Troi's powers

[Mojochi]

As to Sabin Genestra, (from The Drumhead) there is a possibility that because Simon Tarses wasn't being specifically questioned about his heritage, he at 1st wasn't actively thinking about it, or worrying about it. All Tarses knew was he'd been implicated in a sabotage. Even a full Betazoid, gleaning what someone in their vicinity is thinking, would only get what they are actively thinking about. (Which is why the whole practice of using him is pretty inappropriate)

Then, later, when they DO question him about his Romulan heritage, we were given no account about HOW the investigators came by that info. It could've been investigation, or Sabin's telepathy that eventually gave him away after all, or a combination thereof.

I think Sabin, being the jerk he seemed like, just hounded the kid, until in one weak moment, he thought about it, & that was all it took,

 

[Herbert]

I think her powers were a lot like starship speeds: plot dependent.

Exactly. Kind of like her being absent from the bridge when having her there would completely explode the episode. Plot dependent.

Besides, her "powers" are from a non-existent extraterrestrial race on a fictional science fiction show about a future that will never happen. Who's to say what is the proper functioning of her abilities? How should they work? No freakin' idea. No need to overanalyze it. Just sit back and enjoy the ride.

 

[Mrs. Silvercrest]

I wanted to put this some place. I have been re watching all the Next Generation. I am not a fan of Troi on the bridge, but I do see a need for her on the ship. It makes a lot of sense. It is just a couple of times when it would have been really helpful for her to be there, like when the 3 frozen people from the past woke up and may have needed to talk with someone. She was not there. She finally did go and talk with the woman after she cried. And another time she might have been able to talk with the farmers that they had to relocate in Up the Long Ladder. I just think in some ways she was not used for enough away missions, where she could have talked with someone, calmed them or just tried to relate to them. As far as her powers, I have wondered about her mom being able to read minds, very easy, though in Picard's case not very well . And Troi ended up being an empath . That is what a human and Betazoid would make. I wonder what other pairings from other races would make? Like a Betazoid and a Klingon, or Betazoid and Vulcan, or even Betazoid and Cardassian would make??

 

[Mojochi]

It is just a couple of times when it would have been really helpful for her to be there, like when the 3 frozen people from the past woke up and may have needed to talk with someone. She was not there. She finally did go and talk with the woman after she cried. And another time she might have been able to talk with the farmers that they had to relocate in Up the Long Ladder.

I mean, in Relics Scotty is literally a person out of his time, just as much as The Neutral Zone's crying lady. (Clare Raymond) He's having a legit life crisis of feeling useless in the world, where he's drinking himself into depression & wandering the ship hopelessly, for all to see. Even that shut-in Picard notices. Where's Troi when such a unique individual is on board in such an obvious psychological state? I dunno... Somewhere on board being utterly useless to him. (They did write her one short scene with him but cut it. It wasn't all that helpful anyhow)

That might be the worst writer travesty to her job on board that they ever wrote imho

 

[Mrs. Silvercrest]

I mean, in Relics Scotty is literally a person out of his time, just as much as The Neutral Zone's crying lady. (Clare Raymond) He's having a legit life crisis of feeling useless in the world, where he's drinking himself into depression & wandering the ship hopelessly, for all to see. Even that shut-in Picard notices. Where's Troi when such a unique individual is on board in such an obvious psychological state? I dunno... Somewhere on board being utterly useless to him. (They did write her one short scene with him but cut it. It wasn't all that helpful anyhow)

That might be the worst writer travesty to her job on board that they ever wrote imho

Yes, I agree what other times would she have been needed and of help? I bet there are others.

 

[at Quark's]

I wanted to put this some place. I have been re watching all the Next Generation. I am not a fan of Troi on the bridge, but I do see a need for her on the ship. It makes a lot of sense.

I agree. Having a psychologist on board of a 1000+ crewed ship that can stay away for months and might be involved in all kinds of tense situations makes a lot of sense. As for her other role (captain's counselor) I could imagine that to be useful too. Certainly a full telepath in that position would be dead useful, but perhaps that is prohibited by Starfleet ethics and an empath is acceptable? Also I doubt it would be advisable to have both functions filled by the same person.

It is just a couple of times when it would have been really helpful for her to be there, like when the 3 frozen people from the past woke up and may have needed to talk with someone. She was not there. She finally did go and talk with the woman after she cried. And another time she might have been able to talk with the farmers that they had to relocate in Up the Long Ladder. I just think in some ways she was not used for enough away missions, where she could have talked with someone, calmed them or just tried to relate to them.

I agree, she probably could have been put to better use in many (of those) situations.

I wonder what other pairings from other races would make? Like a Betazoid and a Klingon

<while drawing bat' leth> I sense both cowardice and a desire for revenge. Now don't dishonor yourself and FIGHT me!

or Betazoid and Vulcan

"I sense illogical feelings"

or even Betazoid and Cardassian would make

A treacherous, insidious, paranoid mindreader that will use all information obtained that way to implicate you in some dirty manner? I'm not sure I would like that combination. Moreover, I'm not sure Cardassians would.

 

[Orphalesion]

I agree. Having a psychologist on board of a 1000+ crewed ship that can stay away for months and might be involved in all kinds of tense situations makes a lot of sense.

Frankly, I'd say one psychologist for 1000 people is not nearly enough. Imagine the lines outside Deanna's office after an event like the ones in Disaster or Best of Both Worlds. Plus all the other duties she was revealed to have over the years (like crew evaluations)

As for her other role (captain's counselor) I could imagine that to be useful too.

That still doesn't sound like someone who'd just be sitting around the bridge the whole time, but rather like someone who'd be summoned to the bridge in case of situations that warrant it.
I think this is what makes Deanna on the bridge so awkward, it's not apparent what she is supposed to be doing when there isn't a starship or intelligent anomaly for her to sense feelings from.

Though the reason she's on the bridge in Disaster might actually be reasonable. Perhaps the lady in the command division who got killed by that exploding console was a newbie as far as bridge command goes, and Troi was there to evaluate and advise her.
A similar situation was presented in Arsenal of Freedom, one of the few episodes that used Deanna's role effectively.

 

[Mojochi]

Per The Loss, Deanna is not the only counselor on board, which for me begs the question, is she the chief counselor, & does she run her own department like Bev? The way it plays, everyone at Picard's senior staff briefings runs their own department on top of their own duties.

Edit: Being the CMO, does that mean Deanna's department would be under Crusher's?

Similarly to how I imagine Both Worf's & Geordi's could be under Data, as chief of operations & 2nd officer... & what does that make Riker over?

 

[Takeru]

Edit: Being the CMO, does that mean Deanna's department would be under Crusher's?

Probably not, Deanna is a psychologist, not a psychiatrist. It wouldn't make sense if Beverly was in charge of a field she knows very little about.

 

[Jedi Marso]

Ever wonder if first contact with Betazed was in the TOS episode 'The Empath?'

 

[Verteron]

Not all Betazoids are created equal.

Of the full Betazoids we've seen for more than 5 minutes:

• Tam Elburn was an 'always on' reader whose gifts were so powerful that being in proximity to a large number of others was difficult for him to handle.
• Lwaxana Troi, who could apparently read thoughts (although not clear how much detail she was really getting vs, say, inferring) but she could filter out what she didn't want to receive and had no problem being around non-telepaths with noisy minds.
• Lon Suder who despite being a Betazoid seemingly had no telepathic or empathic gifts of any substance, apart from being able to share a very deep meld with Tuvok with lasting effects, perhaps deeper than a Human would be able to achieve.

We also saw several quarter Betazoids, including Walter Pierce, Devinoni Ral, and Kestra Troi-Riker all of whom seemed to be on a spectrum of abilities from 'some' to 'none'.

Suggests to me that telepathic potential among Betazoids is a wide spectrum and probably depends on nature as well as nurture.

 

[Summer Solstice]

Ever wonder if first contact with Betazed was in the TOS episode 'The Empath?'

I have never considered that before, but now you've suggested it, yes, definitely.

 

[Orphalesion]

Ever wonder if first contact with Betazed was in the TOS episode 'The Empath?'

I have never considered that before, but now you've suggested it, yes, definitely.

Eh I don't think so, a 1st season Episode of DISC has Harry Mudd mention that he robbed a bank of Betazed.

 

[McCoy's Disco Collar]

Probably not, Deanna is a psychologist, not a psychiatrist. It wouldn't make sense if Beverly was in charge of a field she knows very little about.

Perhaps in the future, our understanding of mental health is more complete, and might be structured a little differently than it is today.

I can see the CMO in a supervisory role in charge of all crew health, mental and physical. I wouldn't expect Dr. Crusher to be an expert in dentistry, but still makes sense to put the ship's dentists under her purview.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Eh I don't think so, a 1st season Episode of DISC has Harry Mudd mention that he robbed a bank of Betazed.

And Betazoids can speak, which pretty much rules out Gem being one of them.

 

[Legate Duhmar]

Not all Betazoids are created equal.

Of the full Betazoids we've seen for more than 5 minutes:

• Tam Elburn was an 'always on' reader whose gifts were so powerful that being in proximity to a large number of others was difficult for him to handle.
• Lwaxana Troi, who could apparently read thoughts (although not clear how much detail she was really getting vs, say, inferring) but she could filter out what she didn't want to receive and had no problem being around non-telepaths with noisy minds.
• Lon Suder who despite being a Betazoid seemingly had no telepathic or empathic gifts of any substance, apart from being able to share a very deep meld with Tuvok with lasting effects, perhaps deeper than a Human would be able to achieve.

We also saw several quarter Betazoids, including Walter Pierce, Devinoni Ral, and Kestra Troi-Riker all of whom seemed to be on a spectrum of abilities from 'some' to 'none'.

Suggests to me that telepathic potential among Betazoids is a wide spectrum and probably depends on nature as well as nurture.

Like a lot of Trek species the Betazoids are fairly mysterious and glossed over, but the idea of telepathy being a potential that can be different in each individual is something I thought of when watching the show. A lot of people came to similar conclusions on their own to the point of non-canon canon concepts being widely accepted and part of the fun of watching is NOT having everything explained and filling in gaps when required. That being said Troi's abilities were never clearly defined and by season 5 she was essentially just another human on the crew.

Got to blame the writers on the show for never giving much for the character to do as most Troi centered plots were boring and pointless. Seeing Marina act in an episode like 'Power Play' really showed her range and ability and so its a shame the character she played every week faded into the background of the series.

 

[Ragitsu]

"Face of the Enemy" is another superb Sirtis showcase.

 

[Verteron]

Got to blame the writers on the show for never giving much for the character to do as most Troi centered plots were boring and pointless. Seeing Marina act in an episode like 'Power Play' really showed her range and ability and so its a shame the character she played every week faded into the background of the series.

I agree and honestly I think early on in TNG, women were written very poorly. We got some truly dreadful Yar episodes in the one season that Denise Crosby was part of the cast.

Early Troi stinkers mainly seemed to involve her falling for the male guest star of the week, or being helplessly violated by some powerful alien in dubious circumstances (The Child or The Survivors).

Thankfully they did get somewhat better and Pulaski and Ro were well written from the start (even if you disliked them!) and we did start to get some better Troi episodes here and there in S5/6/7, although the early damage done to her character was hard to fix.

Gates McFadden had some really awful episodes too even in the latter seasons, as we all know.

Lessons were learned, although there were some low points in DS9, VOY and ENT (decon gels, catsuits and the like) the female characters were at least more rounded.

 

[Ragitsu]

the female characters were at least more rounded.

I should certainly hope so.

 

[Herbert]

Ever wonder if first contact with Betazed was in the TOS episode 'The Empath?'

No. There were no Betazoids in TOS. Besides, The "empath" in that episode has abilities never seen in any true Betazoid, at least to my knowledge.