Weird promotion practices

[Turd Ferguson]

I love the 2009 Star Trek. Love it. It's fun, depressing and an all-around good time. One thing bugs me, though.

Why do the Captains in the JJ Abrams 23rd Century pass out promotions like Tic Tacs?

Robau promotes Lt. Kirk to Captain Kirk before he heads from the Kelvin to the Narada to get impaled.

Captain Pike, before heading to the Narada, promotes Spock to Captain and promotes Cadet Kirk to first officer.

My question is, is this really necessary? Wouldn't it just be the same to give Lt. Kirk the conn, or inform Spock that he'll be in command till Pike returns? It just seems like an awkward situation would arise whenever Pike returned. You'd have Captain Pike, Captain Spock and Captain Kirk all in command of the Enterprise. Or, would Captain Pike revoke his field promotions once he returned?

 

[Turd Ferguson]

So I just realized I posted this in the Enterprise forum. Could I get this transferred to the Trek XI forum?

 

[6079SmithW]

Well, I think it was tacitly understood that if the captain did in deed come back everyone would go back to their original positions. Their promotions were temporary. Robau seemed to have an instinct that he was not going to survive so the scene were he says "your're captain now, Mr Kirk" has more weight whereas Pike said "I guess you'll have to rescue me" stating that he expects to survive and Spock is just temporarilly in command until he returns. Kirk is the temporary XO until Spock is relieved of his temporary captaincy and returns to the XO position.

 

[Shatnertage]

Yeah, I didn't get Lt. Kirk's being made "captain" as an official promotion in rank--more like, "It's your ass in the hot seat now, make the most of it." Robau was saying, IMHO, "You're in charge now--forget about me," and went over to the Narada to try to buy some time for his crew. Just like Kirk ended up doing, successfully, a few minutes later.

 

[Hopeful Romantic]

So I just realized I posted this in the Enterprise forum. Could I get this transferred to the Trek XI forum?

There ye go

 

[F. King Daniel]

Kirk called Spock "Acting Captain" a few times. IIRC in DS9, Worf and Dax have been called "Captain" when they're in charge of the Defiant, as was Data in TNG's "Redemption". It was more the position of captain rather than the rank.

The only one who's rank did change by the end was Kirk's (who was already a lieutenant, according to the transporter console when Chekov beams him and Sulu up, and the novelization)

 

[Timo]

Exactly. And that promotion probably wasn't given by Captain Pike, and certainly not on the field. With the full weight of the Starfleet machinery coming to bear on a hero who saved Earth and Starfleet's reputation, it should not be unexpected for the celebrity Lieutenant to receive two (or perhaps three) additional stripes on his sleeve on short notice.

We don't know how short that notice was, of course. Long enough for Pike to be promoted to Vice Admiral (also three steps!), but not long enough for the cadets of Kirk's class to graduate (since they were still forming the audience in the promotion scene)... And short enough that the two Spocks didn't have a previous chance to come face to face.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[kkozoriz1]

Also not long enough for Kirk's face to heal completely.
http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/xihd/trekxihd2856.jpg

 

[Leathco]

Hmm. Well, in my opinion, the earlier promotions were simply field promotions. Kinda like how Riker became captain of the D after the assimilation of Picard.

As far as Kirk and Pikes promotions after Nerada was eliminated, to me it actually makes sense. Starfleet lost a lot of ships in their attempt to defend Vulcan, and they needed new crew to operate new ships. Anyone who had experience would move up, simply due to the gap left from the destruction of so many ships and crew. Kirk was already a luetenant, I figure he'd get a promotion to commander due to necessity, and maybe a bit of a bonus due to his acts during the crisis up to captain.

 

[ProwlAlpha]

Actually, Riker was given full command and promotion by Admiral Quinn.

 

[Timo]

I wouldn't even consider George and James Kirk's captaincies "field promotions". They were simply assignments, in no way affecting their cuff braid or pay rate.

What amazes me is that Kirk got promoted - but Spock, who actually did all the work in saving Earth and stopping Nero, did not! All Kirk ever achieved by himself was saving Pike's ass. Just goes to show...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[6079SmithW]

Spock physically assaulted a subordinate. That is why he did not receive the captaincy after Pike got promoted. He probably got a reprimand and permanent mark on his record. Pike's promotion was more one of necessity as he was physically disabled so Starfleet brass bumped him up to a less physically demanding desk job.

 

[BillJ]

Actually, Riker was given full command and promotion by Admiral Quinn.

Admiral Hanson only gives Riker a "field commission":

Hanson: Commander Riker, I hereby promote you to the field commission of Captain. The Enterprise is your ship now. Congratulations. I wish the circumstances were different.

Since they didn't know they could retrieve Picard at that point, everyone thought it would be a permanent promotion. But Riker is back to a "three pip" Commander in the next episode "Family", which indicates a field commission isn't permanent.

 

[UFO]

Spock physically assaulted a subordinate. That is why he did not receive the captaincy after Pike got promoted. He probably got a reprimand and permanent mark on his record.

In that case what sort of "mark" should Kirk have received for one of the worst attempts at mutiny I've ever seen? I'm not sure, perhaps you are you only a traitor if you can't convince others to join you? Didn't Kirk attack his guards at least?

 

[kkozoriz1]

Kirk was also AWOL from the academy and on the ship under false pretenses.

 

[UssGlenn]

Kirk was also AWOL from the academy and on the ship under false pretenses.

That's where Starfleet's unwritten but oft invoked "extenuating circumstance clause" comes into play. Spock loosing his temper and attacking Kirk didn't help solve the situation, but Kirk's deliberate actions did.

 

[6079SmithW]

I wouldn't call Kirk's actions mutiny. He was being insubordinate to Spock and did attack his guards but was not trying to incite rebellion. He probably would have gotten a reprimand too but it was probably waved because Earth needed a hero after the loss of Vulcan. Basically what UssGlenn said.

And there is a difference between being insubordinate and insulting/yelling at your CO and physically assaulting another officer.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Kirk was already a luetenant, I figure he'd get a promotion to commander due to necessity, and maybe a bit of a bonus due to his acts during the crisis up to captain.

They should have just made Kirk a Lieutenant Commander. They could still have given him command of the Enterprise - and he would even be called Captain, as all ship commanders are always called Captain regardless of actual rank.

I mean, come on. Kirk was a Lieutenant, so a promotion would mean he's now a LCDR. You don't just skip ranks. Ranks are there to be USED. It doesn't make sense to skip them. Especially in instances like this.

And don't tell me that even the casual viewer wouldn't understand it. All it would take was a couple of lines of dialogue. It worked for Jadzia on DS9 (when she was commanding the Defiant), and it would have damned well worked here.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

What amazes me is that Kirk got promoted - but Spock, who actually did all the work in saving Earth and stopping Nero, did not! All Kirk ever achieved by himself was saving Pike's ass. Just goes to show...

Could possibly be that Spock was offered a promotion and shock of shocks turned it down because 1) he never wanted a command and 2) He was planning to resign so he could help the Vulcans find a new home and rebuild.

 

[kkozoriz1]

I think it would have strengthened the ending if instead of Spock asking Kirk for a position on the Enterprise, Kirk tracked him down and offered him the position.