What Are The Real Plot Holes In The Movie?

[Shazam!]

... but you're right, it was a plot device so that the universe could align and allow Kirk to meet Spock prime and Mr. Scott.

Here's a great exchange in the script that wasn't used in the movie:
Kirk:
How is it that I found you in this cave in the middle of an ice planet? It's insane that we should ever even meet this way.
Spock:
Perhaps it's the timestream's way of trying to mend itself. It is fate and destiny trying to bring all of us together.
-source: Star trek magazine #19

Explaining for explaining's sake. It would've been far cooler to have Spock respond with "I have absolutely no idea... luck?"

 

[Anticitizen]

Nero's motivations certainly qualify. 25 years of hatred for the man who tried to save his planet... okay, if he's a madman, I could maybe buy that. But I feel at some point one of his crew would get fed up with the obsession, realize the ramifications of destroying entire worlds, or be worried about mucking up his own timeline that he'd put a distruptor up to the back of Nero's head and pull the trigger.

I found a good respose to that in another thread.

Nero is a passionate, angry, irrational, hate filled, half mad (or fully mad) man.

He has seen his family, his entire planet destroyed because Romulan and Vulcan politicians would not act and do what's necessary. Because they let stupid pride and prejudice blind them.

He placed his trust in Spock and his promises and Spock did not deliver. All he ended up offering is patience and more words when swift action was needed.
He wasted valuable time instead of maybe even helping Nero steal by force the technology and save Romulus at all costs.

He was thrown back in time unwillingly and spent a decade in a Klingon prison.

He has a super advanced powerful ship in his hands that destroys Klingon armadas. He does not believe he can lose.

He has centuries to save Romulus in this timeline and a burning desire for revenge right now.

I don't see how anyone can expect such a man to do what we consider the right course of action sitting safely behind our keyboards.

I could see that - if it were included in the film. Unfortunately we don't get more information than 'Spock was too slow.' And even if, what about the crew that followed Nero around for 25 years?

Eh, Kirk running into Spock Prime in some grungy spaceship just doesn't have the magic and mystery of an ice cave on an alien planet (and I'm sure the writers also wanted a better backdrop for the mind meld sequence). And while Spock Prime watching the destruction of Vulcan from this planet may not be completely plausible, it still seems more visually poetic and elegant than him watching it while floating in space in a spacesuit. All the special effects and hardware would get in the way of the emotion of the moment.

I agree, but sometimes poetic license can be taken too far. Spock maybe/maybe not seeing Vulcan get destroyed is one of those times - did he or did he not see Vulcan go kablooie? With his mind or with his eyes? There's no way to tell from the movie itself. To be honest, Spock Prime's character reminded me of 'Basil Exposition' from the Austin Powers flicks - there to explain the plot and not much else.

Besides, it would still strike me as a massive coincidence that Spock deposits Kirk on the ONE ship in the quadrant that happens to be carrying Spock Prime and Scotty.

You're right, of course, it would be, but less so than what we got. Vulcan's distress call would bring ships in the near sectors in for help, which would give a reason for all these people to be in the same place. There's no reason for Spock Prime to be on that ice planet; there's no reason for Kirk to be on that ice planet. Well, no good ones anyway. Scotty responding to Vulcan's distress call with his little salvage ship and finding a floating Spock Prime in distress would be a good way to unite them. And Spock Jr. hailing Scotty's ship and asking if he has room for another passenger would be better than chucking Kirk out in the snow.

As for watching the destruction of Vulcan in a spacesuit... I think that could be handled very well to be emotional. Imagine, floating derelict in space, watching your homeworld implode, and there's nothing you can do about it, your screams echoing in your own helmet... then left to slowly asphixiate.

 

[SalvorHardin]

Nero's motivations certainly qualify. 25 years of hatred for the man who tried to save his planet... okay, if he's a madman, I could maybe buy that. But I feel at some point one of his crew would get fed up with the obsession, realize the ramifications of destroying entire worlds, or be worried about mucking up his own timeline that he'd put a distruptor up to the back of Nero's head and pull the trigger.

I found a good respose to that in another thread.

I could see that - if it were included in the film. Unfortunately we don't get more information than 'Spock was too slow.' And even if, what about the crew that followed Nero around for 25 years?

Well, in my opinion that was the movie's biggest flaw. Much more background from the Countdown comics and the Klingon prison should have been included.

As far as the rest of the crew is concerned, they are Romulans, they shared the same experiences with Nero. So, they shouldn't be the sanest bunch too.
Interestingly, there was a scene that didn't make the final cut and would have been nice

There is a scene as the Narada approaches Earth in which Nero's second in command, Ayel, threatens mutiny. He intimates that the crew feels destroying Vulcan has gotten them revenge and they now want to simply return to Romulus, which at this point in time still remains. Nero understands the crew's desire. But he will not return until everyone involved in the destruction of Romulus is punished. He kills Ayel and orders the drilling into Earth's crust begin.

 

[Kirk1980]

...what prison?

Did anybody else see a prison in the movie? A Klingon at all?

In the FILM, there is no such thing.

Sorry, you're not allowed to bring a cheat sheet (ie: the comic)

 

[SalvorHardin]

...what prison?

Did anybody else see a prison in the movie? A Klingon at all?

In the FILM, there is no such thing.

Sorry, you're not allowed to bring a cheat sheet (ie: the comic)

Sorry, we'll do as we please...

 

[davejames]

I agree, but sometimes poetic license can be taken too far. Spock maybe/maybe not seeing Vulcan get destroyed is one of those times - did he or did he not see Vulcan go kablooie? With his mind or with his eyes? There's no way to tell from the movie itself. To be honest, Spock Prime's character reminded me of 'Basil Exposition' from the Austin Powers flicks - there to explain the plot and not much else.

Well yeah if you stop and analyze it, it does seem farfetched. But honestly in the course of watching the movie itself I have no problem accepting that Spock did in fact see Vulcan implode from the ice planet.

The story flies by so fast you don't really have time to dwell on the details, and that's perfectly fine with me.

And in any case, it doesn't bug me nearly as much as, say, the sun blowing up in Generations after Soran's missle has barely even left the planet's atmosphere. Now THAT always annoys the hell out of me. lol

 

[Hartzilla2007]

...what prison?

Did anybody else see a prison in the movie? A Klingon at all?

In the FILM, there is no such thing.

Sorry, you're not allowed to bring a cheat sheet (ie: the comic)

The one Uhura said the 47 Klingon ships got destroyed by a large Romulan ship near.

 

[Chrisisall]

Well, in my opinion that was the movie's biggest flaw. Much more background from the Countdown comics and the Klingon prison should have been included.

Respectfully disagree here- I liked having no real idea during the movie what his motives or methods were, it made him more of a mystery that way. But I'll buy the comic anyway- rabid & weak-willed fan that I am.

 

[SalvorHardin]

Well, in my opinion that was the movie's biggest flaw. Much more background from the Countdown comics and the Klingon prison should have been included.

Respectfully disagree here- I liked having no real idea during the movie what his motives or methods were, it made him more of a mystery that way. But I'll buy the comic anyway- rabid & weak-willed fan that I am.

I had already read the comics before seeing the movie so I didn't really have any unanswered questions about his motivations or psychology.

You should read them.

 

[Chrisisall]

I had already read the comics before seeing the movie

Spoiler-glutton!

You should read them.

This week, with any random chance operating in my favour.

 

[Kirk1980]

See, I know I'm probably regarded as a curmudgeon on these boards but I feel that a good movie should be able to hold up without supplemental material.

And there is absolutely no evidence given in the movie to suggest he had been in the prison. 25 years is a long flipping time for a supership to come rescue their captain.

 

[SalvorHardin]

25 years is a long flipping time for a supership to come rescue their captain.

They were in the prison with him, so no rescue from the crew.

One of the scenes cut had Klingon ships decloacking and surrounding the Narada after it was damaged by the Kelvin's ramming maneuver.

 

[Kirk1980]

Yes, CUT from the film.

Therefore, it did not exist in the narrative as presented in the film. I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass but this is based on the plot holes in the film itself.

Supplemental material is nice but it's not what we saw and what we heard in the feature presentation itself.

 

[Anticitizen]

Well yeah if you stop and analyze it, it does seem farfetched. But honestly in the course of watching the movie itself I have no problem accepting that Spock did in fact see Vulcan implode from the ice planet.

The story flies by so fast you don't really have time to dwell on the details, and that's perfectly fine with me.

That's exactly what happened to me, actually! I had a good time watching the movie... but it fell apart in my mind later. My girlfriend and I discuss, rather extensively, every movie we see together. It's just what we do. Star Trek became a victim, sadly. We both thought it was fun! And then we started bringing up the 'well, except...' factors, and well... by the time we were done, there wasn't much left.

(Side note - we watched The Fountain the other night, and it motherspockin' blew me away. One of my favorite movies ever, instantly. I was sobbing by the end credits, and after smoking a cigarette through my tears, I watched it again. Just for reference.)

And in any case, it doesn't bug me nearly as much as, say, the sun blowing up in Generations after Soran's missle has barely even left the planet's atmosphere. Now THAT always annoys the hell out of me. lol

You and me both, brother. In this solar system, light takes eight minutes to reach the Earth from the Sun... who gave the light in the Veridian system permission to go faster!?

 

[MvRojo]

See, I know I'm probably regarded as a curmudgeon on these boards but I feel that a good movie should be able to hold up without supplemental material.

And there is absolutely no evidence given in the movie to suggest he had been in the prison. 25 years is a long flipping time for a supership to come rescue their captain.

Here's something that could be entertaining.

Since presumably Nero's ear was injured while on Rura Penthe in the original version, what is a good explanation for it in the context of the canon of the movie?

 

[M'Sharak]

See, I know I'm probably regarded as a curmudgeon on these boards but I feel that a good movie should be able to hold up without supplemental material.

And there is absolutely no evidence given in the movie to suggest he had been in the prison. 25 years is a long flipping time for a supership to come rescue their captain.

Here's something that could be entertaining.

Since presumably Nero's ear was injured while on Rura Penthe in the original version, what is a good explanation for it in the context of the canon of the movie?

That injury and the other cranial scarring were sustained in the damage inflicted on Narada by the Kelvin's ramming, or in an accident taking place during Narada's repair?

 

[Arlo]

Yes, CUT from the film.

Therefore, it did not exist in the narrative as presented in the film. I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass but this is based on the plot holes in the film itself.

Supplemental material is nice but it's not what we saw and what we heard in the feature presentation itself.

Can you imagine if there was a Director's Cut that added that stuff back in (as opposed to the 'deleted scenes' the DVD will have)? The arguments whether they're canon or not would be epic...

 

[Jeri]

Well, it would be great to see Kirk's brother, George, Jr., rather than some vapid "Johnny."

 

[MvRojo]

See, I know I'm probably regarded as a curmudgeon on these boards but I feel that a good movie should be able to hold up without supplemental material.

And there is absolutely no evidence given in the movie to suggest he had been in the prison. 25 years is a long flipping time for a supership to come rescue their captain.

Here's something that could be entertaining.

Since presumably Nero's ear was injured while on Rura Penthe in the original version, what is a good explanation for it in the context of the canon of the movie?

That injury and the other cranial scarring were sustained in the damage inflicted on Narada by the Kelvin's ramming, or in an accident taking place during Narada's repair?

Damn, I was hoping for a funny response, not a well-thought plausible explanation.

 

[Anticitizen]

Here's something that could be entertaining.

Since presumably Nero's ear was injured while on Rura Penthe in the original version, what is a good explanation for it in the context of the canon of the movie?

That injury and the other cranial scarring were sustained in the damage inflicted on Narada by the Kelvin's ramming, or in an accident taking place during Narada's repair?

Damn, I was hoping for a funny response, not a well-thought plausible explanation.

He got his ears caught in a mechanical rice-picker.