Trapped down where?

[Captain Robert April]

OR, we could recognize that the corridor is curved to convey a feeling of depth, not to signal an internal location and not necessarily put a lot of weight behind that curved corridor.

Otherwise, like someone else posited around here some time back, we're forced to deal with every curved corridor in the ship having the same degree or arc, regardless of where it's located within the ship, and regardless of how nonsensical that arrangement makes the rest of the innards of the ship.

Besides, at any time during this interminable argument about that goddamned curved corridor, has anybody bothered to note how it comes to an abrupt end just past Engineering, instead of continuing on like so many of these arguments demand that it do?

 

[Timo]

The existence of complete circular corridors would be as inconvenient as the existence of multiple circular corridors with the same radius... Unless these circles are cut at some point(s), it's difficult to understand how the turbolifts could travel radially.

Of course, they could go over or under the corridors in a wild amusement park ride, assuming the circular corridors weren't stacked atop each other (like the various onscreen graphics show some of them to be) but had different radii each. But at some point, a good uninterrupted horizontal stretch of radial turboshaft would be nice, necessitating a truncated circular corridor.

Also, the more truncated the corridor network, the better it is for explaining why our heroes have to walk along these corridors the seeming "long way" rather than taking shortcuts. Despite the seeming elegant symmetry of the ship's exterior, it'd probably be advantageous to postulate an interior layout with pronounced asymmetries, so often found in real pieces of engineering.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Forbin]

How 'bout placing the "energizer" (whatever the hell that is) as a great big circular thing, right ahead of Engineering. Or the gravity generator. Or...

 

[Captain Robert April]

Just checked my deck plans. There isn't enough room for that curved corridor in the secondary hull. The closest we'd be able to get is to round off a corner.

 

[kkozoriz1]

In my mind i've always imagined that the curved corridors represent all the various curved corridors even though they're all the same radius. It would be interesting to see how close you could get. Your comment about it coming to an end could help things as well.

 

[Captain Robert April]

I put Engineering on the widest deck in the secondary hull, and there's just enough room for corridors on either side. Any curvature in the corridor would be so short as to be completely pointless.

 

[kkozoriz1]

Is that a one or two room engineering set-up?

 

[Captain Robert April]

Doesn't matter, since the rooms are fore and aft, with the tube assembly in between.

 

[kkozoriz1]

Gotcha. Just trying to picture it.

 

[Navigator_NCC2120]

I dunno, the dialogue seems way too specific to me to be too easely dismissed? I've always suspected that the scriptwriter was using "The making of Star Trek" as the referece it was intended to be, and was under the impression that Engineering was in the impulse deck on levels six and seven?

I'm gonna agree with this. Until it was later retconned, most of us accepted that engineering was in the saucer, if only because it was directly off a huge curved coridore that wouldn't have made sense anywhere but in the saucer.

But near the end of the episode we see Kirk and Kang slapping each other on the back in the engine room, laughing, forcing the alien entity to leave the engine room through the wall/bulkhead and then an exterior shot of the Enterprise shows the alien entity exiting the secondary hull not the saucer primary hull. So, that would put the (main) engine room in the secondary hull.

There could have been an auxiliary engine room in the saucer for the impulse engines, but for this episode they were in the main engine room in the secondary hull.


Navigator NCC-2120 USS Entente
/\

 

[Captain Robert April]

If anything, putting Engineering in the saucer was a retcon. As far as the cast and crew were concerned, it was down in the secondary hull.

 

[TIN_MAN]

I dunno, the dialogue seems way too specific to me to be too easely dismissed? I've always suspected that the scriptwriter was using "The making of Star Trek" as the referece it was intended to be, and was under the impression that Engineering was in the impulse deck on levels six and seven?

I'm gonna agree with this. Until it was later retconned, most of us accepted that engineering was in the saucer, if only because it was directly off a huge curved coridore that wouldn't have made sense anywhere but in the saucer.

But near the end of the episode we see Kirk and Kang slapping each other on the back in the engine room, laughing, forcing the alien entity to leave the engine room through the wall/bulkhead and then an exterior shot of the Enterprise shows the alien entity exiting the secondary hull not the saucer primary hull. So, that would put the (main) engine room in the secondary hull.

There could have been an auxiliary engine room in the saucer for the impulse engines, but for this episode they were in the main engine room in the secondary hull.


Navigator NCC-2120 USS Entente
/\

^^ Actually this is exactly what I was talking about. If you look closely at the back/slapping scene, you'll notice that the entity is shown in close-ups to be hovering over the stairs and console side of the engine room, but the charactors are looking in the opposite direction! This is where the 'sloppiness ' or carelessness comes in on the part of the director, among others.
Also, regardless of which side the entity is on, as it leaves, it moves parallel to the axis of the engine room, so unless the engine room sits "sideways" or tranversely relative to the bow/stern axis if the ship, then it could not exit from the "side" of the ship, as we see it doing in the final F/X shots!
This is all such a mess, its kinda seems pointless to use the F/X here as "proof" of anything? And while I agree that the engine room was originally intended to be in the secondary hull, I wouldn't blame anyone if they wanted to take the very specific dialogue in this ep over the sloppy F/X, and conclude that the engine room spans deck six and seven in the impulse deck.

 

[Mytran]

...If you look closely at the back/slapping scene, you'll notice that the entity is shown in close-ups to be hovering over the stairs and console side of the engine room, but the charactors are looking in the opposite direction! This is where the 'sloppiness ' or carelessness comes in on the part of the director, among others.

Or that there was more than set of steps in the engine room. This is something that BLSSDWLF came up with, his thread is great!

Also, regardless of which side the entity is on, as it leaves, it moves parallel to the axis of the engine room, so unless the engine room sits "sideways" or tranversely relative to the bow/stern axis if the ship, then it could not exit from the "side" of the ship, as we see it doing in the final F/X shots!

Unless it exits parallel to the secondary steps, in which case it will follow a straight line to the side of the ship.

Or if that is too complicated, maybe it just turned a corner? It was seen using the corridors earlier in the episode, so maybe moving though air is easier than moving through walls?

This is all such a mess, its kinda seems pointless to use the F/X here as "proof" of anything? And while I agree that the engine room was originally intended to be in the secondary hull, I wouldn't blame anyone if they wanted to take the very specific dialogue in this ep over the sloppy F/X, and conclude that the engine room spans deck six and seven in the impulse deck.

The episode certainly provides some "interesting" information points, I won't deny!

 

[TIN_MAN]

^^ Yeah, I was thinking of BLSSDWLF's thread when I was writing up my post, but decided not to mention for brevity. That certainly is one viable solution, albeit an "after the fact" rationalisation, and still doesn't excuse the sloppy visuals and F/X of the original production IMHO.

 

[blssdwlf]

^^ I agree that "Day of the Dove" was pretty sloppy in VFX execution (and probably directing as someone had to tell the actors where to look.) I'm just surprised things still could fit

FWIW, I think in all but two episodes the engine room could be placed in the engineering hull, even with the curved hallway (due to the camera cut when they are walking it barely fits). Only in "The Ultimate Computer" with the no camera cut walk does it get difficult to physically model away and the duplicate engine room in "The Omega Glory" is where I think a second engine room would exist in the primary hull

 

[Irishman]

They were all off-duty hanging out at the pool or the bowling alley.

But where is the...hey, wait a minute!

 

[T'Girl]

In day of the dove, Kirk and Kang might have been showing their contempt for fuzzy alien guy, by talk with their backs to it.