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Top 10 Sci-Fi Tv Shows Poll by Sci Fi Channel

That list is a piece of shit. BSG belongs nowhere on that list, and Firefly is nowhere near #1. Mine might be something like this...

1. Babylon 5
2. Jericho
3. Star Trek TNG
4. X-Files
5. Farscape
6. Firefly
7. New Amsterdam
8. Stargate SG-1
9. The Dresden Files
10. Angel
 
Sadly, I do not know. I think FOX may consider it financially unfeasible to release it since it only ran eight episodes. Sigh ... they never gave it a chance.
 
Yep. Typical FOX behavior ... can a show that's cheap to produce and gets decent ratings, and then replace it with expensive shows that get crappy ratings.
 
Yep. Typical FOX behavior ... can a show that's cheap to produce and gets decent ratings, and then replace it with expensive shows that get crappy ratings.
 
Blakes 7
Babylon 5
Farscape

Those three are way out on their own. Then:

Doctor Who (classic)
TOS / TNG / Voyager
The Twilight Zone (original)

There's nothing else I'd put in a top 10 - today, anyway. :D Lost comes closest.
 
It was original, unexpected, and different at a time when that was needed in the SF landscape.

Yes, but original, unexpected and different does not automatically equal "entertaining" or "good".

No, not automatically. Just in this case. :D

Fine... :rolleyes:

I'm a SF fan, and I like rooting for the underdog. How come I didn't get hit by this "perfect storm"? Was I too far inland?
I have no idea. Just unlucky, I guess. Personally I didn't "get it" until about half way through the run, though---it's not always an instant thing. It's just that abruptly the whole concept "clicks", and you appreciate everything (even the episodes you've already seen) in a whole new light. It's hard to explain, really......one theory I have is that it isn't until you've seen both a border-centric episode and a core-centric episode that you can really grasp the dichotomy fully. Unfortunately Fox frontloaded the airing order with border-centric stories....

I actually saw the whole series when it was aired in order on Skiffy, and I was even charitable enough to shell out money for a movie ticket for Serenity, so I've seen it the way fans all say it should be seen, and all I'm left with is the question "What's so great about this?" Your explanation is probably as good as any. The concept doesn't click with me. [shrug]

Or, it's just a case of "Joss Whedon can do no wrong" a mantra I've yet to adhere to.
Well, I've seen more examples of him doing right than wrong, though there are a few of the latter.

For me he's fifty/fifty.

That's not really relevant to Firefly at least in my case, though, since it was the first thing of his I'd ever paid any attention to. Firefly's awesomeness is the reason I'm now a fan of Buffy and Angel, two shows I'd previously ignored.

I liked Buffy and Angel first. I was first told about Firefly by a Whedon fan and I remember my initial reaction was "This is crap," which isn't necessarily a bad thing, because that was also my first reaction to Star Trek and I grew to love that. That's just not happening with me and Firefly, but at least I'm slightly past "crap."

You're almost sounding like you're taking offense because some people like the show but you can't understand why.

No argument here. I said exactly that at the end of my original post.

For me, Firefly is like Starbucks. I hate coffee, yet here's an international franchise dedicated to selling ridiculous variations on a beverage I hate, yet millions of people are willing to walk in and pay equally ridiculous prices just to drink those variations.

Then there's Firefly, a TV show about cowboys in space speaking Chinese. :wtf:

It's one of those things that can be partially explained by show quality, and the rest is just a convergence of circumstances.

Or, it's just a case of "Joss Whedon can do no wrong" a mantra I've yet to adhere to.
Now I think you're going overboard. As I said in the paragraph above, there are extremists for any show that you can just count on being idiots in their devotion and towards the critics of said show. NO rational fan of "Firefly" takes that"Joss Whedon can do no wrong" approach, leaving only those people whose opinions aren't worth worrying about.

It's not just the extremists that trouble me. Again, it's cowboys in space, speaking Chinese. What could anybody possibly see in that?
 
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Again, it's cowboys in space, speaking Chinese. What could anybody possibly see in that?

Apparently not enough to get the ratings up. That's the problem with trappings----they can't really give you an idea of what the content will be. And the content is what elevates the trappings in this case (as with Buffy & Angel-----cheeleader who fights vampires is a rather lame concept on its own), not vice versa.

Only two things elevated "The Train Job" for me enough to tune in again....the opening narration of "Find a crew, find a job, keep flying" reminded me of the Escape Velocity games of which I am a fan, and Mal's engine-kick which got a laugh through sheer unexpectedness. I'm glad I did stick with it, but it was a bit of a near thing.
 
It's not just the extremists that trouble me. Again, it's cowboys in space, speaking Chinese. What could anybody possibly see in that?
I'm not trying to belabor anything. It's just that we see the show from two different points of view. You seem to view it as problematic, whereas I see it as quirky creativity. Now, if I didn't find the stories entertaining and the dialogue enjoyable, I'd probably take your POV, because on the surface that does sound like an incompatible mixture of elements. What usually attracts me to a show is, "are they trying something different?" It has happened with B5, Farscape and Firefly. Each brought for me a completely different look and feel and sound from all that I had seen before it.
 
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In no real order:

1. Earth 2
2. Now & Again
3. Journeyman
4. Firefly
5. Farscape
6. Babylon 5
7. TNG
8. DS9
9. Buffy
10. Angel

As to the Firefly discussion at hand, I've found it generally helpful in my "fandom travels" so to speak to not worry too much about the tastes of others. There are a few examples of stories out there that I genuinely wonder where people find merit or value in them. But, since I don't like the shows, and don't expect the fans to convince me otherwise, I let them enjoy their shows and don't ask them why. Makes for a more pleasant online experience overall, I think. :)
 
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^ Hey, someone else who went for Now & Again! :)
Awesome show with sublime performances from a terrific cast
 
^ I actually just had a significant chuckle thinking about Now and Again. The episode title "The Eggman Cometh" just popped into my head, immediately followed by visions of Mork emerging from his egg spaceship (I just finished watching Mork & Mindy's 1st season).

Nanoo nanoo!!! Man, that was a cute show. I'd almost pull Buffy from my list and put Mork & Mindy in its place. Almost. ;)
 
As to the Firefly discussion at hand, I've found it generally helpful in my "fandom travels" so to speak to not worry too much about the tastes of others.

Oh, this isn't about convincing anyone of anything. Merely providing a viewpoint.
 
But, since I don't like the shows, and don't expect the fans to convince me otherwise, I let them enjoy their shows and don't ask them why. Makes for a more pleasant online experience overall, I think. :)
And that's a good approach to take. Still, it's more than possible to ask someone why they like a show if it's puzzling to you. Often times you'll be met with a rather incredulous response or even be attacked. If that happens, better to just walk away and brush the dirt from your feet.

I guess I ought to list my shows, huh? :lol: It's hard for me to come up with a definitive "Top 10 BEST", since I haven't seen all of the shows mentioned so far and criteria vary so greatly. BUT I will give it a shot.

10.) nuBSG/Stargate SG-1 (tie - too close to call)
09.) The Outer Limits (original)
08.) Firefly
09.) Blake's 7
06.) Farscape
05.) Star Trek: TNG
04.) Babylon 5
03.) Star Trek
02.) Doctor Who (both original and new)

01.) The Twilight Zone (original)
 
Again, it's cowboys in space, speaking Chinese. What could anybody possibly see in that?

Apparently not enough to get the ratings up. That's the problem with trappings----they can't really give you an idea of what the content will be. And the content is what elevates the trappings in this case, (snip) not vice versa.

But does it really?

Maybe it helps if I put it this way. I kinda get the mindset behind this. With the exceptions of Inara and River, the crew of Serenity is made up of "Bad Guys" and outcasts trying to make their way in a society made up mostly of people that would be morally opposed to who they are and the things they do to survive, which are rarely legal and even more rarely moral.

And believe it or not, I could get behind that concept, something I've recently discovered while reading and viewing the series Black Lagoon. This is essentially the same concept: a collection of outcasts in a crew/company trying to make their way in a moralistic world using less than legal means. The same except nobody wears clothes or uses weapons that look like they were made in 1876, and given that it's set in the Asian Pacific it doesn't involve cattle rustlers or ropin' and ridin' and nobody's speaking an Asian language that you wouldn't expect to be speaking it. The content and trappings fit in the overall context. Neither is required to elevate the other, and I'm not left with that "I'm in friggin Starbucks!" feeling when I watch it. In fact, one time when I was watching it, one of my thoughts was: "This is Firefly the way it should have been done!" Would it have made it on the air? Not likely, but that's what I thought.

My point is the trappings are that jarring that it turns a series I might get to like into a :wtf: experience every time I see it, and it just surprises me how many people manage to get past them and be in love with Firefly. It has a pretty decent following for a cancelled show, so ratings or not, it isn't like nobody watched it, but that's exactly what I would have expected.

But Merrily's right. I gotta get past what other people like.

(as with Buffy & Angel-----cheeleader who fights vampires is a rather lame concept on its own)

It is lame, and not all the content keeps it from being lame. I personally hate Buffy (the character, not the series) because she is such a freakin cheerleader, no matter how much gravitas she puts on every once in a while. (I watched the show mainly for Cordy and Anya.)


Only two things elevated "The Train Job" for me enough to tune in again....the opening narration of "Find a crew, find a job, keep flying" reminded me of the Escape Velocity games of which I am a fan, and Mal's engine-kick which got a laugh through sheer unexpectedness. I'm glad I did stick with it, but it was a bit of a near thing.

My first experience was the one where Jayne was a hero on some planet (I don't know titles) when the show was still on Fox. That was my "this is crap" episode, but I tried again with the one where River was mind-screwing the bounty hunter, which was, well, :wtf:
 
OK, my top 10:

1 - X-Files
2 - Star Trek TOS
3 - Battlestar Galactica 2004
4 - Lost
5 - Star Trek DS9
6 - Twilight Zone
7 - The Lone Gunmen

then time passes

8 - Battlestar Galactica 1978
9 - Buck Rogers
10 -
 
My top ten.

Doctor Who
Star Trek(All of them)
Stargate SG1
The X-Files
Babylon 5
Space:1999
Blake's 7
The Twilight Zone(Original)
Battlestar Galactica(Original)
The Six Million Dollar Man

Of course some of them do change from time to time. ;)
 
In no special order:

Star Trek TOS
Star Trek DS9
Star Trek Enterprise
Battlestar Galactica TOS
Battlestar Galactics RDM
Buck Rogers in the 25th Century
seaQest DSV
Stargate SG-1
Buffy.../Angel
Firefly
 
But does it really?

Maybe it helps if I put it this way. I kinda get the mindset behind this. With the exceptions of Inara and River, the crew of Serenity is made up of "Bad Guys" and outcasts trying to make their way in a society made up mostly of people that would be morally opposed to who they are and the things they do to survive, which are rarely legal and even more rarely moral.

That's not what I see at all. I see a show about a group of people who have found themselves on the short end of the law through sheer overwhelming circumstance rather than choice.

Jayne is the only one of the lot who could be called a "bad guy"; really; we like him 'cause he's funny. (I heard in one revision of the concept his character was supposed to be killed off fairly fast, but Adam Baldwin's performance changed their minds.) Mal keeps him in check, mostly.

Speaking of Mal, he has no compunctions about doing what's necessary to protect his crew but will always do the right thing given the option. He's an intriguing combination of ruthless and compassionate, and believable as such despite the apparent contradiction.

Zoe, similar though driven more by loyalty to Mal than principal. I feel she could turn pretty dark without the stabilizing framework Mal and Wash provide her, though. Wash for his part probably wouldn't have stuck with the crew as long as he did if not for Zoe; he's too chipper for the rest of them, really, and truth be told he doesn't seem to like Mal overmuch.

Simon's all about protecting River, and as we saw in flashbacks, he tried quite a few things to help her before turning to force as a means of getting her out.

Kaylee, whom no one can't love. All smiles and sunshine and strawberries. Enough said there.

Book, the enigma. He's clearly a good man, but you get the definite sense that he may not always have been. What happened to change him? His story may never be told in full (until that rumored comic comes out?), though.

You mentioned River and Inara; one a victim of the State, the other keeping a secret but outwardly the most respectable of the lot.

Outcasts, certainly; being on the losing side of a war can do that. Bad guys, certainly not. They break the law when necessary to keep food on the table and gas in the engine, and even kill when they're forced to, but they're basically good people, morally speaking.

The same except nobody wears clothes or uses weapons that look like they were made in 1876
Stylistic choice. Advanced sonic and laser weapons were clearly used by the Alliance military, and Mal even had a mean-looking assault rifle in one of the war scenes, but the high-tech stuff is strictly controlled (often illegal for private owners), and the infrastructure of the border planets is such that it would be difficult to keep one maintained as easily as a simple pistol. Said pistol doesn't *have* to look like a six-shooter, but I understand why they'd make that choice in the art department. Still, the sound effects and apparent magazine size suggest at least somewhat advanced workings.

Additionally the "old west" design complements another stylistic choice of the show----that the future is made up of scrambled-together aspects of the past. The "old southern" high culture on Persephone, for instance, or the Chinese origins of the Companion's Guild.

and given that it's set in the Asian Pacific it doesn't involve cattle rustlers or ropin' and ridin'
I don't think they ever took the metaphor *that* far. The crew is only shown riding horses when it's the only practical transportation available and speed is required (I only recall two instances, actually). There was no roping that I recall, and the only cattle-transport job they did was one of the less illegal ventures they engaged in, and no rustling was involved.

and nobody's speaking an Asian language that you wouldn't expect to be speaking it.
Why wouldn't you expect them to be speaking it? Is it hard to believe that America and China would be the two nations with the greatest spaceflight capability if an Exodus from Earth were required in the next hundred years? Or that, with a few hundreds of thousands of survivors at most populating a whole new solar system after perhaps decades on generation ships, the two cultures would become inextricably entwined?

The content and trappings fit in the overall context.
They do in Firefly as well; it merely requires some deeper exploration of the premise to fully understand it. That very non-obviousness is part of the appeal.

I want to thank you for making me think through all this again, by the way. It's given me a few ideas for my Firefly mod of Escape Velocity: Nova.
 
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