Volcanic ash cloud cripples Britain, apparently...

[All Seeing Eye]

Over the last few days especially in England, due to the Icelandic volcano halting commercial flights at least, it has been rather nice weather wise. The skies have been clear with minimal if any cloud cover, the sun has been shining brightly and the temperatures have been pretty damn hot.

It is so nice in fact, this is the first time in months kids are screaming and playing in back gardens and in the nearby parks (at least near me).

Most people who have not been stuck indoors the last few days all seem uplifted, happier and seem to be more trouble free.

Anyone familiar with the chemtrail conspiracy will be aware that the idea is that planes are spraying chemicals into the atmosphere which creates cloud cover and crap weather. I don't know about anyone else but I sure as hell have noticed a difference since all the countries planes got grounded.

Haven't you?

 

[Zulu Romeo]

^^^ To be fair, it's been like that all week, way before any volcano blew its top.

 

[jmc247]

Global cooling: What happens if the Iceland volcano blows

The potential eruption of Iceland's volcano Katla would likely send the world, including the USA, into an extended deep freeze.

"When Katla went off in the 1700s, the USA suffered a very cold winter," says Gary Hufford, a scientist with the Alaska Region of the National Weather Service. "To the point, the Mississippi River froze just north of New Orleans and the East Coast, especially New England, had an extremely cold winter.

"Depending on a new eruption, Katla could cause some serious weather changes."

Eyjafjallajokull, the Icelandic volcano that has continued to belch lava, ash and steam since first erupting last weekend, isn't the direct problem. It's Katla, the noisier neighbor, that's the concern. If lava flowing from Eyjafjallajokull melts the glaciers that hold down the top of Katla, then Katla could blow its top, pumping gigantic amounts of ash into the atmosphere.

Scientists say history has proven that whenever the Eyjafjallajokull volcano erupts, Katla always follows -- the only question is how soon.

"If it (Eyjafjallajokull) continues to belch, then you worry," says Hufford.

What's key in having volcanic eruptions affect the weather is both the duration of the eruption, and how high the ash gets blasted into the stratosphere, according to Hufford.

For example, he says, Mount Pinatubo pumped ash for two days in 1991, and spewed it 70,000 feet into the stratosphere. This dropped temperatures worldwide about four degrees for about a year.

"When volcanic ash reaches the stratosphere, it remains for a long time," reports Hufford. "The ash becomes a very effective block of the incoming solar radiation, thus cooling the atmosphere's temperatures."...

The volcanic activity in the past day has increased a significant degree. If activity continues to increase and Katla goes up as well it could expand the ice sheet to levels not seen since the early 1800s or the so called mini Ice Age a few hundred years ago.

Many would be hit hard, especially in areas where food is hard to come by and they rely on local farming. However, it would give the global community time to greatly diminish its massive use of CO2 before there isn't an ice sheet left.

NASA researchers last year proposed a temp fix to the Global Warming problem to put up particulate matter that would reflect some of the suns light into space. Which we actually could do fairly cheaply (a few billion) according to them. Well, mother nature has its own way of cooling the Earth.

I live in VA and have seen records from papers at the time from the early 1800s. We now know what caused the global cooling that decade which led to snow during the summer in Northern VA. If significant and widespread global tectonic activity continues as it has this year its quite possible we can expect more such volcanic eruptions.

Personally, I hope in 20-30 years time the world decides use its knowhow to regulate global temperatures. We can do it right now, but I personally would like to see our computer models get alot better before we start tinkering with how much sunlight the Earth gets each year.

 

[iguana_tonante]

Well, the airspace over Germany will be closed until Sunday mornig 2 am CET at least, possibly until Sunday afternoon. However, various airports in Southern Europe are still open, e.g. Rome. So maybe her flight will get diverted and she could take the train from there.

The airspace above North Italy is closed as well, at least until this evening. Which means that my flight to Barcelona was canceled. Fuck Surtr and his fucking jötnar in Múspelheimr.

 

[Count Zero]

Sorry to hear that, iguana.

It'll be interesting to see how many state guests actually turn up at Kaczynski's funeral tomorrow in Krakow. Apparently, Obama still plans to fly in. Some have already cancelled their visit.

 

[Lindley]

Anyone familiar with the chemtrail conspiracy will be aware that the idea is that planes are spraying chemicals into the atmosphere which creates cloud cover and crap weather. I don't know about anyone else but I sure as hell have noticed a difference since all the countries planes got grounded.

That's stupid.

However, it's not impossible that contrails could have some minor effect on weather:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contrail#September_11.2C_2001_climate_impact_study

 

[John Picard]

Personally, I hope in 20-30 years time the world decides use its knowhow to regulate global temperatures. We can do it right now, but I personally would like to see our computer models get alot better before we start tinkering with how much sunlight the Earth gets each year.

Mankind cannot control the temperature of the Earth any more than it can the sun. The computer models are flawed as is the data being fed.

Do you think there's a thermostat switch somewhere that can be adjusted?

 

[Lindley]

I'm guessing this is the reason for the downtick of Fidelity's mutual funds today.....

 

[RoJoHen]

Personally, I hope in 20-30 years time the world decides use its knowhow to regulate global temperatures. We can do it right now, but I personally would like to see our computer models get alot better before we start tinkering with how much sunlight the Earth gets each year.

Mankind cannot control the temperature of the Earth any more than it can the sun. The computer models are flawed as is the data being fed.

Do you think there's a thermostat switch somewhere that can be adjusted?

I hear that scientists are working on creating a giant umbrella to cool the earth down in order to prevent global warming.

 

[Zulu Romeo]

Personally, I hope in 20-30 years time the world decides use its knowhow to regulate global temperatures. We can do it right now, but I personally would like to see our computer models get alot better before we start tinkering with how much sunlight the Earth gets each year.

Mankind cannot control the temperature of the Earth any more than it can the sun. The computer models are flawed as is the data being fed.

Do you think there's a thermostat switch somewhere that can be adjusted?

I hear that scientists are working on creating a giant umbrella to cool the earth down in order to prevent global warming.

"Since the dawn of time, Man has yearned to destroy the Sun..."

 

[jmc247]

Mankind cannot control the temperature of the Earth any more than it can the sun. The computer models are flawed as is the data being fed.

Do you think there's a thermostat switch somewhere that can be adjusted?

If you believe that you have zero understanding of science. The fact of the matter is since the 1950s and 60s we could lower Earth's temp greatly simply by exploding a few gigatons in the desert. The resulting dust thrown up would act just as some of these super volcanoes have in the past. In fact if we ever did get into an all out nuclear war with Russia in the 70s or 80s you would have seen the level of dust and other shit kick up that it would have blocked the sun in a similar fashion to what would occur if an astroid hit Earth and caused decades of a global ice age.

That said there are better and far safer ways of using particles to reflect sun light then blasting off nukes.

 

[jmc247]

By the way Geoengineering (not using nukes) isn't pie in the sky 23rd century crazy talk. Its something seriously being studied and looked, but like I said before I would only support it when the computer models are good enough to know to a much greater degrees of accuracy about how man artifically doing what volcanoes do naturally would impact the globe.

"Geoengineering" To Fight Global Warming?

AP) Tinkering with Earth's climate to chill runaway global warming - a radical idea once dismissed out of hand - is being discussed by the White House as a potential emergency option, the president's new science adviser said Wednesday.

The concept of using technology to purposely cool the climate is called geoengineering. One option raised by Holdren and proposed by a Nobel Prize-winning scientist includes shooting pollution particles into the upper atmosphere to reflect the sun's rays.

"We're talking about all these issues in the White House," Holdren said. "There's a very vigorous process going on of discussing all the options for addressing the energy climate challenge." Holdren said discussions include Cabinet officials and heads of sub-Cabinet level agencies, such as NASA and the Environmental Protection Agency.

The 65-year-old physicist is far from alone in taking geoengineering seriously. The National Academy of Sciences is making it the subject of the first workshop in its new climate challenges program for policymakers, scientists and the public. The British Parliament has also discussed the idea. At an international meeting of climate scientists last month in Copenhagen, 15 talks dealt with different aspects of geoengineering.

The American Meteorological Society is crafting a policy statement that says "it is prudent to consider geoengineering's potential, to understand its limits and to avoid rash deployment." Last week, Princeton scientist Robert Socolow told the National Academy that geoengineering should be an available option in case climate worsens dramatically.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/04/08/tech/main4930539.shtml

 

[cultcross]

Over the last few days especially in England, due to the Icelandic volcano halting commercial flights at least, it has been rather nice weather wise. The skies have been clear with minimal if any cloud cover, the sun has been shining brightly and the temperatures have been pretty damn hot.

It is so nice in fact, this is the first time in months kids are screaming and playing in back gardens and in the nearby parks (at least near me).

Most people who have not been stuck indoors the last few days all seem uplifted, happier and seem to be more trouble free.

Anyone familiar with the chemtrail conspiracy will be aware that the idea is that planes are spraying chemicals into the atmosphere which creates cloud cover and crap weather. I don't know about anyone else but I sure as hell have noticed a difference since all the countries planes got grounded.

Haven't you?

Let's call this new period of warmer weather "spring".

 

[RoJoHen]

^

 

[jmc247]

Over the last few days especially in England, due to the Icelandic volcano halting commercial flights at least, it has been rather nice weather wise. The skies have been clear with minimal if any cloud cover, the sun has been shining brightly and the temperatures have been pretty damn hot.

It is so nice in fact, this is the first time in months kids are screaming and playing in back gardens and in the nearby parks (at least near me).

Most people who have not been stuck indoors the last few days all seem uplifted, happier and seem to be more trouble free.

Anyone familiar with the chemtrail conspiracy will be aware that the idea is that planes are spraying chemicals into the atmosphere which creates cloud cover and crap weather. I don't know about anyone else but I sure as hell have noticed a difference since all the countries planes got grounded.

Haven't you?

Let's call this new period of warmer weather "spring".

good one.

 

[jmc247]

By the way much of both Europe the United States as I am sure people here know had a very very bad winter. We had the worst winter in recorded history here in my area in VA and the same was try many other places in the U.S. that either had the worst or one of the worst winters in decades.

That alone led to the ice sheet growing larger then in recient recorded history as well as the latest start in Arctic Sea melting on record.

NSIDC: Arctic Sea Ice Melt Season – latest start on record

Arctic sea ice reached its maximum extent for the year on March 31 at 15.25 million square kilometers (5.89 million square miles). This was the latest date for the maximum Arctic sea ice extent since the start of the satellite record in 1979.

Early in March, Arctic sea ice appeared to reach a maximum extent. However, after a short decline, the ice continued to grow. By the end of March, total extent approached 1979 to 2000 average levels for this time of year. The late-season growth was driven mainly by cold weather and winds from the north over the Bering and Barents Seas.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/04/07/nsidc-arctic-sea-ice-melt-season-latest-start-on-record/

The current volcano that is erupting could go on for weeks, months, even years and if it manages to trigger Katla as it has in the past then the world is looking at several winters that makes the winter of 2009-2010 seem tame.

Iceland’s volcano could go on for years, and it`s growing

“The extent is greater than we’ve ever seen before in the EU,” said Brian Flynn, deputy head of operations at Eurocontrol, the European air traffic control organization. “The meteorological situation is such that the volcanic ash is progressing very slowly eastwards but there is not a lot of wind so it is very slow and very dense.” ‘All we can do, is to wait and see’.

By Thursday afternoon, the UK had shut its airspace and other countries were in the process of following suit. We can actually smell sulfur in the air here now from the volcano cloud said Tim Farish, Oslo. “Volcanic ash represents a significant safety threat to all aircrafts,” said the UK’s Air Traffic Control Service (Nats).

Scientists say history has proven that when the Eyjafjallajokull volcano erupts, Katla follows the only question is how soon. And Katla, located under the massive Myrdalsjokull icecap, threatens disastrous flooding and explosive blasts when it blows.

Iceland’s Laki volcano erupted in 1783, freeing gases that turned into smog. The smog floated across the Jet Stream, changing weather patterns. Many died from gas poisoning in the British Isles. Crop production fell in western Europe. Famine spread. Some even linked the eruption, which helped fuel famine, to the French Revolution. Painters in the 18th century illustrated fiery sunsets in their works.

The winter of 1784 was also one of the longest and coldest on record in North America. New England reported a record stretch of below-zero temperatures and New Jersey reported record snow accumulation. The Mississippi River also reportedly froze in New Orleans.

http://reinep.wordpress.com/2010/04/17/icelands-volcano-could-go-on-for-years-and-its-growing/

 

[Zulu Romeo]

Let's call this new period of warmer weather "spring".

That made my whole season.

 

[jmc247]

A brief history of the effect of massive volcanic eruptions on global climate.

A paper written by Benjamin Franklin in 1783 blamed the unusually cool summer of 1783 on volcanic dust coming from Iceland, where the eruption of Laki volcano had released enormous amounts of sulfur dioxide, resulting in the death of much of the island's livestock and a catastrophic famine which killed a quarter of the population. Temperatures in the northern hemisphere dropped by about 1 °C in the year following the Laki eruption.

The 1815 eruption of Mount Tambora, a stratovolcano in Indonesia, occasioned mid-summer frosts in New York State and June snowfalls in New England and Newfoundland and Labrador in what came to be known as the "Year Without a Summer" of 1816.

In 1883, the explosion of Krakatoa (Krakatau) also created volcanic winter-like conditions. The next four years after the explosion were unusually cold, and the winter of 1888 was the first time snow fell in the area[where?]. Record snowfalls were recorded worldwide.

Most recently, the 1991 explosion of Mount Pinatubo, another stratovolcano in the Philippines, cooled global temperatures for about 2–3 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcanic_winter

As of right now the current cloud of ash isn't much of an issue in terms of the global temperature. However, volcanoes are notoriously unpredictable. This one could just die out or continue to build and last for months or years The last time this one went up it continued for over a year and as history has shown this volcano can and has triggered Katla which could make the current Eyjafjallajokull eruption seems tiny in comparison.

If that happens we are talking about the potental for global cooling for a few years. But, given history temperatures always bounce back. How fast of course depends on how big and how long the eruption goes. But, even with super eruptions the cold spell usually lasts at most a few years. Its a far worse situation if we are talking about a decient sized asteroid impact which could cause a global freeze lasting decades.

 

[John Picard]

Mankind cannot control the temperature of the Earth any more than it can the sun. The computer models are flawed as is the data being fed.

Do you think there's a thermostat switch somewhere that can be adjusted?

If you believe that you have zero understanding of science. The fact of the matter is since the 1950s and 60s we could lower Earth's temp greatly simply by exploding a few gigatons in the desert. The resulting dust thrown up would act just as some of these super volcanoes have in the past. In fact if we ever did get into an all out nuclear war with Russia in the 70s or 80s you would have seen the level of dust and other shit kick up that it would have blocked the sun in a similar fashion to what would occur if an astroid hit Earth and caused decades of a global ice age.

That said there are better and far safer ways of using particles to reflect sun light then blasting off nukes.

Thanks for the laugh. Go back a few pages when I refer to Mount St Helens and the ash-effect from it was said to be akin to "Nuclear Winter" -- something we were all made fearful of during the Cold War.

Yeah, that turned into a big nothing

Try learning something rather than reading the ramblings and rantings of every kook who has access to Teh InterWebs Thingy.

 

[jmc247]

Thanks for the laugh. Go back a few pages when I refer to Mount St Helens and the ash-effect from it was said to be akin to "Nuclear Winter" -- something we were all made fearful of during the Cold War.

Yeah, that turned into a big nothing

Try learning something rather than reading the ramblings and rantings of every kook who has access to Teh InterWebs Thingy.

The recient Mount St. Helens eruption was tiny in comparison to the two Mount St. Helens eruptions a few hundred years back and even those eruptions were tiny compared to the 1812 Mount Tambora eruption, Krakatoa going up in 1883, or more reciently the Mount Pinatubo erupting which cooled temperatures for about 3 years.

Its the size of the eruption that counts as well as how much matter it sends into the atmosphere and what level of the atmosphere the dust, ash, sulfur, etc manages to fall into.

Its a very simple formula that even grade schools students I have talked to understand. If there are tons and tons of particulate matter dumped into in the atmosphere blocking the suns light from getting to Earth then the Earth gets cooler. The less light that manages to reach the Earth's surface the cooler the Earth becomes.

The complex question that only experts can measure is the level of particulate matter in the atmosphere that is required to make a real difference in terms of global temps.