Troi the only counselor?

[2of1million]

This has been bugging me! Recently I have watched the 4th season episode "The Loss". In that one Deanna loses her empathic abilities and because of it wants to resign. Guinan then says that would mean there would be no counselor on board. So are they trying to tell me that Troi is the only counselor on board a ship with over 1000 people?? I find that hard to believe. I'd hope there are other counselors for a ship that big.

 

[KDoug]

Heck, their sickbay only has five beds! Starfleet has always under-funded their medical department.

 

[The Old Mixer]

You know how many counselors Kirk's ship had?

 

[Crewman47]

With Sickbay there's a whole section with beds behind the walls of the main sickbay that we never get to see and with Troi as the only Counselor then I guess think that may have been only at the time as I would like to think that there would be at least another two counselors on board working for Troi.

Iirc this has been discussed before and I think the conclusion was that Troi did have assistants to help her out.

 

[Vanyel]

Yup, in the episode itself, Troi tells her patient that one of the other counselors will be taking over that patient's case.

I'm guessing that her official position is the Counseling Department Head. She probably reports either to the Chief Medical Officer or directly to the captain.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Really, how many shrinks do you need in a population of 1000? Assuming we're talking Middle America rather than Southern California, of course.

 

[Vanyel]

The Old Mixer said:
Really, how many shrinks do you need in a population of 1000? Assuming we're talking Middle America rather than Southern California, of course.

Well assuming that the entire crew, could need a physiological evaluation every year or two, 10. I have no numbers to back it, but it would allow the counselors to have regular patients and do regular evaluations.

 

[2of1million]

Vanyel said:
Yup, in the episode itself, Troi tells her patient that one of the other counselors will be taking over that patient's case.

Oops! Must have missed that part.

 

[Tino]

2of1million said:
I'd hope there are other counselors for a ship that big.

I always wondered about the same thing. The writers of the TITAN-novels made Deanna diplomatic officer and the head counselor. I believe at least two more counserlors are serving with her on the U.S.S. Titan.

 

[Timo]

Yet there is no onscreen indication that there would be other counselors aboard the E-D. Or more than one dentist or osteologist, for that matter. The demand might simply not necessitate this, not with crew rotation and starbase visits enabling the use of shorebound medical resources. If somebody is having psychological problems, a counselor could provide first aid, but the ultimate solution would still be to kick the loser off the ship at the nearest starbase and get a replacement who has his or her head screwed on right.

Seriously, I think the ship needs more barbers than it needs counselors. (And indeed Mr Mott seems to have at least two colleagues or assistants.)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[sturmde]

She's probably the only *pure* counselor. Clearly, the CMO and assisting doctors also would serve in a secondary duty.

A ship's chaplain might also have a caseload.

In a STARFLEET crew of 1000, I'd hope there wasn't a need for more than one fulltime counselor...

 

[Mitty]

^There is no Chaplain on Board because there is no religion in the Future.

 

[Timo]

Sure there could be religion on board. It's just that Captain Picard frowns on theist types of religion, and would be unlikely to approve of, say, Christian or Muslim clergy aboard (Buddhism or Taoism or old Greek pantheism or Bajoran Propheteering should be okay, tho - they don't have mythical gods, only real ones). Plus he obviously wants to be the one to marry the happy couples.

Curiously, Kirk's TOS ship had a chapel but a chaplain was never seen.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[WillsBabe]

Mitty said:
^There is no Chaplain on Board because there is no religion in the Future.

It's Diwali in Data's Day. Admittedly though, we don't see much other evidence of Human religion in 24th Century Trek.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Timo said:
Curiously, Kirk's TOS ship had a chapel but a chaplain was never seen.

The TOS ship had three chapels: The chapel, Nurse Chapel and Captain Kirk. (Kirk means Church)

 

[Vic Sixx]

Kirk's counselor was the Gorgeous Dr. Helen Noel. She was in only one episode. With her I'd be coming up with excuses to see her. They didn't think much of counselor's or psychiatrist's in the 60's. Now there's thousands of them today. It's possible counselors may fall out of favor someday, who knows.

How many counselors can you find on a modern day air craft carrier? Or Battleship?

 

[Mysterion]

Vic Sixx said:
Kirk's counselor was the Gorgeous Dr. Helen Noel. She was in only one episode. With her I'd be coming up with excuses to see her. They didn't think much of counselor's or psychiatrist's in the 60's. Now there's thousands of them today. It's possible counselors may fall out of favor someday, who knows.

Wasn't elizabeth Dehner in "Where no Man Has Gone Before" a psrink of some sort, as well?

BTW, I really want to see a Klingon ship's counselor:

Patient: Well, I've been feeling a bit depressed lately, and...

Klingon Kounselor: (hits patient with bat'leth) You are WEAK!! You have no honor!! Back to your station, and perform your duties!!! NOW!!!

 

[Timo]

As per dialogue at least, Dehner's role was to evaluate the crew, not to help it... Although one can't help but think that she would be stuck with these people for several years if Kirk's mission beyond the galactic rim was a success, and couldn't immediately report back on her findings anyway.

McCoy was a self-confessed specialist in space psychology, as per "Court Martial". And Noel was stated to be a psychologist as well. But being a psychologist does not necessarily make one psycho[/i]therapeutically[/i] qualified - indeed, most psychologists end up as employee evaluators or assorted quacks of the sort, while very few get the training for therapist.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Whoa Nellie]

WillsBabe said:

Mitty said:
^There is no Chaplain on Board because there is no religion in the Future.

It's Diwali in Data's Day.

:thumbsup: Also in the movie Generations, the personal nirvana Picard created for himself in the nexus was a family Christmas celebration. While this might not indicate a Christian religious faith on Picard's behalf, it does denote a sense of Christian traditions in the Picard family.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

 

[Timo]

Really, how many shrinks do you need in a population of 1000? Assuming we're talking Middle America rather than Southern California, of course.

Had a look, just for fun. In my native country, registered psychotherapists weigh in at about 0.8 per thousand people; actual psychiatrists about 0.15 per thousand. The country is extensively urbanized, though, with vast tracts of rural areas getting their shrink services at communities much larger than a thousand.

In the US, there are about 38,000 psychiatrists, total, leaving less than 0.13 for a thousand-person unit. The situation is similar in most European countries. The number of non-psychiatrist registered therapists varies, though.

In recent news, it was lamented that there are just thirteen psychiatrists in the UK armed forces, total... And about 40 nurses with psych training. That'd be 0.14 shrinks per ship, or 0.43 nurses, assuming none of the bases, or the Army or RAF, got any. There are about 1.5 chaplains per 1,000 naval personnel out there, though, two out of three being civilians. Apparently, it would be unheard of to actually deploy a psychiatrist aboard a RN ship.

Timo Saloniemi