War of the Supermen Discussion (Spoilers)
- Thread starter Admiral_Young
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Well like in Smallville the war has come and there are causalities on both sides...a deus ex machina was used to resolve the plot in the form of a Phantom Zone projector Superboy has Krypto get and uses to send the Kryptonians back including Zod, Ursa, and Non. Chris Kent is de-aged back to a kid as he full fills what the Nightwing entity wanted of him and is joined by Mon-El. General Lane commits suicide in front of Lois and Supergirl who nearly kills him out of rage for his actions against New Krypton. The Justice League engages and is dispatched as quickly by Non. Superman and Zod have a predictable and boring philosophical discussion during their fight and Zod nearly kills Krypto with a Kryptonite dagger meant for Kal but Clark tells Connor to take Krypto to the sun so he can power up...and that he'll be fine.
So as predicted New Krypton is gone, Superman, Supergirl, and Superboy are the last remaining Kryptonians on Earth. The three criminals along with surviving members of New Krypton are back in the Zone. General Lane is truly dead this time...and we start the march to JMS's take over in two months.
So as predicted New Krypton is gone, Superman, Supergirl, and Superboy are the last remaining Kryptonians on Earth. The three criminals along with surviving members of New Krypton are back in the Zone. General Lane is truly dead this time...and we start the march to JMS's take over in two months.
Which also means that the "Nightwing" name is free for Dick Grayson to reclaim when/if Bruce Wayne becomes Batman again.
^ Agreed...and the Return of Bruce Wayne number two was interesting as well.
This event felt way too rushed. They should have used more issues. Would have liked to have seen the rest of the DCU reacting to the invasion outside of one page of some crap ass backup Justice League. And WOW they rebooted everything to the status quo of a couple years ago, right to the letter. General Lane is dead... Supes and Supergirl (well, and Connor) are the only living Kryptonians... Chris is gone... Kara's parents are dead... Zod is lost in the Phantom Zone...
Well, DC really did paint themselves into a corner on this one. I was never a big fan of the overall idea, but some of the execution was good to great. I liked the focus on Mon-El, a favorite character of mine since shortly after I started collecting comics. My first Legion comic was volume 4 #5 with Mon-El on the cover and his epic battle with the Time Trapper inside. I also loved Rucka's writing on Nightwing and Flamebird.
Everything got wrapped up in a neat bow in Issue #4.
Overall, I thought the concept was of the mini was neat especially after the massive crossovers with Final Crisis, Blackest Night, and even the New Krypton arc in Superman's own books; which I guess this was the final chapter. But I thought maybe they could've thrown a couple of tie-ins to the main series to flesh out some of the side plots. A lot of cool stuff was rushed through or done off panel and I think that diminished the story, or at least my enjoyment of it.
Anyway, while I loved the relatively cheap price of the books, the last two issues were a little too slight. I wish that at least they had been beefed up so we could see more action, like the rescue of Natasha Irons, more battles against the Kryptonians, etc. Issue #4 moved at too much of breakneck pace. I wish more pages could've been devoted to Supergirl v. Ursa and Non taking on the Justice League. Or Supergirl v. Superwoman, or more fights with Assassin and Guardian and Atlas and Steel. Also, Natasha getting some payback. That all would've been sweet.
It might be cruel of me, but I was hoping that Krypto would be the heroic sacrifice. I think his death would've had been more meaningful and poignant than the exile of Chris Kent. The solution to save him was just too handy.
I'm a little disappointed that General Lane killed himself. So Kara really couldn't have stopped that bullet? It would've been nice for Lane to have to pay for his crimes. And it would've left him around for future storylines.
Despite its flaws, I still enjoyed War of the Supermen. I thought it was better done than the main four Siege books, in comparison, with a more satisfying conclusion.
Question, what happened to Mon-El? Did he get sent back to the Phantom Zone in a separate book? I was wondering about his absence in Issue #4 and then I saw the scene with him and Chris Kent.
Overall, I thought the concept was of the mini was neat especially after the massive crossovers with Final Crisis, Blackest Night, and even the New Krypton arc in Superman's own books; which I guess this was the final chapter. But I thought maybe they could've thrown a couple of tie-ins to the main series to flesh out some of the side plots. A lot of cool stuff was rushed through or done off panel and I think that diminished the story, or at least my enjoyment of it.
Anyway, while I loved the relatively cheap price of the books, the last two issues were a little too slight. I wish that at least they had been beefed up so we could see more action, like the rescue of Natasha Irons, more battles against the Kryptonians, etc. Issue #4 moved at too much of breakneck pace. I wish more pages could've been devoted to Supergirl v. Ursa and Non taking on the Justice League. Or Supergirl v. Superwoman, or more fights with Assassin and Guardian and Atlas and Steel. Also, Natasha getting some payback. That all would've been sweet.
It might be cruel of me, but I was hoping that Krypto would be the heroic sacrifice. I think his death would've had been more meaningful and poignant than the exile of Chris Kent. The solution to save him was just too handy.
I'm a little disappointed that General Lane killed himself. So Kara really couldn't have stopped that bullet? It would've been nice for Lane to have to pay for his crimes. And it would've left him around for future storylines.
Despite its flaws, I still enjoyed War of the Supermen. I thought it was better done than the main four Siege books, in comparison, with a more satisfying conclusion.
Question, what happened to Mon-El? Did he get sent back to the Phantom Zone in a separate book? I was wondering about his absence in Issue #4 and then I saw the scene with him and Chris Kent.
Yeah not sure how Mon-El returned to the Phantom Zone and I'm sure we'll get some of these things dealt with in the post-War of the Supermen book. Could Kara have stopped the bullet if Sam's pistol was in his mouth? There's also the question about what will happen with Luthor after this since you know he helped to turn the Sun Red and all. Paul Cornell's storyline has him obsessing over the Orange Lantern power he obtained in Blackest Night along with some weird plot involving Lois.
I liked the series overall...it's too bad that Geoff wasn't able to finish this himself...for some reason I'd like to think his original pitch was different than what Robinson finished but who knows that's just my own fucked up theory. It's not like this could have resolved it's self in any other way. The way this was hyped though and structured i was expecting something more...and I agree Krypto sacrificing himself would have been a more fitting conclusion. The whole two or three year arc has seen a lot of death and sacrifice for Clark and company. I'll still be picking this up in Jan when it comes out and I look forward to seeing what JMS has planned starting in two months.
I liked the series overall...it's too bad that Geoff wasn't able to finish this himself...for some reason I'd like to think his original pitch was different than what Robinson finished but who knows that's just my own fucked up theory. It's not like this could have resolved it's self in any other way. The way this was hyped though and structured i was expecting something more...and I agree Krypto sacrificing himself would have been a more fitting conclusion. The whole two or three year arc has seen a lot of death and sacrifice for Clark and company. I'll still be picking this up in Jan when it comes out and I look forward to seeing what JMS has planned starting in two months.
The tale of Mon-El's return to the Phantom Zone was told in ADVENTURE COMICS #11
Why did it need reclaiming? DC has always had multiple character running around using the same name. Indeed, I think that Grayson was still Nightwing when Kent started using that name.
Plus Dick was originally inspired by the Kryptonian Nightwing in the first place...I just realized that.
Admiral Young,
I think Kara could've zapped Lane's hand or the gun, for example turning the gun so hot that he would have to drop it. Or she could've used super breath to freeze his hand or a gust of wind to blow him backward, if not flying over to him. There were different ways she could've done something to save him.
I was sort of thinking that maybe she held back on purpose. It would've been interesting to see Kara hold back, still vengeful, and Lois knowing she was holding back. Could've led to some interesting character interactions.
I think Kara could've zapped Lane's hand or the gun, for example turning the gun so hot that he would have to drop it. Or she could've used super breath to freeze his hand or a gust of wind to blow him backward, if not flying over to him. There were different ways she could've done something to save him.
I was sort of thinking that maybe she held back on purpose. It would've been interesting to see Kara hold back, still vengeful, and Lois knowing she was holding back. Could've led to some interesting character interactions.
I think it's pretty clear that Kara could have stopped him... I predict several issues of hand-wringing over it in the future! I'm sure they'll just say she was so emotionally exhausted she wasn't thinking clear or fast enough. But then she'll be doubting herself, wondering if she subconsciously wanted him to die for his actions.
I'm not thinking 4th Dimensionally as Doc Brown would say...excellent points on both accounts and for some reason (I'll chalk it up to tiredness) I didn't take into account Kara's other abilities. I was thinking that she'd use super speed and didn't think about her other abilities. Dur of course she'd stop that bullet. What a maroon I was..lol.
Speaking of Adventure Comics #11, I'm not quite sure I like or understand the whole, "The Phantom Zone is locked off to the 21st Century." To me it seems like a hand wave to explain why Lar can't return, except in the future (which is where he is meant to be, I understand). It would also lock off Zod, Ursa, Chris, etc., which will only last as long as someone doesn't want to use them. And of course, sooner or later, they'll return (well, maybe not Chris).
True, but if it's going to be a Kryptonian fighting Kal (and not another, Supergirl vs. Superman fight), then why not Zod? Wouldn't that be the fight that would garner attention from comic fans?
Rucka's run on Action gave us some interesting Kryptonian villains, but I think they were all dispatched, so no reoccurances, without resurrections or "I got better" exuses.
To do that, in my opinion, at least, would be similar to setting up another Billionaire who controls a vast majority of Metropolis to take on Superman because Lex Luthor was not available.
Speaking of that, it makes me think of Brainiac. I grew up with the telepathic Brainiac, which they seem to have gotten away from totally, but I think Superman needs a telepathic villain. Some of the most interesting villain battles, at least in concept, were because of the Post-Crisis, pre-Infinite Crisis Brianiac. And most of his battles are physical, so why not give him a new telepathic villain to have him fight another way?
Rucka's run on Action gave us some interesting Kryptonian villains, but I think they were all dispatched, so no reoccurances, without resurrections or "I got better" exuses.
To do that, in my opinion, at least, would be similar to setting up another Billionaire who controls a vast majority of Metropolis to take on Superman because Lex Luthor was not available.
Speaking of that, it makes me think of Brainiac. I grew up with the telepathic Brainiac, which they seem to have gotten away from totally, but I think Superman needs a telepathic villain. Some of the most interesting villain battles, at least in concept, were because of the Post-Crisis, pre-Infinite Crisis Brianiac. And most of his battles are physical, so why not give him a new telepathic villain to have him fight another way?
