TMP was the best Star Trek picture

[Maurice]

The director and editor shape a lot about the performances, especially in terms of choosing which line read ultimately gets used in a scene. I've edited work where take 3 is subtle and delicate and take 5 is a ham sandwich, depending on what the actor is trying on a given take.

 

[Pauln6]

I must confess ... when his woman gets zapped off the bridge (we can only presume killed), Decker's only annoyed, rather than horrified, or shocked or whatever. Ilia's reaction to getting zapped was spot on, though! Persis totally sells the scene. William Shatner brought back Kirk from the series in a way he gave up on ever after for reasons I can't even begin to guess at. Call it his acting "instincts," maybe, but they were at the expense of Kirk's original persona. But in TMP ... Shatner shines! Leonard Nimoy plays Spock differently, even when he's back to his "old" self. Bones and the 2nd Bananas step right in and deliver as they'd always had. In fact, I like Nichelle's acting in TMP, I think it's some of her best. She's very naturalistic and "real" with it, as opposed to, say, TUC, where she employs this unrelentingly mystical acting. TMP really brings back the original characters, whilst TWoK brought back the spirit of the series, better ... at the expense of characterisation.

The SLV certainly had a bit more dialogue to add some colour to some characters but only a bit.

 

[DonIago]

I must confess ... when his woman gets zapped off the bridge (we can only presume killed), Decker's only annoyed, rather than horrified, or shocked or whatever.

I actually thought Decker's reaction was perfect for someone who's so instantly traumatized by what's happened that he can't even process it other than to lash out at Kirk.

 

[Maurice]

I actually thought Decker's reaction was perfect for someone who's so instantly traumatized by what's happened that he can't even process it other than to lash out at Kirk.

What always bothered me is how quickly Decker goes from shocked and angry to smirking at Kirk's "Now we have them just where they want us," a few minutes later.

 

[cosmic mouse]

Ilia's reaction to getting zapped was spot on, though! Persis totally sells the scene.

She did sell that scene pretty well... in her camp was the fact that she was temporarily flash-blinded by the light used to create the effect during the scene and so probably was a bit disoriented in reality.

 

[jaime]

She did sell that scene pretty well... in her camp was the fact that she was temporarily flash-blinded by the light used to create the effect during the scene and so probably was a bit disoriented in reality.

They shot it twice...I don’t know which version they used.

 

[cosmic mouse]

They shot it twice...I don’t know which version they used.

It probably happened in both takes since she was instructed to keep her eyes wide open for the duration. Not that that diminished her performance in any way.

 

[The Overlord]

I feel like TMP is the kinda of movie only a really hard core Trekie could love, rather something that appeals to general public or Star Trek ans who just find it dull.

 

[jaime]

I feel like TMP is the kinda of movie only a really hard core Trekie could love, rather something that appeals to general public or Star Trek ans who just find it dull.

It also appeals to an SF audience, especially Hard SF, which was pretty much its target audience. Interstellar is another slow paced film, but it’s also a hard SF film of a kind that would never have been made before now, because the effects budget and general level of science understanding would have killed it at the script stage.

 

[Greg Cox]

It also appeals to an SF audience, especially Hard SF, which was pretty much its target audience. .

Gotta disagree that "Hard SF" fans were the target audience. TMP was intended to be a big holiday blockbuster, aimed at general audiences. It may be that TMP ended up having special appeal to Hard SF fans, but Paramount certainly did not spend all those millions of dollars with the idea of targeting Analog readers. They were going after the same mass audiences that had just made Star Wars and Close Encounters box-office hits.

 

[JaxsBrokenHeart]

Its interesting because TMP (with its slower pace, heavy tone, and "space clothes" aesthetic) seems far more like pre-Star Wars science fiction film than a post one. For a movie that was produced because of the popularity of the aforementioned 1977 blockbuster, in hindsight it seems wildly at odds with the elements that made SW such a big deal to audiences.

 

[XCV330]

Its interesting because TMP (with its slower pace, heavy tone, and "space clothes" aesthetic) seems far more like pre-Star Wars science fiction film than a post one. For a movie that was produced because of the popularity of the aforementioned 1977 blockbuster, in hindsight it seems wildly at odds with the elements that made SW such a big deal to audiences.

No one new exactly how to redo the box office magic of Star Wars in that period, not for trying. Every single sci fi movie from that period had SW as it's success story to emulate, but in practice they took some very odd ways to do it. Starcrash: outright wierd ripoff with horrible fx and Christopher Plummer. TMP: I literally use the DVD of this instead of a pill when I am having trouble getting to sleep. It works like clockwork. IT's beautiful, it's slow, it's dull. People like it. I like it, but for other reasons. The Black Hole: Disney's odd retro attempt at their slice of the pie. More exciting than TMP but still with that "Did they realize it's not 1965?" feel to it.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Its interesting because TMP (with its slower pace, heavy tone, and "space clothes" aesthetic) seems far more like pre-Star Wars science fiction film than a post one. For a movie that was produced because of the popularity of the aforementioned 1977 blockbuster, in hindsight it seems wildly at odds with the elements that made SW such a big deal to audiences.

Close Encounters didn't ape Star Wars, either. @Greg Cox said, "and Close Encounters", which had been huge, too.

 

[JaxsBrokenHeart]

Close Encounters didn't ape Star Wars, either. @Greg Cox said, "and Close Encounters", which had been huge, too.

True, but even Close Encounters was an easier sell given it was contemporary time and setting and didn't even have the luxury of aping Star Wars given they were being made at the same time.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

True, but even Close Encounters was an easier sell given it was contemporary time and setting and didn't even have the luxury of aping Star Wars given they were being made at the same time.

Point was, there was more than one mold that had proven to have block buster potential.

 

[Greg Cox]

Close Encounters didn't ape Star Wars, either. @Greg Cox said, "and Close Encounters", which had been huge, too.

Honestly, I can see a lot more Close Encounters than Star Wars in TMP. Both are showcases for Douglas Trumbull's eye-popping SFX. People complain now about the long Enterprise and V'gr flybys in TMP, but compare them to the finale of Close Encounters, which is basically several minutes of people gawking at a spectacular SFX light show. Given the success of Close Encounters, Paramount can perhaps be forgiven for thinking that what audiences really wanted back in 1979 was to be blown away by eye-popping SFX, preferably in 70MM.

 

[JaxsBrokenHeart]

I think Close Encounters had the benefit of Spielberg's warmth and sense of young wonder coming through all over the film. TMP leaving some of the audience cold as much as it did was a hard inference to predict in all fairness.

 

[The Overlord]

It also appeals to an SF audience, especially Hard SF, which was pretty much its target audience. Interstellar is another slow paced film, but it’s also a hard SF film of a kind that would never have been made before now, because the effects budget and general level of science understanding would have killed it at the script stage.

It still has some pretty big flaws though, this video is pretty good at pointing them out:

http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/film1.php

And really the plot feels like a TV episode plot, rather then a cinematic movie plot, it only feels cinematic due to the higher budget.

 

[DonIago]

(insert obligatory joke about "Where Nomad Has Gone Before")

 

[jaime]

Gotta disagree that "Hard SF" fans were the target audience. TMP was intended to be a big holiday blockbuster, aimed at general audiences. It may be that TMP ended up having special appeal to Hard SF fans, but Paramount certainly did not spend all those millions of dollars with the idea of targeting Analog readers. They were going after the same mass audiences that had just made Star Wars and Close Encounters box-office hits.

Was it Asimov who was tagged to put on the credits? The making of shows them chasing the SF crowd,even with bringing on some of the FX folk they did. I don’t think back then that they even saw a huge division between ‘SF’ audience and ‘mass audience’ there seems to have been more a sudden thought at the studio that maybe the SF audience was bigger, or at least made more return visits to the cinema, than they thought.