If it were Star Trek I'd still like it less than I do any of the Legacy series.
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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That WOULD make it official.
Let's not bring Hitchhiker's into this.
I think maybe some are conflating two very different meanings of “X is Y”.
There’s “The Orville is Star Trek” in that it expresses the same values in a similar manner and structure. Which is true, certainly if you consider Lower Decks.
And there’s “The Orville is Star Trek” in the sense of it literally being part of the same franchise, I guess. Which of course it isn’t.
Same way TOS is absolutely Forbidden Planet: The Series, but it isn’t *literally* Forbidden Planet: The Series.
There’s “The Orville is Star Trek” in that it expresses the same values in a similar manner and structure. Which is true, certainly if you consider Lower Decks.
And there’s “The Orville is Star Trek” in the sense of it literally being part of the same franchise, I guess. Which of course it isn’t.
Same way TOS is absolutely Forbidden Planet: The Series, but it isn’t *literally* Forbidden Planet: The Series.
The Orville can be discussed in the Science Fiction/Fantasy Forum.
Just saying...
But you know what I want to say.
Why can't people just say that?
Like, I can say MASH is STAR TREK because it espouses diversity and cooperation. Same with Stargate because it has exploration of alien planets and a Preserver like culture.
Vs. if I say I like X, Y, and Z shows because they espouse values I value.
Let's see, both are spaced out. Both show a very positive sense of the future of humanity. Both are advanced in terms of the 'current technology (in the first case 1960s technological concepts evolved for the show, in the second case early twenty-first century technological ideas, again evolved from 1960s technological concepts)
Then you have Strange New Worlds bringing in not only Doctor Who, but the Alien franchise as well.
Why? In part to satisfy us fans. With the problem that this might not be wise.
But there is a bigger problem:
Early Star Trek must have had a very great severe teething incidents. Of a like kind.
Which means that stiff learning curves were the deal of the day, indicated by 'Alien: Prometheus'.
This is important due to the stupidity shown, in the image of a major character taking pff his space helmet. No checking for biological entities...
Now bring in 'The Expanse'...in case you missed an important insight into the requirements for long term survival in space.
Each of these is insightful, a piece of the whole puzzle.
Then you have Strange New Worlds bringing in not only Doctor Who, but the Alien franchise as well.
Why? In part to satisfy us fans. With the problem that this might not be wise.
But there is a bigger problem:
Early Star Trek must have had a very great severe teething incidents. Of a like kind.
Which means that stiff learning curves were the deal of the day, indicated by 'Alien: Prometheus'.
This is important due to the stupidity shown, in the image of a major character taking pff his space helmet. No checking for biological entities...
Now bring in 'The Expanse'...in case you missed an important insight into the requirements for long term survival in space.
Each of these is insightful, a piece of the whole puzzle.
Which was damn stupid.
It did? I recall a blink and you miss it TARDIS. No clue about Alien. Unless we're going down the Gorn are like the Xenomorph road. But that's not "bringing in" its just an influence on the story. Trek has hundreds of those.
I don’t feel that’s enough, though. MASH shares (some) values with Star Trek, but you couldn’t squint and see a MASH episode as “basically” a TOS episode. (There are times you could see a MASH episode as a DS9 episode, but not all the time, not to the point you could see the whole series that way.)
Whereas (as I see it) just about any Orville episode, take out most of the jokes and make a few pencil slashes in the script, and yeah, one could see it as Trek, especially TNG.
I think that’s the difference. And again, obviously it’s not literally true, but it’s close enough to be understandable. (I mean, I thought The Hunt for Red October was a pretty good TWOK-era Trek movie too, in that sense — not a TOS episode, but a Nick Meyer monster maroon movie? Sure.)
I think I probably could.
I guess. I feel it's a poor description and actively undermines both franchises by insisting they must be related..
By that logic, the franchise already brought in Star Wars because of a blink-and-you'll-miss-it R2-D2 in one of the movies.
Don’t forget the Millennium Falcon in the fight scene in First Contact. 
I don’t think it’s controversial to compare The Orville to Star Trek, by dint of the fact that The Orville is similar by design.
See also:
Ancient Roman architecture is a lot like Ancient Greek architecture.
M&Ms are a lot like Smarties.
Burger King is a lot like McDonalds.
On the other hand, it’s not controversial exactly to say The Orville is Star Trek. It’s just stupid, because very evidently it is not.
Some just like to beat a dead horse. Some get banned for spamming nonsense in fact, while others… don’t.
See also:
Ancient Roman architecture is a lot like Ancient Greek architecture.
M&Ms are a lot like Smarties.
Burger King is a lot like McDonalds.
On the other hand, it’s not controversial exactly to say The Orville is Star Trek. It’s just stupid, because very evidently it is not.
Some just like to beat a dead horse. Some get banned for spamming nonsense in fact, while others… don’t.
yea to be fair I didn't know it was the most popular movie or even popular at all before spending time online and talking to other Star Trek fans. I personally liked it the least along with the motion picture movie when comparing to all the other movies.
First of all, welcome.
Secondly, I think TWOK gets favorably compared (in the stupid comparison games) because it was preceded by the Motion(less) Picture. It captured an action/adventure vibe that TOS often utilized, but was lacking in TMP, as well as deliberate TOS references, even if the characters had obviously moved on. It then pulled pages from the TOS playbook of Shakespeare references, classical literature references, and a Sherlock style villain update for Khan, moving Khan from one off to Kirk's nemesis in his "rogue's gallery." Couple that with memorable lines and performances and it gets that film tossed up there, especially compared against TMP's more milder performances, and people will see that film stand out.
TWOK is pretty good.
It has a lot going for it.
Good villain.
Nice space battle.
Powerful ending.
Well written sub-plot involving the general passage of time.
It’s pretty good.
Maybe controversial though, but I much prefer both TSFS and TVH.
It has a lot going for it.
Good villain.
Nice space battle.
Powerful ending.
Well written sub-plot involving the general passage of time.
It’s pretty good.
Maybe controversial though, but I much prefer both TSFS and TVH.
I prefer TVH to TWOK, and TUC to TWOK. I can acknowledge TWOK's strengths while also being like "It's overhyped."
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