TOS Turbolift

[MAGolding]

Thank you very much, Mytran!

You mention, however, that the lift is 7 feet in diameter, whereas your detailed diagramm of 1 inch-grids show 16 grids, how does that fit?

as near as I can tell the big grids are subdivided into smaller grids. Each big grid is 5 by 5 smaller grids. If the smaller grids are square inches, 16 large grids would be 80 inches wide, which would be 6.6666 feet, which is almost 7 feet.

And that is a possible basis for interpreting the diagram until Mytran responds.

 

[Koloth TOS]

I wonder if on the TOS show there ever was a supervisor checking what the script writers were talking about when it came to decks etc. and questioning inconsistencies.

 

[Christopher]

You'd rather push yourself around a zero-g tunnel than stand still for a few seconds in a turbolift car?

You'd rather walk 300 meters from the bridge to engineering instead of just riding the turbolift horizontally?

As I understand it (from online discussions back in the day with Gene Roddenberry's Andromeda's producers about their ship design philosophy), real Naval vessels don't generally use elevators because of the risk of them getting jammed in the shaft due to battle damage. Military personnel are expected to be in good shape and able to walk, run, or climb anywhere on a ship, even one the size of an aircraft carrier.

I mean, come on, I'm only in moderately decent shape, but 300 meters is easy for me. That's just a couple of blocks. I walk farther than that to get to the convenience store.

The only reason Trek uses elevators instead of stairways, really, is because a small elevator car is easier to build and film in than a futuristic multilevel stairway, and because it let the characters have private conversations. Although the USS Protostar in Prodigy does have stairways instead of lifts, since a CGI ship's design doesn't have to be constrained by soundstage space.

 

[Mytran]

Thank you very much, Mytran!

You mention, however, that the lift is 7 feet in diameter, whereas your detailed diagramm of 1 inch-grids show 16 grids, how does that fit?

If you expand the picture to full size you will see the one inch squares.

as near as I can tell the big grids are subdivided into smaller grids. Eachmigg grid is 5 by 5 smaller Grids. If the smaller grids are square inches, 16 large grids would be 80 inches wide, which would be 6.6666 feet, which is almost 7 feet.

Pretty much this. The interior is mapped out onto a circle of 84 one-inch squares (AKA 7 feet)

So technically, the interior is only 7 feet wide at the extremities of the inset motion indicator panels. Actual usable space is more like 6'10" according to my research but that is based on me scale-matching the set plans from Journey To Babel so there is a margin of error, not to mention the fact that these were hand-drawn diagrams.
FWIW, my earliest research is below. If you wanted to expand the turbolift interior by a couple of inches then I have no objection, it would certainly make life easier!

If the set drawing is to be believed (and my scaling is accurate), it looks like the 7' circle was drawn out, a frame for the walls built, then some 1-inch thick curved walls were added onto it. Probably another of those cardboard cement moulds that TOS was so fond of using!

 

[aridas sofia]

My understanding way back when, derived perhaps from TMoST, but perhaps from some other source, was that a turbolift car utilized turbofans for propulsion in imbalanced-pressure tubes. I inferred from this that the tubes were also null gravity tubes, and that the sides of the tubes employed some charge/negative charge or other resistance technology, to reduce friction and other impeding forces to near zero. The cars would be autonomous, could act as life pods, and in short, turned elevator technology’s problems on their head by affording greater safety than the corridors themselves. I realize that was somewhat screwed with in STV and TNG, but this is a TOS forum so I thought I’d just point that out. I think it’s possible to imagine turbolifts as serving purposes that go beyond getting from point A to point B.

 

[Christopher]

The cars would be autonomous, could act as life pods, and in short, turned elevator technology’s problems on their head by affording greater safety than the corridors themselves.

Unless the turboshafts themselves were warped by battle damage, which is the concern behind the Navy's non-use of elevators, according to what I was told. If the tube is bent or crushed, even the most autonomous lift car isn't getting through.

And I had a sinking feeling as I wrote that paragraph because I realized it could be taken as a justification for Discovery's absurdly roomy turbolift roller-coaster space.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I'm not familiar. What is the setting and context of this car going through a roller coaster track? Is it aboard a crazy-big ship?

 

[1001001]

I'm not familiar. What is the setting and context of this car going through a roller coaster track? Is it aboard a crazy-big ship?

It's the turbolift system on Discovery.

 

[Mytran]

It's the turbolift system on Discovery.

And DISCO's version of the Enterprise (according to Short Treks)

 

[ZapBrannigan]

It's the turbolift system on Discovery.

Jesus. I wonder where there'd be room for all that deckless space.

 

[Ssosmcin]

It's the turbolift system on Discovery.

Well, that is a ridiculous waste of space. Back in the day, even Roddenberry said the original Enterprise corridors were only as wide as they were to fit the camera equipment.

"Hey, why are starships so big?"
"Well, we gotta fit the amusement park rides in between the bulkheads."

 

[Christopher]

Well, that is a ridiculous waste of space. Back in the day, even Roddenberry said the original Enterprise corridors were only as wide as they were to fit the camera equipment.

I'm certainly no fan of DSC's absurd turbolift interiors, and choose to interpret them as adaptational artistic license rather than in-universe reality. To be fair, though, the TOS Enterprise was about the size of an aircraft carrier such as its namesake CVN-65, but had a crew complement less than one-tenth its size (430 vs. 4600). So it canonically did have a whole lot more space than it really needed. And the discrepancy was even more extreme in TNG, with the E-D having a vastly larger interior volume but only a bit more than twice the crew complement. The TNG Tech Manual even handwaved it by saying there were huge chunks of empty space inside the saucer, set aside for future development. So there's abundant precedent for Starfleet vessels being profligate with their interior volume.

 

[Koloth TOS]

I've always been wonderung what - apart from the bridge crew and Dr McCoy and nurse Chapel - the rest of the Enterprise crew was doing all the time, there were about 420 crew members left and all that we saw was that a few of them were runnig through the corridors.

 

[Ssosmcin]

They were all in the bowling alley at 19:00

 

[Christopher]

I've always been wonderung what - apart from the bridge crew and Dr McCoy and nurse Chapel - the rest of the Enterprise crew was doing all the time, there were about 420 crew members left and all that we saw was that a few of them were runnig through the corridors.

I figure when we see Spock looking at readouts from his science station or listening to something over the Feinberger in his ear, he's actually receiving reports compiled by the various specialists in the science department and distilling them to the basics for the captain.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

Assuming everyone's working 8 hour days and taking days off, that'd be less than 140 people actually doing things at any time. You'd have people manning the bridge, engineering, sickbay, phaser control, transporter rooms, the 14 science labs etc. Two or three people in each of those rooms and you're almost halfway there. Plus there'd be engineers doing maintenance around the ship, a lot of security officers, people walking around with tablets for the captain to write on, and all the specialists like historians who may just be sitting around painting historical figures all day.

 

[plynch]

Sailors are really crammed into US Navy ships too. Any sailor want to weigh in on hot bunking, I think it’s called, where they take turns using the same bunks? The TOS E seems more humane.

 

[XCV330]

The security/combat/torpedo crew probably spend a lot of time in hurry up and wait. Anyway, Lower Decks has shown what they do: a ton of repairs and maint. while goofing off.

 

[aridas sofia]

Unless the turboshafts themselves were warped by battle damage, which is the concern behind the Navy's non-use of elevators, according to what I was told. If the tube is bent or crushed, even the most autonomous lift car isn't getting through.

And I had a sinking feeling as I wrote that paragraph because I realized it could be taken as a justification for Discovery's absurdly roomy turbolift roller-coaster space.

This is a good point and would probably necessitate interpreting the turboshaft system as part of the ship’s frame.

 

[blssdwlf]

This is a good point and would probably necessitate interpreting the turboshaft system as part of the ship’s frame.

That seems possible given in TNG we can't see what is beyond the turboshaft walls (except for the doors).