I used to be a BIG DC fan, however within the past 5 years the comics have become...LAME. Superman and Batman are both nearly impossible to get through. Additionally the Countdown series as well as Final Crisis have been complete crap thus far. Oh well, maybe in a few more years..........
What happened to DC Comics?
- Thread starter Lordjim
- Start date
I haven't read any monthly issues in several months, primarily due to needing to count out the number of titles I was buying per month, but I recall Detective Comics, Green Lantern, and Green Lantern Corps being among my DC favorites at that time.
There was a changing of the guard at DC about five years ago. Jeanette Kahn, publisher since 1973, retired, and Mike Carlin, executive editor and former Batman editor, was demoted (or requested fewer responsibilities). The very gentle Paul Levitz took over as publisher, and Dan Dido became the new executive editor (later vice president - editorial) and the driving force behind the company. Reportedly, DC is being run from the top down from Didio's office, with the exception of the few books under Geoff Johns's control.
Well, it'd be hard to disagree with you about Countdown, but Final Crisis has had exactly one issue out "thus far", and I'd say it was a bit early to proclaim it crap on that basis.
As for Dan DiDio, hating his guts seems to be all the rage for fanboys these days. I don't think he's any worse than Joe Quesada, and he's done a lot of good for DC. Recent comments from Chuck Dixon and, more obliquely, Mark Waid have suggested that a good number of current and ex-DC creators aren't too fond of the man, however...
I love DC. I didn't like Countdown but the stuff coming up looks good and I thoroughly enjoyed the first issure of Final Crisis.
Thespeckledkiwi
Vice Admiral
Marvel hasn't done as well either. Civil War, House of M, Spider-Man's series, Astonishing X-Men...A lot of them were...well bad. Astonishing was great but so frustrating in the fact that it took forever for them to get out the comics. As well as Ultimates 2, which was great. But...Civil War, House of M were extremely disappointing and to me even World War Hulk was bad. Secret Invasion might be better but...
Opinions may vary on the quality of Marvel's output, but they have generated very good sales. DC's sales, on the other hand, have been declining. Dan DiDio's contract evidently expires in October and there's increasing buzz in comic book industry circles that his contract won't be renewed. The rumor is that Jimmy Palmiotti might take over.
Just heard about this Chuck Dixon thing on an IGN podcast. What the heck is going on over at DC anyway?
Maybe on other titles.
However, the flagship title Amazing Spider-man has lost 42% of its readership since the thrice monthly Brand New Day story began 5 months and 15 issues ago.
ASM#546 = 127,958 1/08
ASM#560 = 74,012 5/08
Hey guess what Joey Q, the fans liked the marriage and your vision of this single Spidey in this situation as best has been rejected.
FAIL.
^^^
Actually, you're right - Marvel's sales have dropped overall lately, too. It's just their market share that's gone up as their sales haven't dropped as much as DC's.
To be fair, DiDio had a lot of sales success in the first part of his tenure. It's just since Countdown that things have gone a bit pear-shaped.
Actually, you're right - Marvel's sales have dropped overall lately, too. It's just their market share that's gone up as their sales haven't dropped as much as DC's.
To be fair, DiDio had a lot of sales success in the first part of his tenure. It's just since Countdown that things have gone a bit pear-shaped.
I don't pay attention to the business side. While I knew they were low, I had no idea comic sales in general were this pitiful. Comes as a bit of a shock. How does this compare to sales of other titles? Just as poor?
Not really. You aren't thinking fourth dimensionally, Marty.
http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/09/25/marvel-month-to-month-sales-august-2007/
In the grand sum of things, Spider-man is currently selling better than it did before Brand New Day.
at the BTTF reference. So BND has increased overall sales by 18%. Not bad.
Looking at the direct market sales numbers for May, the top 7 titles sold over 100,000 issues each, the top 20 sold over 75,000 each, the top 50 sold over 45,000 each, and the top 100 sold over 23,000 each.
The comics industry has gone from one which sold a relatively small number of titles to a wide audience to a niche industry selling a large number of titles to a relatively small readership of collectors. After being in the doldrums after the implosion in the early to mid-1990's, this decade has seen overall comic sales go up substantially, with most titles selling a lot better than they were in the late 1990s.
In 2007 the industry sold 85.27 million comics through the direct market for a total value of $270 million. The total value of all comics, graphic novels and trade paperbacks sold in 2007 through the direct market and book stores combined was an estimated $660-700 million. Trade paperback sales have been climbing rapidly as a lot of people are switching from buying monthly comics to exclusively buying TPBs. This year, however, is shaping up to be the first down year in a while.
Since the 2000s, when I started following the industry, yeah, it's become an extremely niche medium and the audience is getting older. There's absolutely no correlation between comic book movies and comic books themselves. While I appreciate initiatives like Free Comic Book Day, it's just not that effective at drawing in new reader... and they basically lost their chance to expand their market once localizers started bringing out Manga on a large scale.
Unfortunately, the only sales figures I've seen only show floppy sales... but I have to imagine that the sale of Manga is simply bigger than floppy sales, to the point where the majority of the comic book stores I go to emphasize their Manga section rather than their floppy section.
Unfortunately, the only sales figures I've seen only show floppy sales... but I have to imagine that the sale of Manga is simply bigger than floppy sales, to the point where the majority of the comic book stores I go to emphasize their Manga section rather than their floppy section.
Sales of the Top 300 titles through the direct market went from 76.13 million comics in 2005 to 81.85 million in 2006 to 85.27 million in 2007. So there has been success in boosting overall sales in recent years. But, yes, comics are still very much a niche market in the US. Publishers haven't come up with a way to use the popularity of comic book movies to bring in new readers in the kind of numbers required to get back to the levels of decades past.
By comparison, Manga sales in Japan are about 2 billion books a year. The Japanese sure do like their comics!
By comparison, Manga sales in Japan are about 2 billion books a year. The Japanese sure do like their comics!
Well, not to get on my soapbox again, but the problem is that the top 100-200 books are almost exclusively Marvel/DC superheroes. Once in a while something like Buffy breaks through, but that's far and few between. So, it leads to the problem where it's usually a few people buying 50-100 dollars worth of books a week instead of the more sustainable paradigm of having many people by one or two books a week.
Imagine if novels were sold and marketed the same way as comic books? No one would read anymore because the biggest books are all in the same genre.
I'd just be curious to see how "popular" things like Inyunasha and that stuff sells over here. I mean, getting into those books are an investment as well, since you're talking about a 40-50 volume series... yet, you look in comic book stores and normal book stores and they take up lots of shelf space.
As for Japan, the thing there is that they are totally marketed to everyone and are considered mainstream. You've got books that appeal to boys, girls, men, women, gay or straight. Manga is as broad as the cute little animal mascot books (equivalent to the excellent Owly books that come out here) to the scifi action stuff to, well, pornography or "romance literature".
Of course, I'll readily admit that conservatism is a problem that stopped the development of comic books for a while. It's the same problem that's plaguing video games - the audience is still niche, even though the industry makes more money than film - although the factors are slightly different (although, even then, it's a case where the Japanese (and Asians) treat gaming like another entertainment medium like film or whatever, where Westerners look down on it as childish and male-dominated).
Imagine if novels were sold and marketed the same way as comic books? No one would read anymore because the biggest books are all in the same genre.
I'd just be curious to see how "popular" things like Inyunasha and that stuff sells over here. I mean, getting into those books are an investment as well, since you're talking about a 40-50 volume series... yet, you look in comic book stores and normal book stores and they take up lots of shelf space.
As for Japan, the thing there is that they are totally marketed to everyone and are considered mainstream. You've got books that appeal to boys, girls, men, women, gay or straight. Manga is as broad as the cute little animal mascot books (equivalent to the excellent Owly books that come out here) to the scifi action stuff to, well, pornography or "romance literature".
Of course, I'll readily admit that conservatism is a problem that stopped the development of comic books for a while. It's the same problem that's plaguing video games - the audience is still niche, even though the industry makes more money than film - although the factors are slightly different (although, even then, it's a case where the Japanese (and Asians) treat gaming like another entertainment medium like film or whatever, where Westerners look down on it as childish and male-dominated).
Yes, I agree that the domination of superheroes in the American market has a stifling effect on the industry. A greater variety of genres and a place amongst the arts as just another mainstream medium where any sort of story can be told and embraced by widely varying readerships should be the goal of American comics. I think the situation has improved somewhat in that regard (particularly in the trade paperback business), but there's still a long way to go.
I think DC is making a good effort with the Minx line, but I think it might be too little too late. I look at things like Scott Pilgrim, which is essentially one of the biggest American produced/published Mangas and I just wish it got as much play as the more "mainstream" stuff.
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