TNG... oozing the 80's

[RandyS]

The hair I never noticed except on troi. Good GOD...What a nightmare!

I agree. Troi's first season look was horrible, except in the pilot where she looked like a woman.

The first year was Crusher's best hairstyle too.

I don't know what the hell Tasha Yar was thinking though. Maybe Crosby secretly thought she was a man.

 

[DGCatAniSiri]

I think the short hair on Yar was sensible for a security officer - Tasha struck me as the kind of person who would have no muss and no fuss about her appearance, so she would want something low maintinence.

 

[Praetor]

TNG hasn't really seemed that 80s to me until recently. And personally I never found the 'skants' that big a deal. I think the thing to keep in mind is that most (not all) people in our modern day know what they do and do not have the body to wear. Hopefully in the utopian paradise of the 24th century hopefully either everyone has a good enough body to wear a skant/skirt if they want to, or evolved enough sensibilities not to if they won't look good in it. So let 'em wear skants.

 

[CaptainStoner]

Maybe it's just me, but TNG is one of those rarities that doesn't feel extraordinarily locked into the decade it was created within.

It's a dated show, but when I watch it I don't think "80's." It still feels futuristic to me.

I agree, with some noted exceptions: early season female hair, the use of teal (though it's not the same shade of teal I associate with the 80's, which I recall as more a greenish-blue, especially in cars)

There's also the occasional electronic music in S1, which is very 80's. Fun, but instantly cheesed.

I think the Enterprise interiors and bridge were a good job at combining various decades of style, mostly 70's-80's-90's. 70's in the beige and wood tones, 80's in the more black/metallic styles, 90's with the purples/teals.

 

[RandyS]

I think the short hair on Yar was sensible for a security officer - Tasha struck me as the kind of person who would have no muss and no fuss about her appearance, so she would want something low maintinence.

Well, yeah if we're talking character I agree. I just never liked the "butch" look on a woman. Crusher's first season hair is how a woman should look.

 

[eepruls]

I think the short hair on Yar was sensible for a security officer - Tasha struck me as the kind of person who would have no muss and no fuss about her appearance, so she would want something low maintinence.

Well, yeah if we're talking character I agree. I just never liked the "butch" look on a woman. Crusher's first season hair is how a woman should look.

How is short hair a 'butch' look? It's not like she had a mullet, wore plaid, and carried an axe! I think hairstyle is dependent on the woman and what suits her face, profession, etc. Hair isn't a 'one-size-fits-all' approach. Crusher's hair suits her but it would not look good on other women.

 

[RandyS]

I think the short hair on Yar was sensible for a security officer - Tasha struck me as the kind of person who would have no muss and no fuss about her appearance, so she would want something low maintinence.

Well, yeah if we're talking character I agree. I just never liked the "butch" look on a woman. Crusher's first season hair is how a woman should look.

How is short hair a 'butch' look?

I don't know, it just looked that way to me. How would you define a "butch" look?

 

[Praetor]

Well, if 'butch' = 'masculine,' I'd say Tasha was nowhere near, in (or out of, see 'The Naked Now') that form-fitting uniform, hair notwithstanding.

On a slightly related point, I've never understood why TPTB thought Troi's single-color cleavage jumpsuits were in some way sexier than the blue uniforms she wore later. (I can see what they were going for with the pilot ep's cheerleader skirt, but not so much the hair.) The blue color was flattering on her, and the very pattern nicely defined her shape, and all of the ladies for that matter, with the higher waistline and other little tweaks that made them different from the male versions.

 

[eepruls]

Well, if 'butch' = 'masculine,' I'd say Tasha was nowhere near, in (or out of, see 'The Naked Now') that form-fitting uniform, hair notwithstanding.

On a slightly related point, I've never understood why TPTB thought Troi's single-color cleavage jumpsuits were in some way sexier than the blue uniforms she wore later. (I can see what they were going for with the pilot ep's cheerleader skirt, but not so much the hair.) The blue color was flattering on her, and the very pattern nicely defined her shape, and all of the ladies for that matter, with the higher waistline and other little tweaks that made them different from the male versions.

Tasha wasn't butch. You could see her figure and that she clearly had a feminine side. If she was butch she would'nt have cared as much about her feminine appearance. She was just a tough woman. I always wished they showed more of that during the first season but her character was given the shaft to begin with, but that's another story.

I agree that Troi looked SOOOOOOOOOOO much better once she put the blue uniform back on. I always hated that she wore something different than everyone else and sat right beside Captain Picard. She was an officer so why wouldn't she wear a uniform? The first season jumpsuit with the cleavage was simply horrible. I don't know what the producers were thinking when they took her out of the uniform and put her into that. I think Troi looked phenomenal in the blue uniform in seasons six and seven. And we needed another blue uniform with only Crusher wearing it for so long.

 

[DGCatAniSiri]

Agreed about Troi in the blue uniform. I don't know what they were afraid of, though maybe it was Marina's reaction to the 'intergalactic cheerleader outfit' (wasn't that what she called what she wore in the pilot?). I don't know, maybe they were expecting to only show Troi in the skant, so her negative reaction soured them on a standard uniform entirely? Whatever the reason, it was rather senseless.

 

[eepruls]

Agreed about Troi in the blue uniform. I don't know what they were afraid of, though maybe it was Marina's reaction to the 'intergalactic cheerleader outfit' (wasn't that what she called what she wore in the pilot?). I don't know, maybe they were expecting to only show Troi in the skant, so her negative reaction soured them on a standard uniform entirely? Whatever the reason, it was rather senseless.

Why didn't they just put her in a normal blue uniform in season one? It seems like they were trying to make Troi more sexy by putting her in one of those awful mini-skirts and by giving her frizzed up hair (LOL @ 'intergalactic cheerleader outfit'). After the pilot they put her in an awful jumpsuit with her cleavage showing. You don't have to show leg or cleavage to be sexy. Fans would have taken her more seriously if she was in a uniform like everyone else. She's supposed to be a counselor who has the rank of Lieutenant Commander, not the ship's whore! Maybe that's why she sat right beside Picard?! "Don't tell Riker, but you'll be my Numba One at night..."

 

[RAMA]

In every possible way.

One of the reasons I love this show most is the prime 80s nostalgia.
The uniforms, the hair. The sets, the hair. The music. Did I mention the hair?

I'm not hating. It's very difficult to create something on TV that completely reveals no ties to the decade in which it was created.

But even the end of TNG's run, well into the 1990s looks SO EIGHTIES upon repeat viewings.

I think it's utterly fantastic. But perhaps others find it irksome.

Well only 2 1/2 season were in the 80s....you think it looks 80s cause the ship has carpets or something?

RAMA

 

[Lowdarzz]

I've never understood this whole concept of labeling something as "dated".

TNG was a good show then and it is still a good show today.

 

[Praetor]

I've never understood this whole concept of labeling something as "dated".

TNG was a good show then and it is still a good show today.

I still think it's a good show, personally, but there are so many things that have phased into recent memory as '80s' that are hallmarks - color scheme, effects, etc.

Well, if 'butch' = 'masculine,' I'd say Tasha was nowhere near, in (or out of, see 'The Naked Now') that form-fitting uniform, hair notwithstanding.

On a slightly related point, I've never understood why TPTB thought Troi's single-color cleavage jumpsuits were in some way sexier than the blue uniforms she wore later. (I can see what they were going for with the pilot ep's cheerleader skirt, but not so much the hair.) The blue color was flattering on her, and the very pattern nicely defined her shape, and all of the ladies for that matter, with the higher waistline and other little tweaks that made them different from the male versions.

Tasha wasn't butch. You could see her figure and that she clearly had a feminine side. If she was butch she would'nt have cared as much about her feminine appearance. She was just a tough woman. I always wished they showed more of that during the first season but her character was given the shaft to begin with, but that's another story.

That's my point, too. Like I said, 'nowhere near butch.' And like you said, 'just a tough woman.'

I agree that Troi looked SOOOOOOOOOOO much better once she put the blue uniform back on. I always hated that she wore something different than everyone else and sat right beside Captain Picard. She was an officer so why wouldn't she wear a uniform? The first season jumpsuit with the cleavage was simply horrible. I don't know what the producers were thinking when they took her out of the uniform and put her into that. I think Troi looked phenomenal in the blue uniform in seasons six and seven. And we needed another blue uniform with only Crusher wearing it for so long.

Agreed.

 

[Strider]

Tech stuff is always going to age, but some of it still looks good. If the sets/props are well designed and the story is grounded then it seems to age a lot slower. How good does TUC look and feel, for example?

You know that is so true, and I can't figure out exactly why. Maybe it's cause they weren't trying so hard to look futuristic, but The Wrath of Khan and The Undiscovered Country really don't look dated at all.

 

[24thcenstfan]

I was watching "Encounter at Farpoint" again the other night and thinking the same about the "80s" thing. However, I thought there was a major change in style from the start of the series to the Finale. Everything from uniforms to hair styles. Not sure if this was just a natural progression of costume/style change or because the show was taking more style cues from modern styles of the early 1990s. Either way, the series seemed less and less dated to me as the series progressed.

 

[Squiggy]

We'll probably find that, despite being absolute rubbish, that Enterprise will date the least of the modern Treks, on the basis of modern TV production values.

I'm sure people thought the same of TNG 20 years ago. ENT will show it's age as well. You'll notice some "that's cheesy" thoughts in about 5 years.

Remember, Broken Bow will be a decade old in just a couple of years. Technology and production techniques will pass Enterprise by like every other show.

 

[ALF]

It was all about excess, and I think it's pretty fitting that the 80s gave us among the largest ships of all Trek, like the Romulan Warbird and the Borg Cube. Even the Enterprise-D is the largest Starfleet vessel we've ever had

I really like this point, because it's a very unique thing to point out as the 80s is remembered for its theme of excess. And we never did see a larger starfleet ship than the Galaxy class. Why would they stop there? It certainly seems, in the canon we've been given (including glimpses of the "future") that the Galaxy design was to become wildly successful.

Anyway... as for Tasha Yar being "butch", I think it's a oversimplification. Tasha was very feminine at times. Tasha had some contradictory moments though. She only lasted one season. I think it takes a hetreosexual male with limited exposure to gays/lesbians to exclaim that a women is butch just because she has short hair. And is a securtity officer. Let's not forget that she took advantage of Data's full functionality!

On the other hand, if Picard had held a gay pride parade, I wonder if he wouldn't have assigned Tasha (under protest) to carry the rainbow flag at the front.

I agree with another poster's assessment of Wrath of Kahn and Undiscovered. Those films don't look very 'dated'. I don't use the term dated as a criticism at all, simply put I find it enjoyable to see a TV or movie and based on the production values guess when it was released. Usually I can get it down to 5 years or so, provided it was made after 1950!

I'm sure most of you TrekBBS'ers could do the same.

 

[Cyke101]

I've never understood this whole concept of labeling something as "dated".

TNG was a good show then and it is still a good show today.

Lost in Space was a good show, too, but my gosh, does that show look old. It's just a side effect of being made when it was made. Being dated doesn't have to be a crime.

Other properties that I hold in fairly high regard but are quickly (and, imo, justifiably) labeled as "dated":

-old Battlestar Galactica - the hair is fabulous, the sets are cheesy, the drama is campy, but it's good fun nonetheless
-Star Trek: TMP - dull uniform colors, bad color scheme for many interiors, but darn it if the movie didn't further the scale of smart sci-fi
-Space: 1999 - Fluid bell bottoms in space? Seriously? Still, the very concept of the show was frightening and exciting

Tech stuff is always going to age, but some of it still looks good. If the sets/props are well designed and the story is grounded then it seems to age a lot slower. How good does TUC look and feel, for example?

You know that is so true, and I can't figure out exactly why. Maybe it's cause they weren't trying so hard to look futuristic, but The Wrath of Khan and The Undiscovered Country really don't look dated at all.

Agreed. I'm amazed at how those movies hold up in the modern day, and yet we have movies made after TUC with much more complex special effects but a quickly-dated look.

I'd like to think that we have modern culture to thank for that. Pop culture and fashion tend to look to the past for the look, ie 50s motif for 80s fashion and media, the resurgence of the 60s during the late 90s, how elements of the 1970s-1990s seem to return. Compare that to TWOK and TUC, both of which echo older naval traditions and procedures, hardwood panels in the rear of the bridge, and uniforms that don't really look of any futuristic material. That visual aesthetic is successfully reconciled with seemingly anachronistic technology, hardware, and special effects.

 

[Vance]

I'm going to be flamed for this one, but here goes...

I think that what dates TNG the most is how heavy-handed it oozes later 1980s and 1990s political correctness to many problems.

1) There are several episodes where the Enterprise crew have the solution before a problem even presents itself. We see that the 'moral choice' is forced onto a situation before the details of the situation are even analyzed. There's no agonizing over the tough choice, no hesitation, no real discussion with the crew seeking alternatives, it's "here's the right way to do it, because we're right, and we're perfect, look at how enlightened we are". Face it, folks, Q had a point.

2) There are also several episodes that show the Enterprise crew taking the 'moral courage' of doing absolutely nothing when a crisis shows itself. The highroad was to let the apocalypse happen (even condoning outright genocides on more than one occasion) because doing anything might have an unfortunate or messy consequence.

Both 1 & 2 above were very PC and UN-style PC at the time. A lot of lectures (which always fit the same memes, no matter the actual situation), a lot of pontification, but no real tough decisions, and seldom any actual action taking place.

To me it's less the sets and costumes and more the plots and characters, and how things are supposedly resolved from week to week. It made the shows very bland and predictable, because what mattered most 'in universe' - even beyond the confines of a weekly series - that the political status quo be maintained and never ever questioned.