Spoilers Was it a mistake to kill Kirk in Star Trek Generations?

[fireproof78]

My only complain is Kirk dying by complete accident.

 

[Discofan]

Yeah, broken or not that bridge was supposed to withstand its own weight... so the only conclusion is that Kirk weighed about ten tons at that time. It's amusing to look at how the big metal chainlinks are being stretched out...

 

[Aragorn]

I'm fine with it. Kirk died to save millions of people who would never know what he did. That's pretty damn heroic.

However, considering all the possibilities of time travel they could've done with the Nexus, Picard could've picked a better situation to jump into and wouldn't have even needed Kirk.

 

[fireproof78]

Yeah, the solution was dumb.

 

[tesral]

Was it a mistake to kill Kirk in Star Trek Generations? This article seems to think so, saying it was a move made without foresight that harmed the franchise long term:

I would agree. Generations has a five second plot. While I will agree that it has many good scenes, as a film it does not hang together well. Worse of the pre reboot films.

Kirk dies a punk death. I'll say it, it sucked.

So Generations does not make my Head Canon. My mind's eye sees Kirk dying a very old man surrounded by family and friends. YMMV.

 

[Discofan]

I'm fine with it. Kirk died to save millions of people who would never know what he did. That's pretty damn heroic.

However, considering all the possibilities of time travel they could've done with the Nexus, Picard could've picked a better situation to jump into and wouldn't have even needed Kirk.

Yeah, like soon enough to warn his brother and nephew not to do whatever got them burned to a crisp...

Then he could have Soran arrested and put into the brig for a couple of days... and this is it!

 

[dupersuper]

Yeah, like soon enough to warn his brother and nephew not to do whatever got them burned to a crisp...

Then he could have Soran arrested and put into the brig for a couple of days... and this is it!

I tend to think he could only exit into the real world in a place the nexus has been in its travels, at the time it was there, and this was the only time we know of that it was at a planet.

 

[DonIago]

GUINAN: But as I said, time has no meaning here. So if you leave you can go anywhere, any time.

 

[Discofan]

I tend to think he could only exit into the real world in a place the nexus has been in its travels, at the time it was there, and this was the only time we know of that it was at a planet.

This:

GUINAN: But as I said, time has no meaning here. So if you leave you can go anywhere, any time.

 

[Kilana2]

I refrain from creating a thread with the title....

Spoiler: Star Trek Picard

Was it a mistakte to kill off Bruce Maddox in ST Picard?

For obvious reasons....

As to Kirk: his death was ill-conceived and misplaced. He deserved a better fate...

 

[dupersuper]

GUINAN: But as I said, time has no meaning here. So if you leave you can go anywhere, any time.

Meh, she's just a shadow; what does she know?

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Kirk's death should've been him sitting in the Captain's chair fulfilling his dream of commanding a vessel again.

Honestly, that just sounds regressive, cliched, and boring. One of the things I liked about the beginning of this film is that he looks like he’s itching to sit in the captain’s chair on the Enterprise B. But when he finally sits in it he realizes it’s not his place, and that the real captain should be there. It’s a nice bit a growth from what he did in TMP where he shoved Decker aside from the chair. He’s no longer the obsessive captain that felt he needed command. That’s not to say his actual death worked, but I think the filmmakers could have done a lot better than just having consoles explode in Shatner’s face.

 

[Discofan]

Honestly, that just sounds regressive, cliched, and boring. One of the things I liked about the beginning of this film is that he looks like he’s itching to sit in the captain’s chair on the Enterprise B. But when he finally sits in it he realizes it’s not his place, and that the real captain should be there. It’s a nice bit a growth from what he did in TMP where he shoved Decker aside from the chair. He’s no longer the obsessive captain that felt he needed command. That’s not to say his actual death worked, but I think the filmmakers could have done a lot better than just having consoles explode in Shatner’s face.

The real captain though seemed a little out of place. Like he didn't really belong there.

 

[DonIago]

Well, it was his metaphorical first day on the job, or so it appeared, and hardly ideal captaining circumstances. His leisurely cruise first became a major media event and then a rescue crisis.

 

[fireproof78]

Honestly, that just sounds regressive, cliched, and boring. One of the things I liked about the beginning of this film is that he looks like he’s itching to sit in the captain’s chair on the Enterprise B. But when he finally sits in it he realizes it’s not his place, and that the real captain should be there. It’s a nice bit a growth from what he did in TMP where he shoved Decker aside from the chair. He’s no longer the obsessive captain that felt he needed command. That’s not to say his actual death worked, but I think the filmmakers could have done a lot better than just having consoles explode in Shatner’s face.

I think you are on to something there. While I am not 100% certain how I want Kirk to die (maybe I don't) I do think that the idea of just exploding on the bridge misses a lot of his growth, from TUC onward.

 

[Discofan]

Well, it was his metaphorical first day on the job, or so it appeared, and hardly ideal captaining circumstances. His leisurely cruise first became a major media event and then a rescue crisis.

Yes, but I think we can assume that he's been someone's first officer for several years and so had to assume the function when he (the captain) was on vacation or needed to be elsewhere for some reason.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I think you are on to something there. While I am not 100% certain how I want Kirk to die (maybe I don't) I do think that the idea of just exploding on the bridge misses a lot of his growth, from TUC onward.

I mentioned that Kor had a better exit, and realize that what makes it impactful is that we don’t see his actual death happen. It’s left to our imaginations how he was able to accomplish his mission and sacrifice himself, and that makes it more powerful.

I dunno if that would work for a MOVIE, it definitely needed to feel grand in a sense. A more mythical type of death you hear told in stories.

 

[Discofan]

I mentioned that Kor had a better exit, and realize that what makes it impactful is that we don’t see his actual death happen. It’s left to our imaginations how he was able to accomplish his mission and sacrifice himself, and that makes it more powerful.

I dunno if that would work for a MOVIE, it definitely needed to feel grand in a sense. A more mythical type of death you hear told in stories.

It's powerful for Kor because everyone is against him, including the ones that were previously practically worshipping him (fickle bastards), so his heroic deed gets him back into everybody's good graces including and that was the real achievement, Martok.

I doubt Kirk's death could accomplish something like that, not even close.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Fair enough.

Perhaps a “Yesterday’s Enterprise” story really would have been the best if it weren’t taken. Just seeing the Enterprise-A enter the vortex and we can only imagine how Kirk and the crew went out in a battle.

 

[Discofan]

Fair enough.

Perhaps a “Yesterday’s Enterprise” story really would have been the best if it weren’t taken. Just seeing the Enterprise-A enter the vortex and we can only imagine how Kirk and the crew went out in a battle.

Yes, that would have been nice. I think it should have been that the death of Kirk was actually the thing that saved everything instead of just being a side effect. Like maybe the Villian takes Kirk hostage thinking it will get him everything he wants and instead Kirk sacrifices his life taking the Villain with him... or something like that.