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Unreplicatable or "certified replicant" items

Laura Cynthia Chambers

Vice Admiral
Admiral
The post over on the DS9 page regarding O'Brien's choice of whiskey briefly touched on the idea of still having unique items in a world where replication was easy and common.

If someone wanted to make a single or limited number of unique items, could there be a way to either make them unreplicatable, or give the replicated version a signature that identified it as not being an original?

Like radiating it with a beam/exposing it to a chemical that would block replication, or adding a unique, invisible to the naked eye molecular tag that identified the item as a mere copy of the original, a reproduction.

If a person was exposed to it, they couldn't be transported, even if they wanted to be, as they wouldn't be able to be disassembled or recreated.
 
The post over on the DS9 page regarding O'Brien's choice of whiskey briefly touched on the idea of still having unique items in a world where replication was easy and common.

If someone wanted to make a single or limited number of unique items, could there be a way to either make them unreplicatable, or give the replicated version a signature that identified it as not being an original?
To my knowledge, it should be possible to replicate it outside of a few certain expections.

Like radiating it with a beam/exposing it to a chemical that would block replication, or adding a unique, invisible to the naked eye molecular tag that identified the item as a mere copy of the original, a reproduction.

If a person was exposed to it, they couldn't be transported, even if they wanted to be, as they wouldn't be able to be disassembled or recreated.
Nope, not possible. Any of those things that blocks scans are usually temporary and can be defeated easily enough through a myriad of methods.

There's only a few items in Star Trek that are stated to be Non-Replicatable.

1) Latinum, that's why it's used for Physical Currency since it can't be replicated. Even into the 32nd century, it's still being used as a form of currency due to that property.

2) Living Cells can't be replicated. As shown in the ST:ENT episode "Dead Stop". You can copy a persons body down to the atomic level with a advanced replicator, but you can't create basic cellular life.

Transporting objects (via Transporters) vs Replicating it are different things and most things can be Transported once you get past any interference that blocks a Transporter Signal.

3) Neutronium shouldn't be easily replicatable. That probably has to be manufactured the old fashioned way.

4) Anti-Matter shouldn't be easily replicatable. That definitely has to be manufactured the old fashioned way.
 
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Okay, but not being able to be reproduced/de/rematerialized. Perhaps it may not even be scannable. So you have to use old fashioned methods to analyze something's chemical /physical make-up.
 
Okay, but not being able to be reproduced/de/rematerialized. Perhaps it may not even be scannable. So you have to use old fashioned methods to analyze something's chemical /physical make-up.
Outside of that one species that couldn't be scanned in ST:VOY, I can't think of many things that can't be scanned.

Almost everything can be scanned using typical scanners.

How detailed you want to get, that depends on the equipment you have access to at that moment.
 
Data comments in "The Defector" that the Enterprise replicators can't readily create Romulan ale, because they lack the molecular blueprint for it. And Vreenak commented on the replicated beverage in "In the Pale Moonlight" as being not quite up to the real thing, albeit a good replica. According to MA, the limitations on replicas are typically a combination between the complexity of the recipe (certain things are more difficult to replicate because of their structure) and the size of the unit (runabout replicators have much smaller menus than the ones on DS9). Presumably, such limitations could change in accordance with newer models and more sophisticated patterns.

It would seem that individual patterns and recipes vary quite a lot, at least per plot reasons. Not unlike how restaurants in the same chain can produce a significant variance in quality sometimes.

I think also there's the argument that while replicators are convenient in many ways, they're not necessarily something everyone would want to replace "old fashioned" methods. This came up in "Family" when Robert Picard hated using them. It's kind of like how the current debate over AI art is dealing with systems that are arguably crude, but which might one day be able to produce more consistently advanced results and seem like a viable tool that could "replace" traditional artists. I think we're quite a ways from that threshold myself presently, but I do understand that concern in the art community. We do already have some modern art tools, such as Photoshop, that allow users to create a variety of advanced effects that would previously have required more skill and specialized equipment to make.
 
Dilithium can't be replicated either, although it can be 'recrystallised' by the 24th century.

There is some 'beta cannon' material about why Dilithium can't be replicated - from the TOS novel 'Prime Directive' from storied Trek writer couple the Reeves-Stevenses, which explains that to the untrained eye, Dilithium is just Quartz, but that some Quartz is special and has 4th dimensional properties, which makes it Dilithium:
After the initial discovery of dilithium, it was discovered that 2-3% of the quartz on Earth was actually dilithium. This was previously undiscovered because it is difficult to discover the mineral's distinguishing feature -- its extension into the fourth dimension -- through conventional testing. This discovery prompted a gold rush, as many museums dug through their collections and found samples of dilithium.

My personal theory is that Latinum is probably similar.

We know it's a silver liquid metal, so it's probably Gallium that extends into the 4th dimension. It's not useful for energy generation like Dilithium is, as it lacks the crystalline structure, but still, any attempt to replicate it would just produce Gallium, just as any attempt to replicate Dilithium would produce Quartz.
 
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Or "worthless gold!"

Hollow gold bricks of different sizes are used to hold Latinium liquid in the 24th century. We get to see Latinum's liquid form when Morn reveals he's been keeping it in his second stomach in the ep 'Who Mourns for Morn?'.

This actually makes sense I think, as gallium destroys steel and aluminium and many other metals, but gold is very stable and unreactive - I'm not 100% sure but I have a feeling that it might be ok storing gallium if airtight.
 
The post over on the DS9 page regarding O'Brien's choice of whiskey briefly touched on the idea of still having unique items in a world where replication was easy and common.

If someone wanted to make a single or limited number of unique items, could there be a way to either make them unreplicatable, or give the replicated version a signature that identified it as not being an original?

Like radiating it with a beam/exposing it to a chemical that would block replication, or adding a unique, invisible to the naked eye molecular tag that identified the item as a mere copy of the original, a reproduction.

If a person was exposed to it, they couldn't be transported, even if they wanted to be, as they wouldn't be able to be disassembled or recreated.

Any marker you can add to an item that can be replicated could be edited to remove the marker. From what has been shown in the series you can use the transporter on almost everything that cannot be replicated but not the other way around.

This is probably because they only have technology for short-term, complex-data read-once memory storage that are used in transporter buffers and long-term, lower-complexity data read-many memory for computers and replicators. Replicators apparently lack the technology to store complex objects like people or even ribosomes ("The Enemy").

You could build something more like a copier (think "Second Chances") for an "unreplicatable" object but it would probably use so much energy to create the copy and keep the pattern refreshed that the expense is really to just maintain security to protect the original item so it can be copied again. IMHO...
 
In regards to what can be replicated or not... the area is somewhat murky, but technically speaking there shouldn't be any real limits to what you can replicate.

We have no direct canonical evidence which says you can't replicate Latinum.
Like anything else, it has a molecular structure that can be identified and processed (otherwise how else would you have enough of it for various species to use it as physical currency?).
I doubt latinum naturally occurs as bars.

While its possible that there is enough latinum out there to make everyone rich, its also quite likely that extraction and modification are tightly regulated by various organisations/species.

We know the Ferengi use Latinum as physical currency, along with some other societies which still have a monetary based economy (unlike the Federation).

The UFP might also use it when engaging in active commerce with other species, but mostly for the sake of establishing and maintaining good relations with those species that use monetary based economies - otherwise, I cannot really think that the UFP would 'need' a resource that cannot be found in UFP space or a synthetic substitute couldn't be devised (but Trek writers do have a tendency to ignore this readily so they will probably write in limitations for the sake of having limitations).

At any rate, as long as you can scan/analyse something to a sufficient degree (and we have evidence that UFP sensors do scan down to the subatomic), there should be no limit to what you could replicate.
The main limiting factor will in effect be energy required for replication since most UFP replicators use energy to matter conversion (but are capable and frequently use matter to energy then back to batter conversion process).

In regards to replicating actual live cells... yes, that was a limitation established for the fully automated replication facility in ST: ENT... but that was also in the mid 22nd century.
There is no in-universe limit which says you cannot replicate fully live cells.

The replicator pattern buffers could have easily been programmed to store live cells (which could be put there by people) in energy form. Maintaining cohesion on simple cells in the pattern buffer should be infinitely easier and virtually non-taxing on the buffers.

Plus, if they can replicate eyes and organs to replace them (which is doable), then I don't see an issue.

A bio printer today can print organs using stem-cells, etc.
And while yes, those are taken from actual live people in the first place... a cell isn't that complex. Plus, it needs chemical energy to be live and do its job (which is what mitochondria do).
Just infuse it with the necessary amount of said chemical energy that's native to that cell during the replication process and that should solve the problem.

Or, just store a copious amount of stem-cells into a pattern buffer, and if you need more, just have them proliferate in necessary amounts by adding some needed matter/medium for the process to occur and then re-store it back into the pattern buffer.

Also, the premise that nothing has improved since the 24th century in terms of replication ability, etc... is utterly moronic/ridiculous.

In regards to anti-matter being non-replicable... eh I take issues with that.
If processes exist to create anti-matter via synthetic means on a large scale to be used as a power source on starships, then like any other manufacturing method, this should be possible to make replicable.

Torpedoes and warp cores were safely transported from one location to the next after all.
Obviously, there wouldn't be a point on replicating it if you wanted to generate anti-matter from energy alone on a starship (using the Warp core because it would just take same amount of anti-matter in that case with some possible inefficiencies in place of a few % that may increase energy consumption in that case resulting in a net loss of anti-matter produced)... but, in that case (and for creation of similar highly energetic substances), you could technically use matter to energy (to reform it into desirable structure in the matter stream) and back to matter or anti-matter conversion process instead just for the sake of speeding up production if anything else).

Anti-matter is after all comprised of same elements that comprise regular matter, its just that the electric charge and magnetic moment are opposite in sign - and since anti-matter can be safely contained in a forcefield, I mean creating such a 'protective environment' as you generate anti-matter should be doable.

If you can transport it (which it was demonstrated they can), then it can be replicated (the only difference is you won't be able to use anti-matter to replicate anti-matter because you'd likely end up with a net loss of anti-matter produced [or exactly the same amount of it]... for that (direct energy to matter, or anti-matter conversion process), you'd probably need an energy source that surpasses anti-matter such as for example Omega Molecule, Thermionic generators, or Tetryon reactors (or just use the massive energy output of a Sun in a star system where you have a replication system which can store a lot of that solar energy and replicate massive amounts of anti-matter).
 
Wow...you've put a lot of thought into this. :techman:

Perhaps the limitation is a legal one. Probably it's illegal to reproduce specific items and pass them off as originals to someone for monetary profit, just as it is today. Some civilizations might not care if you copy something, as long as you mark the item in some way, certifying it's only a copy; some kind of tag on the back, or serial number.

I thought it'd be an interesting story aspect that there's an individual whose body is filled with something synthetic, or some medical condition that means they can't be transported, whether that's at all, easily/quickly, or without error. So rescuing them from a sticky situation is hard, or if they do beam down, they have a medical note on their file cautioning that only in emergencies should they be beamed.

Of course, if you can build a hologram a mobile emitter, you can probably build an untransportable person a transport matter enhancer that, or alter the transporter's settings to accommodate them. And it might get annoying fast if Ensign Schmoogle always has to go the long way.
 
Dilithium can't be replicated either, although it can be 'recrystallised' by the 24th century.
You're right, how can I have forgotten about that one.

In regards to what can be replicated or not... the area is somewhat murky, but technically speaking there shouldn't be any real limits to what you can replicate.
From what I can tell, certain objects aren't replicatable, otherwise it would be very common and not considered special.

If Neutronium was "Replicatable", everybody would have it and current Phasers/Disruptors would be obsolete. But they aren't, for obvious reasons.

The fact that most objects are replicatable is "Good Enough" for a very comfortable society for everybody to live in.

We have no direct canonical evidence which says you can't replicate Latinum.
Like anything else, it has a molecular structure that can be identified and processed (otherwise how else would you have enough of it for various species to use it as physical currency?).
I doubt latinum naturally occurs as bars.
Latinum seems to naturally occur as a silvery liquid metal.
But the point of using Gold bars or Parallelpipeds are to contain said liquid since Jadzia mentioned that people were sick & tired of doing basic financial transactions with liquid droppers. It's just too inconvenient.

While its possible that there is enough latinum out there to make everyone rich, its also quite likely that extraction and modification are tightly regulated by various organisations/species.
It wouldn't make sense if it was just something you can mine, it would need to be highly regulated by government to use as a form of currency to have real value.

We know the Ferengi use Latinum as physical currency, along with some other societies which still have a monetary based economy (unlike the Federation).
UFP still has the Federation Credits when dealing with other entities, and we don't know much about how they work on the inside since no normal portrayals of daily life is shown in most shows.

The UFP might also use it when engaging in active commerce with other species, but mostly for the sake of establishing and maintaining good relations with those species that use monetary based economies - otherwise, I cannot really think that the UFP would 'need' a resource that cannot be found in UFP space or a synthetic substitute couldn't be devised (but Trek writers do have a tendency to ignore this readily so they will probably write in limitations for the sake of having limitations).
I'm sure that the UFP, like most governments, holds currency of multiple nations just incase they need to do business with them.

At any rate, as long as you can scan/analyse something to a sufficient degree (and we have evidence that UFP sensors do scan down to the subatomic), there should be no limit to what you could replicate.
The main limiting factor will in effect be energy required for replication since most UFP replicators use energy to matter conversion (but are capable and frequently use matter to energy then back to batter conversion process).
For Transporters it's more of a Matter to Energy Phasing and not strict pure energy conversion since it's too energy intensive. Same with replicators, they use stock material and assemble it, not pure energy conversion. That's too energy wasteful and intensive compared to assembling from pre-existing raw material stocks. Go read the TNG Technical Manual if you want to see how replicators were designed.

In regards to replicating actual live cells... yes, that was a limitation established for the fully automated replication facility in ST: ENT... but that was also in the mid 22nd century.
There is no in-universe limit which says you cannot replicate fully live cells.
Yet we don't see it happen on the regular, that should be evidence enough, otherwise they would replicate any missing living cells they needed.

The replicator pattern buffers could have easily been programmed to store live cells (which could be put there by people) in energy form. Maintaining cohesion on simple cells in the pattern buffer should be infinitely easier and virtually non-taxing on the buffers.

Plus, if they can replicate eyes and organs to replace them (which is doable), then I don't see an issue.
They have Genitronic Replicators, but those are just advanced forms of growing Living Cells and organs in a quick fashion. It's not the super speedy Replicators for in-animate objects that we know & love that can spit out whatever you want in a split second. It takes hours or days to grow the Living Organ necessary. But that's still incredibly good compared to anything we have now.

According to Memory Beta, the Vidiians have more advanced Genetronic Replicators, that's why they were able to split B'Elanna Torres into her Human & Klingon halves. That in itself is a amazing feet of technology.

A bio printer today can print organs using stem-cells, etc.
And while yes, those are taken from actual live people in the first place... a cell isn't that complex. Plus, it needs chemical energy to be live and do its job (which is what mitochondria do).
Just infuse it with the necessary amount of said chemical energy that's native to that cell during the replication process and that should solve the problem.
That should be fine, but that should take hours or days to complete, not a split second.

Or, just store a copious amount of stem-cells into a pattern buffer, and if you need more, just have them proliferate in necessary amounts by adding some needed matter/medium for the process to occur and then re-store it back into the pattern buffer.
I don't think that's how pattern buffers work.

Also, the premise that nothing has improved since the 24th century in terms of replication ability, etc... is utterly moronic/ridiculous.
But there should be proper limits.

In regards to anti-matter being non-replicable... eh I take issues with that.
If processes exist to create anti-matter via synthetic means on a large scale to be used as a power source on starships, then like any other manufacturing method, this should be possible to make replicable.
Why would you say that? Otherwise power generation would become trivial, and we know it's not IRL or in the creation of IRL Anti-Matter. It takes ALOT of energy to make just a tiny amount of Anti-Matter. Just because the 24th century can mass produce Anti-Matter to power many fleets of StarShip to the point where it's like modern day Petroleum, doesn't mean it's a cheap process that it can be considered trivial that you would be able to replicate it at the press of a button.

Torpedoes and warp cores were safely transported from one location to the next after all.
Obviously, there wouldn't be a point on replicating it if you wanted to generate anti-matter from energy alone on a starship (using the Warp core because it would just take same amount of anti-matter in that case with some possible inefficiencies in place of a few % that may increase energy consumption in that case resulting in a net loss of anti-matter produced)... but, in that case (and for creation of similar highly energetic substances), you could technically use matter to energy (to reform it into desirable structure in the matter stream) and back to matter or anti-matter conversion process instead just for the sake of speeding up production if anything else).
Moving something from point A to B is different for manufacturing it.
There's a reason that you don't use pure Energy to Matter and Matter to Energy, it's VERY energy intensive compared to assembling an object from bare raw materials via the current replicator methods. I don't understand your obsession with using more wasteful methods of Replication. It's stated in the TNG technical manual that they don't use that method, not because they can't, but because it's energy intensive and inefficient use of existing energy.

Anti-matter is after all comprised of same elements that comprise regular matter, its just that the electric charge and magnetic moment are opposite in sign - and since anti-matter can be safely contained in a forcefield, I mean creating such a 'protective environment' as you generate anti-matter should be doable.
It also needs to sit in a force field and not interact with regular matter.
Ergo it's not practical for much use other than M/A-M reaction.

If you can transport it (which it was demonstrated they can), then it can be replicated (the only difference is you won't be able to use anti-matter to replicate anti-matter because you'd likely end up with a net loss of anti-matter produced [or exactly the same amount of it]... for that (direct energy to matter, or anti-matter conversion process), you'd probably need an energy source that surpasses anti-matter such as for example Omega Molecule, Thermionic generators, or Tetryon reactors (or just use the massive energy output of a Sun in a star system where you have a replication system which can store a lot of that solar energy and replicate massive amounts of anti-matter).
You'd most likely need the output of your local Star to help mass produce Anti-Matter in significant quantities cheaply. You'd probably have tons of Anti-Deuterium manufacturing Orbital facilities in every StarSystem, all churning out Anti-Deuterium to fuel StarShips.

We know Omega Molecules are banned from R&D due to the worst case scenario if you screw up.
That's out of the question.
I doubt Species 8472 would just hand out their Thermionic Generator technology to outsiders.
Tetryon Reactors are definitely one of the newer forms of Power Plants that should be R&Ded ASAP once Voyager returned home.
 
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Regarding replicating cells...
TNG: "The Enemy"
CRUSHER: He has cell damage to vital areas. He's going to need a transfusion of compatible ribosomes in order recover. I'm seeing up a schedule to test every member of the crew.
PICARD: We can't use a replicator?
CRUSHER: The molecules are too complex.

This episode is before the introduction of Genetronic Replicators which if taken by the episode alone has a low success rate. It was fatal to Worf and he was lucky to self-revive himself.
 
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Incidentally, Neutronium as seen in Star Trek cannot be degenerate neutron matter as found in neutron stars. It must be something else.

Firstly, Neutronium behaves as a liquid, and secondly, if somehow removed from a neutron star it would immediately and catastrophically explode as the only thing that keeps it in a degenerate state is the immense gravity it's under. Without that gravity even a teaspoonful size of neutron matter would explode with the roughly the same power as a 100 megatonne nuclear explosion.
 
A point about latinum, I don't think the gold acts as a bottle-like enclosure. I think the latinum is somehow suspended throughout the gold of the bar. Not an alloy exactly since it can be extracted from the gold with any physical changes to the bar. Quark expects the bars to sound a certain way when hit together, and I don't think that fits with the latinum actually being liquid in a chamber inside.
 
A point about latinum, I don't think the gold acts as a bottle-like enclosure. I think the latinum is somehow suspended throughout the gold of the bar. Not an alloy exactly since it can be extracted from the gold with any physical changes to the bar. Quark expects the bars to sound a certain way when hit together, and I don't think that fits with the latinum actually being liquid in a chamber inside.

This is definitely a possibility, although honestly I thought Quark was just listening for a sloshing noise!
 
To me the question is an issue of net gain.
Are you spending more time and energy to replicate it, than the value you're going to get out of it. Cost-to-return.

There have to be things that a starship in the field shouldn't be able to replicate efficiently, and these have to made on a Starbase, or fleet yard. Neutronium comes to mind, because of the density and complexity of it's nuclear lasagna.
Starships shouldn't have to build their own small craft, or warp coils, except in an emergency. Voyager for example.

TOS era dilithium can be replicated, because Elan of Troyus beamed up to the Enterprise wearing a dilithium necklace. It's possible that post-TOS-movie-era warp cores require higher quality crystals, that have a too-high cost-to-return.
[In his excellent novel, How Much for Just the Planet, John M. Ford writes that dilithium exists yesterday, today, and next week. This temporal displacement could also be an issue.]

So theoretically, an artist or craftsman could create something so complex, or made of exotic materials, that once replicated, would have too high a cost-to-return, for them to be beamed or replicated again.
Research into new materials could require more than a Captain's approval, to spend the replication time and effort.
I also think that there are artifacts of such high historical or cultural significance, that they are never to be beamed.
I don't think master swordsmiths would not want their blades beamed anywhere.

Also, there could be people for whom, a never-beamed item would have more significance, because of the time and effort spent shipping it, and that there aren't millions of copies all over the Federation. Back when I ran a TNG RPG, the ship's Captain preferred never-beamed meats prepared by hand, rather than the nutritionally correct meat that came out of the replicators. SNW's Captain Pike may feel the same.
 
There's also the factor of environmental rarity. The Clans in Battletech developed harjel, a chemical that can expand and seal breaches on ships or armored suits, but the plants from which it's derived only grow in very specific regions of the Clan worlds and traditionally only a few Clans ever had direct control over those production areas. Attempts to cultivate the plants elsewhere have consistently failed, and industrial uses tend to be limited because the supply has only tended to be sufficient for those applications. There isn't enough to available to, say, install it on every single unit the Clans produce for their militaries.
 
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