an argument this time.

As for nacelles, it may not have never been directly said on screen, but you can tell it's always been on writer's minds. Take the Voyager episode Inside Man. At the end, Deanna Troi asks Lt. Barclay to join her and Riker on their date, which he declines saying "I wouldn't want to be a third nacelle." See, that referance proves that Voyager's writing staff was aware that nacelles should not be in odd numbers.

 

[Jon1701]

The fact that there has never been a registry in 42 years of Trek starting with zero should be enough reason to not do one. That is there's never been a registry higher than two digits starting with zero, so don't try using NX-01 as an argument this time.

Ok, so it irks me a bit (a tiny, tiny bit) too, but seriously dude. Who gives a shit?

Come up with an in-universe explanation if you want. The Enterprise had letters after her registry, no other Starship has got letters. Starfleet did it as a nice thing after the whale probe thingy. Soooo I dunno, maybe the Captain of the Kelvin got special dispensation to put an 0 at the start of his registry for valour at the battle against [INSERT STAR TREK RACE HERE] or something or other. Maybe 514 is an unlucky number in the 23rd century. Maybe O is for Oklahoma. Anything.

Its a homage to something. Probably. Let it be.

As for nacelles, it may not have never been directly said on screen, but you can tell it's always been on writer's minds. Take the Voyager episode Inside Man. At the end, Deanna Troi asks Lt. Barclay to join her and Riker on their date, which he declines saying "I wouldn't want to be a third nacelle." See, that referance proves that Voyager's writing staff was aware that nacelles should not be in odd numbers.

In that one episode perhaps.

I'll admit, we haven't seen 3 nacelled starships much (I'm pretty sure we saw some kitbashes in Ds9 though), but there's nothing canonnically to state that a starship cant have just one nacelle. Time and time again ships have functioned on one nacelle, so you can't tell me within the Star Trek universe it isn't possible.

Seriously.

It doesn't matter.

 

[Qonos]

The fact that there has never been a registry in 42 years of Trek starting with zero should be enough reason to not do one. That is there's never been a registry higher than two digits starting with zero, so don't try using NX-01 as an argument this time.

Ok, so it irks me a bit (a tiny, tiny bit) too, but seriously dude. Who gives a shit?

Come up with an in-universe explanation if you want. The Enterprise had letters after her registry, no other Starship has got letters. Starfleet did it as a nice thing after the whale probe thingy. Soooo I dunno, maybe the Captain of the Kelvin got special dispensation to put an 0 at the start of his registry for valour at the battle against [INSERT STAR TREK RACE HERE] or something or other. Maybe 514 is an unlucky number in the 23rd century. Maybe O is for Oklahoma. Anything.

Its a homage to something. Probably. Let it be.

As for nacelles, it may not have never been directly said on screen, but you can tell it's always been on writer's minds. Take the Voyager episode Inside Man. At the end, Deanna Troi asks Lt. Barclay to join her and Riker on their date, which he declines saying "I wouldn't want to be a third nacelle." See, that referance proves that Voyager's writing staff was aware that nacelles should not be in odd numbers.

In that one episode perhaps.

I'll admit, we haven't seen 3 nacelled starships much (I'm pretty sure we saw some kitbashes in Ds9 though), but there's nothing canonnically to state that a starship cant have just one nacelle. Time and time again ships have functioned on one nacelle, so you can't tell me within the Star Trek universe it isn't possible.

Seriously.

It doesn't matter.

Riker had the Enterprise refit as a dreadnaught in All good things and it had three nacelles. Even though it's a future that never came to be it suggest that there are starships with odd numbered nacelles. At Wolf 359 there was a single nacelled ship in the wreackage.. The Tech manuals and the writer's psuedo explainations don't remove what is on the screen.

The zero in the registry number really doesn't tweak me.l.. Because I've seen liscense plactes

 

[Chindogu]

I thought we already knew what the next film from Berman was going to be:

Star Trek: The Beginning

Personally, I am glad that didn't come to pass. And although this new film isn't exactly the film I would have made if given the chance, I am happy it's someone like Abrams and Co. who are working on it.