What do you diehard TOS fans think of the new movie?

[Brutal Strudel]

Still, nothing in that film even suggests that he thinks he is so smart that he doesn't have to study.

Kirk: I have to study.
McCoy: "Study" my ass.

Close. He studied an Orion chick's ass instead.

Why did I know you would bring that up?

Kirk is a ladies-man. We all know this, and so does McCoy.
Kirk is also way in his third year at the academy. Do you really think he would have gotten that far (and also already taken the KM-test twice) without studying?

To answer your first question, because you know that exchange supports my argument. To answer your second question, no, I do not, but then, I also don't think any military or para-malitary organization would give command of its finest cruiser to a newly minted academy graduate, hence my use of the term "fantasy."

 

[ST-One]

Kirk: I have to study.
McCoy: "Study" my ass.

Close. He studied an Orion chick's ass instead.

Why did I know you would bring that up?

Kirk is a ladies-man. We all know this, and so does McCoy.
Kirk is also way in his third year at the academy. Do you really think he would have gotten that far (and also already taken the KM-test twice) without studying?

To answer your first question, because you know that exchange supports my argument. To answer your second question, no, I do not,

Then you defeat your own argument.

but then, I also don't think any military or para-malitary organization would give command of its finest cruiser to a newly minted academy graduate, hence my use of the term "fantasy."

I wouldn't know about that.
But then, Kirk trained for a command position for three years. Obviously Starfleet and Pike saw more in him than you.

 

[Warped9]

One thing I see here always happens: whenever someone likes something they'll defend it to the death and employ all manner of rationalizations to do so. They'll dig their heels in.

As I see it it's little different than individual tastes in music. When someone likes a particular kind of music, on some level they can't understand why no one else can like their music. And conversely they mightn't understand why someone prefers a different kind of music. I've seen this happen all the time.

I can see why folks can like this film and aspects of it. Yet that isn't the same as agreeing. It's a fine distinction. Conversely you should be able to see why someone takes issue with the film and individual aspects of it without having to agree with them.

 

[jayrath]

I thought it was very nice to look at, but the science of it was craptastic (see my post in the ST XI forum), and I had major problems with the dynamics of the script.

I guess it was fine as a reimagined "Star Trek." My major problem is that it didn't work well as a movie. I didn't believe the relationships, I had no sympathy with the characters, and after a time I almost resented the lavishness of the special effects.

 

[USS Excelsior]

One of my biggest gripes was Kirk being made a Captain straight out of the Academy, and how old was Chekov when he joined the Academy, like 13 or so, and plus if he's 22 in 2266 they got his age wrong by at least 3 years.

 

[Warped9]

An interesting question arises here: since this is a new version of Trek even though it's set in an alternate TOS era will the TrekkBBS folks soon consider it a separate version worthy of its own forum or consider it just another film to be discussed in the Trek movie forum from hereon?

 

[Brutal Strudel]

Why did I know you would bring that up?

Kirk is a ladies-man. We all know this, and so does McCoy.
Kirk is also way in his third year at the academy. Do you really think he would have gotten that far (and also already taken the KM-test twice) without studying?

To answer your first question, because you know that exchange supports my argument. To answer your second question, no, I do not,

Then you defeat your own argument.

but then, I also don't think any military or para-malitary organization would give command of its finest cruiser to a newly minted academy graduate, hence my use of the term "fantasy."

I wouldn't know about that.
But then, Kirk trained for a command position for three years. Obviously Starfleet and Pike saw more in him than you.

Indeed.



Your logic is as unassailable as "I'm saying that when the president does it, it's not illegal." You can consider this argument won as I will no longer engage in it with you. There's simply no point.

 

[Aike]

The dissertation is about his father, the absense of whom has screwed him up. Reading that is less about studying and more about working out Freudian issues.

Still, nothing in that film even suggests that he thinks he is so smart that he doesn't have to study.

Kirk: I have to study.
McCoy: "Study" my ass.

Close. He studied an Orion chick's ass instead.

Actually, there are some parts missing from the movie according to Orci and Kurtzman:

Spoiler: Green Girl

GREEN GIRL BLUES​

There was a lot more material further explaining Kirk’s relationship with the hot green chick. Since she worked in the computer lab, Kirk was essentially sleeping with her to gain access to the simulation computer so he could cheat on the Kobyashi Maru. In a cut scene, Kirk tells her that if she gets an email from him while he’s taking the test, she should open it; she does, and it launches a virus which installs his cheat-patch.


http://darthmojo.wordpress.com/2009/05/14/trek-scribes-speak-complaints-addressed/
​

 

[Aike]

One thing I see here always happens: whenever someone likes something they'll defend it to the death and employ all manner of rationalizations to do so. They'll dig their heels in.

The opposite is true too

 

[Brutal Strudel]

Still, nothing in that film even suggests that he thinks he is so smart that he doesn't have to study.

Kirk: I have to study.
McCoy: "Study" my ass.

Close. He studied an Orion chick's ass instead.

Actually, there are some parts missing from the movie according to Orci and Kurtzman:

Spoiler: Green Girl

GREEN GIRL BLUES


There was a lot more material further explaining Kirk’s relationship with the hot green chick. Since she worked in the computer lab, Kirk was essentially sleeping with her to gain access to the simulation computer so he could cheat on the Kobyashi Maru. In a cut scene, Kirk tells her that if she gets an email from him while he’s taking the test, she should open it; she does, and it launches a virus which installs his cheat-patch.​

http://darthmojo.wordpress.com/2009/05/14/trek-scribes-speak-complaints-addressed/​

Wow. That's charming. I'm glad it never made the screen.

 

[Warped9]

One thing I see here always happens: whenever someone likes something they'll defend it to the death and employ all manner of rationalizations to do so. They'll dig their heels in.

The opposite is true too

Yes. But as I mentioned elsewhere there is a distinction in understanding why someone likes or dislikes something yet still not agree with it, rather than just trying to imply that the other person is just blind or stupid for not accepting one's argument.

 

[Brutal Strudel]

Or by constantly changing the terms of a debate ("Now we'll consider it as work of drama, no, no, I'm losing , so now we'll consider it as a 'real' world of its own"). People disagreeing with me is not offensive--hell, Warped9 hated this movie and I loved it. Sloppy thinking and intellectual (such as it is) dishonesty is.

 

[Cakes488]

Still, nothing in that film even suggests that he thinks he is so smart that he doesn't have to study.

Kirk: I have to study.
McCoy: "Study" my ass.

Close. He studied an Orion chick's ass instead.

Actually, there are some parts missing from the movie according to Orci and Kurtzman:

Spoiler: Green Girl

GREEN GIRL BLUES


There was a lot more material further explaining Kirk’s relationship with the hot green chick. Since she worked in the computer lab, Kirk was essentially sleeping with her to gain access to the simulation computer so he could cheat on the Kobyashi Maru. In a cut scene, Kirk tells her that if she gets an email from him while he’s taking the test, she should open it; she does, and it launches a virus which installs his cheat-patch.​

http://darthmojo.wordpress.com/2009/05/14/trek-scribes-speak-complaints-addressed/​

I wonder how much was cut and edited from this movie that I would of preferred to see rather than what they chose to include. I like that spoiler and it would of given us more character interaction and certainly would of explained things -- especially to people who have never heard the words Kobyashi Maru before!!! They better take this track next go round or I'm out.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Kirk: I have to study.
McCoy: "Study" my ass.

Close. He studied an Orion chick's ass instead.

I think you misinterpreted that line. It doesn't mean Kirk doesn't study. It mean that in this case McCoy knows he's not studying. but scoring with an Orion.

One of my biggest gripes was Kirk being made a Captain straight out of the Academy, and how old was Chekov when he joined the Academy, like 13 or so, and plus if he's 22 in 2266 they got his age wrong by at least 3 years.

In Chekov's case he was a whiz kid. The Doogie Howser of Starfleet.

One thing I see here always happens: whenever someone likes something they'll defend it to the death and employ all manner of rationalizations to do so. They'll dig their heels in.

As I see it it's little different than individual tastes in music. When someone likes a particular kind of music, on some level they can't understand why no one else can like their music. And conversely they mightn't understand why someone prefers a different kind of music. I've seen this happen all the time.

I can see why folks can like this film and aspects of it. Yet that isn't the same as agreeing. It's a fine distinction. Conversely you should be able to see why someone takes issue with the film and individual aspects of it without having to agree with them.

It's a bit late for you to play the "voice of reason."

You haven't even managed to mount reasonable arguement as to why you hate the movie. Hate it all you want but bring something to the table that can't be shot down with a spitball and a straw.

An interesting question arises here: since this is a new version of Trek even though it's set in an alternate TOS era will the TrekkBBS folks soon consider it a separate version worthy of its own forum or consider it just another film to be discussed in the Trek movie forum from hereon?

A while back I said once the hoopla dies down discussion of the film should be placed in the movies forum.

 

[The Laughing Vulcan]

An interesting question arises here: since this is a new version of Trek even though it's set in an alternate TOS era will the TrekkBBS folks soon consider it a separate version worthy of its own forum or consider it just another film to be discussed in the Trek movie forum from hereon?

A while back I said once the hoopla dies down discussion of the film should be placed in the movies forum.

Better if it's placed in an escape pod and jettisoned onto the surface of Hoth!

 

[Nerys Myk]

An interesting question arises here: since this is a new version of Trek even though it's set in an alternate TOS era will the TrekkBBS folks soon consider it a separate version worthy of its own forum or consider it just another film to be discussed in the Trek movie forum from hereon?

A while back I said once the hoopla dies down discussion of the film should be placed in the movies forum.

Better if it's placed in an escape pod and jettisoned onto the surface of Hoth!

Well, we still talk about NEM and TFF there, so no.

 

[The Laughing Vulcan]

A while back I said once the hoopla dies down discussion of the film should be placed in the movies forum.

Better if it's placed in an escape pod and jettisoned onto the surface of Hoth!

Well, we still talk about NEM and TFF there, so no.

Hey! I like TFF!

Anyway, if Spock 2.0 can do it to Kirk 2.0...

 

[Nerys Myk]

Better if it's placed in an escape pod and jettisoned onto the surface of Hoth!

Well, we still talk about NEM and TFF there, so no.

Hey! I like TFF!

Anyway, if Spock 2.0 can do it to Kirk 2.0...

So, you're the one.

 

[Warped9]

You know as much as I disliked this film I can easily see where a lot of things could have been fixed to get a better film. One of the biggest fixes would have been to have a genuinely interesting villian, someone that actually wasn't just a baddy yet someone with nuance that you could possibly even sympathize with.

One of the strengths of TWOK is that Khan wasn't just a cliche bad guy. You could actually see his point of view. Nero doesn't really come off that way despite the words he says.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Nero and Khan have similar motivations. Misplaced blame for a situation beyond control that resulted in the death of a loved one.

Khan was, thanks to Montalban, an over the top scenery chewing villian. ( a cliche?)Bana's performance was more controled and understated.