Ugh, that article. Call me thick, but I never understood "retroactive damage." Like, I understand the concept on a very cerebral level, but never in actual practice. If a story is good it doesn't stop because of another story.
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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The Klingon Empire felt like more of a threat in TOS and the TOS Movies than it ever did in the TNG Era, and that includes the Federation-Klingon War in Season 4 of DS9. The Klingons in TOS were a lot simpler but felt like a greater menace.
I think if a later entry can affect how much someone liked an earlier entry, then they didn't like the earlier entry that much to begin with.
To keep it within Trek: Most people -- magically up until 2022 -- thought Nemesis was a shitty last note for TNG to go out on. But how much they despised NEM (I know, I was here, and I can call bullshit on anything the Revisionists say now) didn't retroactively change what they thought of TNG.
Or the raw hatred for ST V never impacted how people appreciated TWOK. TWOK was always held up as the Trek movie, much like First Contact ended up being. Yet, I don't recall (or was not privved to) the discussions of ruination of past works that seem to permeate current discussions.
A bad ending can ruin a lot of people's enjoyment of the earlier portions of a story. Happened with Lost. Happened to an extent with NuBSG. Absolutely happened with Game of Thrones.
Earlier portions of the same story, or rather the same series. The Dark Knight Rises ruins Batman Begins and The Dark Knight for me. And BSG is a prime example.
But never has one series retroactively ruined a previous series for me. Especially if they were made in different decades by different people. If I thought a newer series was bad, I'd just ignore the newer series.
But, we're not talking about the same story though. So, this is a non sequitur.
Exactly.
I will say that what later Trek has done with Section 31 has made me enjoy its use in DS9 less and less. But that's a particular element of a show, not an entire show.
To be fair, they were never intended to be a threat during the TNG Era. Not even during DS9 Season 4, because we all knew it was fueled by fear of the Changelings and paranoia.
This is the view that I can most relate to (even if it does not apply to me) - it would take something seismic to wipe out the entire legacy and goodwill of a series, and as someone said earlier "if it ruins a previous series then maybe you didn't like it all that well", but I fully get how the expansion of S31 can change how their portrayal is perceived. It feels proportional to me as a reaction.
I don't know how controversial this is, but Kirstie Alley Saavik is better.
Talking about the Maquis in another thread made me more aware of something.
Chakotay is a very honorable character. Proof of this is simply his resigning his Starfleet commission and then joining the Maquis, instead of aiding them while still in Starfleet. He went the proper route instead of the traitor route. He kept to his beliefs but did so without breaking his oath.
You have to give the man credit for that.
Chakotay is a very honorable character. Proof of this is simply his resigning his Starfleet commission and then joining the Maquis, instead of aiding them while still in Starfleet. He went the proper route instead of the traitor route. He kept to his beliefs but did so without breaking his oath.
You have to give the man credit for that.
"Superior ability breeds superior ambition" is hypocritical coming from some of Starfleet's best and boldest.
I would disagree with that simply because the way that line was delivered, it clearly referred to controlling countries and worlds.
Starfleet and the Federation has its faults, but an ambition to conquer worlds is definitely not one of them.
Take Data. Superior abilities in virtually every single thing, yet he has no lust for conquest. Despite the fact he has no emotions, he still displays kindness, respect, and decency.
Or Spock. Superior to humans and most other humanoids physically and intellectually, yet he serves a greater good. And he is a scientist a heart. He simply wants to learn.
Or Bashir. A genetically enhanced brain, definitely on par with a Vulcan. Yet his only ambition is saving lives.
The Doctor on VOYAGER. Same ambition as Bashir, though more arrogant about it. But he has never been one to use his abilities in a negative way.
So no, Starfleet's best and brightest are not hypocritical on that statement.
I don't know what the books history of Ro have to say, but in my head, I think she was sent on an undercover mission to expose the Maquis and the Cardassian violations of the treaty. She was later taking as many of the Maquis as she could and kept them moving and hiding to avoid the Dominion. She never betrayed Picard, she just had to follow orders from those above him, and that was the true pain she felt. Yes, it hurt her to see the Cardassions killing. Yes, having her friend die right in front of her hurt her, but it was not being able to tell Picard she was doing no less than he would were their situations reversed, trying to salvage the fragile treaty with the Cardassians. I also think that if she hadn't met Picard that one last time and he told her if she couldn't do it he'd have her pulled from the mission and replaced she would have told him everything to get his blessing and then continue with her mission. Picard was the father she lost. She wanted to make him proud of her.
I like TOS, TNG, DS9, ENTERPRISE (despite it's problems), and yes, even Voyager.
As I have said I am not a fan of Discovery.
Believe me, I wanted to be. I started out watching, hoping this new show would be great. But somehow, somewhere they lost me.
By the way, I love Lower Decks. It is just a fun show. Not really the way Starfleet "officers" (small o) should act, but it is still fun.
As I have said I am not a fan of Discovery.
Believe me, I wanted to be. I started out watching, hoping this new show would be great. But somehow, somewhere they lost me.
By the way, I love Lower Decks. It is just a fun show. Not really the way Starfleet "officers" (small o) should act, but it is still fun.
Well, delete those ethical subroutines and see what happens...
Fair point, but at least he has them to begin with. Granted, it was programmed, but aren't we all essentially programmed while growing up, with values and facts?
True. If the Federation wanted to it could program its EMHs to behave like the more sadistic physicians in the Mirror Universe. Hell, Phlox was a biological Denobulan but you just know almost any EMH the Klingon-Cardassian Alliance or even the Terran Resistance developed would be a far bigger asshole than almost any Doctor in Starfleet over on our side of reality.
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