Unused Musical Cues in Trek Movies

[Maurice]

There was a discussion here recently about soundtracks and unreleased or unused cues to the movies. I have some expanded scores, and when I have time I may edit such unused cues to the scenes they were written for.

I did just that today. If you'll click on the following link to a video on YouTube which mates an unused cue to its scene in TMP, you'll be able to see one.

In this clip the indicated section featured no music in the final film.

I believe this music was arranged by Alexander Courage, using his own original Star Trek TV theme, and then using Jerry Goldsmith's motion picture themes.

I apologize for the odball aspect ratio of the film. When I output that scene something went a little wonky.

 

[Basill]

Wow. That was interesting. Sounds pretty choppy with the dialog and effects still in place. Parts of it sound very similar to the first warp attempt, especially during the "jump to" phase. But the percussion in that "ramp up the engines to warp 7" portion are definitely nothing I've ever heard. Thanks. I'd look forward to hearing that outside of the film's full sound venue.

 

[Maurice]

Well, I did my best to make a crude sound mix...but without access to the different channels (dialogue, effects, etc.), it's hard to make it an "accurate" representation of how it would sound.

The full cue I have starts off with the TOS Captain's log theme, then goes to the Warp 1 attempt (up to the wormhole), then finishes with this final Warp 7 piece.

 

[Basill]

Well, that certainly sounds delicious.

 

[Data Holmes]

DS9Sega said:
Well, I did my best to make a crude sound mix...but without access to the different channels (dialogue, effects, etc.), it's hard to make it an "accurate" representation of how it would sound.

The full cue I have starts off with the TOS Captain's log theme, then goes to the Warp 1 attempt (up to the wormhole), then finishes with this final Warp 7 piece.

What's the track name, where did you find it... PM it to avoid the mods.

 

[Nebusj]

Oh ... I thought this was going to be about cues they didn't use but could have, like for example in Nemesis where Picard tries the self-destruct only to find it's not there, and they play that disappointing riff used on The Price is Right when the Showcase ends with a double-overbid.

 

[Maurice]

Nebusj, this *was* a cue they didn't use but could have. I don't follow your comment.

 

[Indysolo]

Nice job, now you need to tackle the end of "Kirk's Explosive Reply" and "Crash - Whale Fugue".

Neil

 

[Maurice]

What bit of "Kirk's Explosive Reply"? Just that big crash where they show the damaged Enterprise?

 

[Indysolo]

Yes.

Neil

 

[Nebusj]

DS9Sega said:
Nebusj, this *was* a cue they didn't use but could have. I don't follow your comment.

It was a joke that didn't work out. I'm sorry.

 

[Maurice]

Humor. It is a difficult concept. It is not logical.

 

[RyanKCR]

DS9Sega said:
Humor. It is a difficult concept. It is not logical.

We learn by doing.....


Anyway I like how you put that together with the video. And as for the end of Kirk's explosive reply it the "crash" of music was supposed to be when showing the scar on the ship I don't think it would work. It needed that quiet to really sell the scene.

 

[Data Holmes]

I'm confused about what, exactly, is going on in this thread???

 

[Maurice]

hutt359 said:What's the track name, where did you find it... PM it to avoid the mods.

Ok, I dug out my copy of The Music of Star Trek by Jeff Bond and I checked the cue sheets for ST:TMP.

The recording I have that was used for the video example is actually three separate cues. In the order they appear in the file clip I have, they are:

Cue: Theme from Star Trek (TV series)
Composer: Alexander Courage
Time: 0:35
Visual Cues: From cut to long shot of Enterprise in space after Kirk welcomes Spock aboard. Until Cut to Sulu saying "Warp Point Eight".

Cue: Warp Point Eight
Composer: Jerry Goldsmith
Time: 0:23
Visual Cues: After Sulu says "Accelerating to warp one, sir," Until shot of wormhole distortion on viewscreen.

Cue: Warp Point Nine
Composer: Jerry Goldsmith
Time: 0:21
Visual Cues: After Sulu announces, "Warp Six." Until Spock says "Science officer Spock, reporting as ordered Captain."

This is all accurate to the file I have, except for the "Warp Point Nine" cue, which is is 40 seconds longer. The first 40 seconds being the bit that was cut.


Now, as to the question of authorship...

According to Bond, Sandy Courage did the Captain's log cues, and "Star Trek veteran, Fred Steiner, worked on several key sequences, including two scenes of the Enterprise attaining warp drive and the ship's initial contact with V'ger" [cue: Meet V'ger]. However, he goes on to add "Although Steiner's job has been described as ghostwriting, he later described his job duties as more along the lines of changing timings and orchestrating than actually generating material." This seems accurate, given that the cues feature mostly Goldsmith's themes, figures and motifs.


I would therefore say the full (unreleased) Warp Point Nine cue (as appeared in the video) is more accurately described thusly:

Cue: Warp Point Nine
Composer: Jerry Goldsmith
Arrangement/Orchestration: Fred Steiner
Time: 1:03
Visual Cues: As Sulu announces, "Warp point eight." Until Spock says "Science officer Spock, reporting as ordered Captain."

 

[Data Holmes]

DS9Sega said:

hutt359 said:What's the track name, where did you find it... PM it to avoid the mods.

Ok, I dug out my copy of The Music of Star Trek by Jeff Bond and I checked the cue sheets for ST:TMP.

The recording I have that was used for the video example is actually three separate cues. In the order they appear in the file clip I have, they are:

Cue: Theme from Star Trek (TV series)
Composer: Alexander Courage
Time: 0:35
Visual Cues: From cut to long shot of Enterprise in space after Kirk welcomes Spock aboard. Until Cut to Sulu saying "Warp Point Eight".

Cue: Warp Point Eight
Composer: Jerry Goldsmith
Time: 0:23
Visual Cues: After Sulu says "Accelerating to warp one, sir," Until shot of wormhole distortion on viewscreen.

Cue: Warp Point Nine
Composer: Jerry Goldsmith
Time: 0:21
Visual Cues: After Sulu announces, "Warp Six." Until Spock says "Science officer Spock, reporting as ordered Captain."

This is all accurate to the file I have, except for the "Warp Point Nine" cue, which is is 40 seconds longer. The first 40 seconds being the bit that was cut.


Now, as to the question of authorship...

According to Bond, Sandy Courage did the Captain's log cues, and "Star Trek veteran, Fred Steiner, worked on several key sequences, including two scenes of the Enterprise attaining warp drive and the ship's initial contact with V'ger" [cue: Meet V'ger]. However, he goes on to add "Although Steiner's job has been described as ghostwriting, he later described his job duties as more along the lines of changing timings and orchestrating than actually generating material." This seems accurate, given that the cues feature mostly Goldsmith's themes, figures and motifs.


I would therefore say the full (unreleased) Warp Point Nine cue (as appeared in the video) is more accurately described thusly:

Cue: Warp Point Nine
Composer: Jerry Goldsmith
Arrangement/Orchestration: Fred Steiner
Time: 1:03
Visual Cues: As Sulu announces, "Warp point eight." Until Spock says "Science officer Spock, reporting as ordered Captain."

Cool. :thumbsup:


Any chance you could do it again, with just the visual and music, dropping the dialog and sound effects? Sort of like a silent film.

 

[Basill]

Yeah, that would be cool for comparison.

 

[Maurice]

Hey everyone.

Due to numerous requests, I've rebuilt the video containing the unused segment of the "Warp Point Nine" cue so that it now includes one pass of the footage with dialogue and sound effects, and then repeats the relevant footage with only the music, so you can hear it better.

Click here to play the updated video of the TMP "Warp Point Nine" cue.

I also updated the title cards for the clip to properly identify the composer (Goldsmith) and arranged (Steiner).

Again, I apologize for the odball aspect ratio of the film. When I output that scene something went a little wonky.

Enjoy!

P.S. I'm going to delete the old video from YouTube since this one is better and more accurate.

 

[Data Holmes]

I find that I like the clip much better with the music included....


Any clue why they removed it from the scene?

 

[Basill]

I find that I prefer the scene as is. The lack of music in this instance provides the right tension for the slow rev up to warp seven and then that climactic crescendo as she breaks the "warp seven" barrier (which is clearly part of this same cue) is the perfect touch. Besides I think the sound effects of the warp engines themselves fills in nicely for the music. Its part of the tension, especially since part of the piece is already used a few minutes earlier in the film.

Now don't get me wrong, I would much prefer to have heard the music than to have never experienced it. I really like it (I mean... its J. Goldsmith, how can I not?) This is just one of those cases where I think, just because you have it doesn't mean it's necessary or even helpful. If anything just having the option of viewing the scene with or without it is a joy in itself. Certainly makes me appreciate the art of film making more. It sure wouldn't stop me from wanting to get my hands on a copy. I've certainly learned to love the alternate cues I do have.