Was It Possible To Please Even More Trek Fans?

[CaptainJon]

No, I don't think they could've pleased more fans. I think they've pleased a good majority of fans. The ones who are not pleased either had too high of expectations, were pissed off about Vulcan and Amanda, or were never going to be pleased to begin with. Star Trek fans are incredibly hard to please because so many are too close-minded and very protective of the franchise to the point of not accepting changes, no matter how or how necessary they are.

I felt that Star Trek was drowning in its own lore, to the point that everything Enterprise did was scrutinized and dismissed because none of it was mentioned in prior series. Maybe if Enterprise hadn't been creativily bankrupt it would've fared better, but it was bankrupt and the scrutiny became "justified" because the show wasn't good. But I feel this new movie is fresh and exciting and made an attempt to appeal to that fanbase, while at the same time trying to be different and do something different with the Star Trek universe, something I felt needed to be done.

You think there are Star Trek fans who are pissed because an alternate universe has been established even though the foundation was founded in pre-establish Trek lore? How pissed do you think they would've been if JJ Abrams and company had done a fresh slate approach like Ronald D. Moore did with BSG?

 

[archeryguy1701]

No. At this point, any attempts would be dealing less with trying to get "More Trek Fans" happy and more with trying to get everyone happy. By and large, everyone is pretty damned happy, and like J., I'm pretty shocked by it. Even a decent amount of hardcore fans are onboard with it. I think we are about as united as a Fandom this vast and this polarised can really expect to get.

 

[CaptainJon]

Any attempt to win back those fans alienated by this movie would be a step in the wrong direction because it would more then likely lose that mainstream appeal. Let's face it; the real hardcore fans who are hard to please are mostly the ones who don't like the movie, while general audiences either like it or love it. By trying to go back to get back those hardcore fans would risk shrinking the audience that it has gained.

Isn't it better that Star Trek appeal to everyone then just a few in a cult audience?

 

[USS Renegade]

Right now the public is loving the new movie and also the Trek fans.....for the most part. What I'm wondering is could they have struck such a delicate and wonderful balance AND got more of the hardcore fans on their side?

Yes, they could have NOT destroyed Vulcan.

That was the hinge for me. They went too far by destroying Vulcan. It took me out of the movie and made me think about all the MAJOR changes that would take place, and I couldn't get back into the movie.

If they had NOT destroyed Vulcan, I would have liked it a lot.




BTW, I did want to enjoy the movie. I supported the fresh approach, but the Vulcan bit bugged me. I didn't even catch those spoilers. I didn't know until it happened in the movie and it just threw me off.

They also could have done a better job with that first presentation of the nuEnterprise. I remember that slow rollout they did in TMP. I saw it in the theater when I was like 6, and the memory STILL sends chills down my spine. In this movie, jusrt, plot. There it is. Next. Didn't like it. No gusto I say!

 

[EnsignRicky]

I wasn't at all a fan of Vulcan's destruction either. But for me what would have made it way better, is if they had just had the balls to do a straight up reboot, let Nimoy enjoy his retirement and give the new cast the opportunity to launch under their own steam. It also would have avoided all the canon violations and allowed a lot more people to just sit back and enjoy it for what it was.

 

[Rii]

They would've pleased this fan more if they'd put less effort into pleasing Trek fans.

 

[fresh]

I wasn't at all a fan of Vulcan's destruction either. But for me what would have made it way better, is if they had just had the balls to do a straight up reboot, let Nimoy enjoy his retirement and give the new cast the opportunity to launch under their own steam. It also would have avoided all the canon violations and allowed a lot more people to just sit back and enjoy it for what it was.

no
That would have been better for you, but that would have lessened the impact for most everyone else.
If it wasn't Vulcan, it would've had no impact.
It would be like that planet in Star Wars, so inconsequential I can't even recall its name.

 

[Tentacle]

One thing this movie has certainly done is redefined what a hardcore fan are.

All of sudden hardcore fans are crawly out of the woodworks, swelling the ranks of the fandom.

That's how you get 85% - 90% of the hardcore fans that love this movie.

 

[Amaris]

One thing this movie has certainly done is redefined what a hardcore fan are.

All of sudden hardcore fans are crawly out of the woodworks, swelling the ranks of the fandom.

That's how you get 85% - 90% of the hardcore fans that love this movie.

I agree. That's why you should check out The Neutral Zone. It's for well thought out, intelligent posts where even those of us who agree and disagree can find balance. Even the name suggests it. It's a place of neutrality, of equality, and it's for anyone who is tired of being shouted down for thinking different. If you haven't signed up for it, go to your subscriptions in the user cp and select TNZ.

J.

 

[TJinPgh]

Right now the public is loving the new movie and also the Trek fans.....for the most part. What I'm wondering is could they have struck such a delicate and wonderful balance AND got more of the hardcore fans on their side?

Yes, they could have NOT destroyed Vulcan.

That was the hinge for me. They went too far by destroying Vulcan. It took me out of the movie and made me think about all the MAJOR changes that would take place, and I couldn't get back into the movie.

They very easily could have won me over with this movie had it done only a couple of things differently.

The sentiment here is that, somehow, the changes that were made from the known Trek story are somehow responsible for making this movie popular. Most of the changes that were made were changes simply for the sake of making changes. Very few of them actually contribute to the story.

As for the polls on these boards... forgive me if I don't put a whole lot of stock in online polls. If I took these boards seriously I'd have to believe that there were about 20k people in Austin for an unannounced screening, given how many people claimed to have seen it before it was even released.

Do I think most Trek fans liked it? Probably. But then, most Trek fans don't fall into the category of die hard fans. Most are casual at best. 90% of the members of this forum weren't even alive when TOS was on the air. Half of them have probably seen TNG only in re-runs. Take a poll of those who have been around for the 43 years of Trek's existence and you'd probably get different results.

But, that's neither here nor there. The movie is successful and that's all that matters from a strictly commercial standpoint. Every one of us could hate this movie with a passion and it wouldn't have changed a thing.

Now, there will be people who will say that I didn't like it because I didn't want to like it. That I'm narrow minded and opposed to change. If that were true I wouldn't like New Voyages or Enterprise. I didn't expect to like either one of those when I first heard about them. In fact, I was quite certain that I'd hate them. But, I don't/didn't.

Like I said, there are a lot of things that I ended up liking about the movie. Visually it was stunning. The action, while by and large pointless, was entertaining. Some of the actors I was expecting to dislike I ended up being ok with (and some of the actors I was expecting to like I ended up being disappointed with in the end). And, it was funnier than I was expecting. But, even eliminating discussions of canon there are a lot of holes in the story and all but a couple of the characters are extremely lacking in depth.

But, like I said, despite all of those issues (which I had with any number of other Trek films), I could have easily been persuaded to give the movie a thumbs up had they simply changed the ending. Changes or no, there are certain things that are as constant about Trek as the names Kirk and Spock. And, declaring that 6 billion people (and Spock's mother) are an acceptable sacrafice so long as Kirk gets his ship violate most of them.

So, yes, I think it was easily possible to win over more fans than they did. I simply think that they either weren't familiar enough with the franchise to do it, or simply didn't care.

 

[Gepard]

I agree. That's why you should check out The Neutral Zone. It's for well thought out, intelligent posts where even those of us who agree and disagree can find balance. Even the name suggests it. It's a place of neutrality, of equality, and it's for anyone who is tired of being shouted down for thinking different. If you haven't signed up for it, go to your subscriptions in the user cp and select TNZ.

J.

HE LIES!

 

[Amaris]

I agree. That's why you should check out The Neutral Zone. It's for well thought out, intelligent posts where even those of us who agree and disagree can find balance. Even the name suggests it. It's a place of neutrality, of equality, and it's for anyone who is tired of being shouted down for thinking different. If you haven't signed up for it, go to your subscriptions in the user cp and select TNZ.

J.

HE LIES!

Dear sir, you wound me. The Neutral Zone is exactly what the name states. We're a neutral forum to discuss Star Trek on equal footing.


J.

 

[Gepard]

Dear sir, you wound me. The Neutral Zone is exactly what the name states. We're a neutral forum to discuss Star Trek on equal footing.


J.

I think I should just follow you around the entire board and contradict everything you say.

 

[Amaris]

Dear sir, you wound me. The Neutral Zone is exactly what the name states. We're a neutral forum to discuss Star Trek on equal footing.


J.

I think I should just follow you around the entire board and contradict everything you say.

That's not how we do things in TNZ. Maybe on some other board, but here we don't patronize or belittle one another.


J.

 

[Lynx]

Right now the public is loving the new movie and also the Trek fans.....for the most part. What I'm wondering is could they have struck such a delicate and wonderful balance AND got more of the hardcore fans on their side?

They could have done that by sticking more to the established Trek history instead of screwing it up.

The story was OK and the actors and characters better than I had expected. There were just some screw-ups which I think ruined some of it.

 

[Amaris]

Right now the public is loving the new movie and also the Trek fans.....for the most part. What I'm wondering is could they have struck such a delicate and wonderful balance AND got more of the hardcore fans on their side?

They could have done that by sticking more to the established Trek history instead of screwing it up.

The story was OK and the actors and characters better than I had expected. There were just some screw-ups which I think ruined some of it.

We've got a topic going on about that here, some of us would be very interested in your thoughts on the subject (we're evenly keeled in debate about it).


J.

 

[Gepard]

(we're evenly keeled in debate about it).

No you're not.

Guys, everything thing J. Allen is posting in this forum about TNZ is total BS. It's a flamefest in there. Maybe it's because, for once, I'm in the minority viewpoint on something, but playing things up like there's some sembleance of rational debate happening there doesn't seem funny or entertaining.

Enter at your own risk.

 

[Amaris]

(we're evenly keeled in debate about it).

No you're not.

Guys, everything thing J. Allen is posting in this forum about TNZ is total BS. It's a flamefest in there. Maybe it's because, for once, I'm in the minority viewpoint on something, but playing things up like there's some sembleance of rational debate happening there doesn't seem funny or entertaining.

Enter at your own risk.

It's not polite to take out frustrations on other members of The Neutral Zone. Everyone is free to reach their potential, become insightful, gain a sense of balance and decisiveness not found elsewhere.

J.

 

[Gepard]

It's not polite to take out frustrations on other members of The Neutral Zone. Everyone is free to reach their potential, become insightful, gain a sense of balance and decisiveness not found elsewhere.

J.

You're posting this with a sick grin on your face, aren't you?

 

[Amaris]

It's not polite to take out frustrations on other members of The Neutral Zone. Everyone is free to reach their potential, become insightful, gain a sense of balance and decisiveness not found elsewhere.

J.

You're posting this with a sick grin on your face, aren't you?

Not at all. If you'll look in TNZ, we have a spirited, equal and realistic debate between parties. We're being open minded, and willing to listen to one another. That is how one stays neutral in The Neutral Zone. It's a balance, but we manage. All are welcome.

J.